NBA Thread 2013-2014

[Balta1701]

I will just say that, for all the non-excitement that they create, the Spurs seem to be the team the Bulls are modeling themselves after. What they need to do is, rather than extending late 20s picks that you've developed who will come off the bench for 2-3 years before finally getting a chance to start, trade it for an asset that you need and value highly and plug it into your lineup. Imagining the Spurs right now with Kawhi Leonard is silly, and they got it because they traded a former 26th pick for him.

 

The Bulls need to find creativity like that. Perhaps that player is Butler in a year or two. Perhaps it's Teague, maybe they can get something out of Gibson still. Maybe they don't.

One thing worth thinking about, the Bulls have a surprisingly good record out of their draft picks over the last decade, not even counting Rose. They have one notable, awful bust of a trade, and one middle-of-the-first round guy who didn't pan out to much, but they have pulled off a lot of value out of the late lottery, latter part of the first round, and the 2nd round.

[thxfrthmmrs]

I will just say that, for all the non-excitement that they create, the Spurs seem to be the team the Bulls are modeling themselves after. What they need to do is, rather than extending late 20s picks that you've developed who will come off the bench for 2-3 years before finally getting a chance to start, trade it for an asset that you need and value highly and plug it into your lineup. Imagining the Spurs right now with Kawhi Leonard is silly, and they got it because they traded a former 26th pick for him.

 

The Bulls need to find creativity like that. Perhaps that player is Butler in a year or two. Perhaps it's Teague, maybe they can get something out of Gibson still. Maybe they don't.

 

Except Thibs run his players out in the court till they bleed out. And Pops has become the most conservation coach in the game in managing player mileage.

 

Most people wouldn't have a problem with resigning Deng to a fair contract if he's healthy and he can play for another 3-4 years at an all star level. But the fact that his wrist is still irritating him to the point he's shooting a career worst the past two years, and all the minutes he's played in the past three years will eventually add up. Deng wasn't even known as an iron man to begin with.

 

Deng can still be valuable defensively, but he will slow down a lot sooner than later with all the workload, and he will not be a reliable offensive option with the way he's shooting the ball.

[Jenksismyhero]

One thing worth thinking about, the Bulls have a surprisingly good record out of their draft picks over the last decade, not even counting Rose. They have one notable, awful bust of a trade, and one middle-of-the-first round guy who didn't pan out to much, but they have pulled off a lot of value out of the late lottery, latter part of the first round, and the 2nd round.

 

Eh, how do you define good? Outside of the lottery, Butler and Taj are your only good picks late.

 

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2013 NBA 1 20 Tony Snell

2013 NBA 2 49 Erik Murphy

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2012 NBA 1 29 Marquis Teague

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2011 NBA 1 28 Norris Cole

2011 NBA 1 30 Jimmy Butler

2011 NBA 2 43 Malcolm Lee

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2010 NBA 1 17 Kevin Seraphin

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2009 NBA 1 16 James Johnson

2009 NBA 1 26 Taj Gibson

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2008 NBA 1 1 Derrick Rose

2008 NBA 2 39 Sonny Weems

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2007 NBA 1 9 Joakim Noah

2007 NBA 2 49 Aaron Gray

2007 NBA 2 51 JamesOn Curry

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2006 NBA 1 2 LaMarcus Aldridge

2006 NBA 1 16 Rodney Carney

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2004 NBA 1 3 Ben Gordon

2004 NBA 2 31 Jackson Vroman

2004 NBA 2 38 Chris Duhon

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2003 NBA 1 7 Kirk Hinrich

2003 NBA 2 36 Mario Austin

2003 NBA 2 45 Matt Bonner

2003 NBA 2 53 Tommy Smith

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2002 NBA 1 2 Jay Williams

2002 NBA 2 30 Roger Mason

2002 NBA 2 43 Lonny Baxter

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2001 NBA 1 4 Eddy Curry

2001 NBA 2 29 Trenton Hassell

2001 NBA 2 44 Sean Lampley

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2000 NBA 1 4 Marcus Fizer

2000 NBA 1 7 Chris Mihm

2000 NBA 1 24 Dalibor Bagaric

[Kyyle23]

ugh, when you lay it out like that Jenks, it looks like crap

[chw42]

Eh, how do you define good? Outside of the lottery, Butler and Taj are your only good picks late.

 

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2013 NBA 1 20 Tony Snell

2013 NBA 2 49 Erik Murphy

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2012 NBA 1 29 Marquis Teague

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2011 NBA 1 28 Norris Cole

2011 NBA 1 30 Jimmy Butler

2011 NBA 2 43 Malcolm Lee

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2010 NBA 1 17 Kevin Seraphin

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2009 NBA 1 16 James Johnson

2009 NBA 1 26 Taj Gibson

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2008 NBA 1 1 Derrick Rose

2008 NBA 2 39 Sonny Weems

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2007 NBA 1 9 Joakim Noah

2007 NBA 2 49 Aaron Gray

2007 NBA 2 51 JamesOn Curry

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2006 NBA 1 2 LaMarcus Aldridge

2006 NBA 1 16 Rodney Carney

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2004 NBA 1 3 Ben Gordon

2004 NBA 2 31 Jackson Vroman

2004 NBA 2 38 Chris Duhon

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2003 NBA 1 7 Kirk Hinrich

2003 NBA 2 36 Mario Austin

2003 NBA 2 45 Matt Bonner

2003 NBA 2 53 Tommy Smith

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2002 NBA 1 2 Jay Williams

2002 NBA 2 30 Roger Mason

2002 NBA 2 43 Lonny Baxter

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2001 NBA 1 4 Eddy Curry

2001 NBA 2 29 Trenton Hassell

2001 NBA 2 44 Sean Lampley

 

Year Lg Rd Pk Player

2000 NBA 1 4 Marcus Fizer

2000 NBA 1 7 Chris Mihm

2000 NBA 1 24 Dalibor Bagaric

 

Holy s*** that's bad.

 

[Jenksismyhero]

Except Thibs run his players out in the court till they bleed out. And Pops has become the most conservation coach in the game in managing player mileage.

 

Most people wouldn't have a problem with resigning Deng to a fair contract if he's healthy and he can play for another 3-4 years at an all star level. But the fact that his wrist is still irritating him to the point he's shooting a career worst the past two years, and all the minutes he's played in the past three years will eventually add up. Deng wasn't even known as an iron man to begin with.

 

Deng can still be valuable defensively, but he will slow down a lot sooner than later with all the workload, and he will not be a reliable offensive option with the way he's shooting the ball.

 

What's funny is that if you look at the first 6-7 years in the league for Duncan (4 years of college) and Deng (one year), Duncan actually has more of a workload, and one year averaged 40.6 mpg, 1.4 minutes more than Deng's career high. It's like people forget Duncan is 37 and that's why the last few seasons his minutes have trailed off.

 

Deng:

 

Regular season[edit]

Year Team GP GS MPG FG% 3P% FT% RPG APG SPG BPG PPG

2004–05 Chicago 61 45 27.3 .434 .265 .741 5.3 2.2 .8 .4 11.7

2005–06 Chicago 78 56 33.4 .463 .269 .750 6.6 1.9 .9 .6 14.3

2006–07 Chicago 82 82 37.5 .517 .143 .777 7.1 2.5 1.2 .6 18.8

2007–08 Chicago 63 59 33.8 .479 .364 .770 6.3 2.5 .9 .5 17.0

2008–09 Chicago 49 46 34.0 .448 .400 .796 6.0 1.9 1.2 .5 14.1

2009–10 Chicago 70 69 37.9 .466 .386 .764 7.3 2.0 .9 .9 17.6

2010–11 Chicago 82 82 39.1 .460 .345 .750 5.8 2.8 1.0 .6 17.4

2011–12 Chicago 54 54 39.2 .412 .367 .770 6.5 2.9 1.0 .7 15.3

2012–13 Chicago 75 75 38.7

 

Duncan:

Regular season[edit]

Year Team GP GS MPG FG% 3P% FT% RPG APG SPG BPG PPG

1997–98 San Antonio 82 82 39.1 .549 .000 .662 11.9 2.7 .7 2.5 21.1

1998–99† San Antonio 50 50 39.3 .495 .143 .690 11.4 2.4 .9 2.5 21.7

1999–00 San Antonio 74 74 38.9 .490 .091 .761 12.4 3.2 .9 2.2 23.2

2000–01 San Antonio 82 82 38.7 .499 .259 .618 12.2 3.0 .9 2.3 22.2

2001–02 San Antonio 82 82 40.6 .508 .100 .799 12.7 3.7 .7 2.5 25.5

2002–03† San Antonio 81 81 39.3 .513 .273 .710 12.9 3.9 .7 2.9 23.3

2003–04 San Antonio 69 68 36.6 .501 .167 .599 12.4 3.1 .9 2.7 22.3

2004–05† San Antonio 66 66 33.4 .496 .333 .670 11.1 2.7 .7 2.6 20.3

2005–06 San Antonio 80 80 34.8 .484 .400 .629 11.0 3.2 .9 2.0 18.6

2006–07† San Antonio 80 80 34.1 .546 .111 .637 10.6 3.4 .8 2.4 20.0

2007–08 San Antonio 78 78 34.0 .497 .000 .730 11.3 2.8 .7 1.9 19.3

2008–09 San Antonio 75 75 33.6 .504 .000 .692 10.7 3.5 .5 1.7 19.3

2009–10 San Antonio 78 77 31.3 .519 .182 .725 10.1 3.2 .6 1.5 17.9

2010–11 San Antonio 76 76 28.3 .500 .000 .716 8.9 2.7 .7 1.9 13.4

2011–12 San Antonio 58 58 28.2 .492 .000 .695 9.0 2.3 .7 1.5 15.4

2012–13 San Antonio 69 69 30.1

 

[Balta1701]

Eh, how do you define good? Outside of the lottery, Butler and Taj are your only good picks late.

We'll obviously see what Snell and Teague turn into, but Butler, Taj, Noah, Gray, Gordon, Deng, Duhon, Hinrich have all made contributions, and that's skipping the #1 pick. About the only guy from that list who hasn't out-performed their draft slot is Gordon because he was a high pick.

 

The busts are Johnson and obviously Thomas.

 

That list also really doesn't reflect reality, since the Bulls traded for Deng, traded away Seraphim to the Wizards to clear cap space for the 2010 free agent fest, traded away the rights to Bonner, etc.

 

And I said "Last decade" for a reason, the people making the choices changed right around then.

[Swingandalongonetoleft]

I will just say that, for all the non-excitement that they create, the Spurs seem to be the team the Bulls are modeling themselves after.

 

I'm good with that. It's a solid plan as long as they're able to make their free throws in the closing moments of a potential NBA Finals clinching game.

[Boogua]

We'll obviously see what Snell and Teague turn into, but Butler, Taj, Noah, Gray, Gordon, Deng, Duhon, Hinrich have all made contributions, and that's skipping the #1 pick. About the only guy from that list who hasn't out-performed their draft slot is Gordon because he was a high pick.

 

The busts are Johnson and obviously Thomas.

 

That list also really doesn't reflect reality, since the Bulls traded for Deng, traded away Seraphim to the Wizards to clear cap space for the 2010 free agent fest, traded away the rights to Bonner, etc.

 

And I said "Last decade" for a reason, the people making the choices changed right around then.

Thabo turned out to be very solid too (I think we traded Carney for him)

[thxfrthmmrs]

What's funny is that if you look at the first 6-7 years in the league for Duncan (4 years of college) and Deng (one year), Duncan actually has more of a workload, and one year averaged 40.6 mpg, 1.4 minutes more than Deng's career high. It's like people forget Duncan is 37 and that's why the last few seasons his minutes have trailed off.

 

Deng:

 

 

 

Duncan:

 

 

You can tell it was philosophy change. Starting from the 04-05 season, Duncan and Parker's top MPG was around 34 minutes per game, and Manu tops at around 30-31 a game, but usually under 30 per game. There are also notorious about sitting out their stars and throwing the game away. At that point Duncan was only 28, Parker 22, and Manu was 27. Granted, Pops never played Parker and Manu high minutes to begin with.

 

So yes, over the past decade or so, the Spurs have been very careful in preserving their player's health.

 

Thibs has been burned for playing his players too much, even in garbage time situation, while Pops has been fined for sitting his players, total opposite styles.

[Balta1701]

You can tell it was philosophy change. Starting from the 04-05 season, Duncan and Parker's top MPG was around 34 minutes per game, and Manu tops at around 30-31 a game, but usually under 30 per game. There are also notorious about sitting out their stars and throwing the game away. At that point Duncan was only 28, Parker 22, and Manu was 27. Granted, Pops never played Parker and Manu high minutes to begin with.

 

So yes, over the past decade or so, the Spurs have been very careful in preserving their player's health.

 

Thibs has been burned for playing his players too much, even in garbage time situation, while Pops has been fined for sitting his players, total opposite styles.

Worth noting is that it took until Pops's star was quite a bit older and until he'd been coaching a long time and won titles, basically guaranteeting his jobs safety, until he started doing that.

[Jordan4life_2007]

Nets ink AK47. 1/3.1

[ZoomSlowik]

Nets ink AK47. 1/3.1

 

Ouch. That's a bargain and a nice combo forward to spell KG and Pierce and provide a little injury insurance.

 

Brilliant move by him to turn down $10 million this year.

[Dick Allen]

If the Heat win again next year, wouldn't that lessen the chance of Lebron moving on? He couldn't leave a team going for 4 in a row could he?

[Buehrle>Wood]

Ouch. That's a bargain and a nice combo forward to spell KG and Pierce and provide a little injury insurance.

 

Brilliant move by him to turn down $10 million this year.

His signing bonus was having prokhorov not kill his family. Right decision.

[ZoomSlowik]

If the Heat win again next year, wouldn't that lessen the chance of Lebron moving on? He couldn't leave a team going for 4 in a row could he?

 

Probably not, but I'm going to take a lesson from Steve in 2010 and not speak in absolutes.

[Quin]

Ouch. That's a bargain and a nice combo forward to spell KG and Pierce and provide a little injury insurance.

 

Brilliant move by him to turn down $10 million this year.

 

Russian Mob makes you do that.

 

Also, if you took Bulls draft picks (as in players the Bulls took out of the draft, not picked in their exact slot) since 2000, here's a roster you could have of active players.

 

PG: Rose/Hinrich/Duhon

SG: Butler/Gordon/Thabo

SF: Deng/Snell or Artest/Johnson

PF: Gibson/Thomas/Murphy or Mirotic

C : Noah/Chandler/Asik

 

Oh no the humanity! You probably can't find a team better constructed off of their own draft picks. Jesus Christ. Maybe the Cavs since they lucked into both LeBron and Kyrie.

 

 

[Quin]

Also, I'm actually in favor of trying to get Melo if you couldn't get Love.

[Jordan4life_2007]

Also, I'm actually in favor of trying to get Melo if you couldn't get Love.

 

But you see, Melo wouldn't make us the favorite. 2000 Shaq? That makes us the favorite. If anything, LeBron can only cover one of Rose/Melo. Because he owns both.

[Boogua]

But you see, Melo wouldn't make us the favorite. 2000 Shaq? That makes us the favorite. If anything, LeBron can only cover one of Rose/Melo. Because he owns both.

Yeah, the Heat do give Rose a lot of problems with their collapsing D, but hopefully Butler can help with that. He seems like a much better scorer than Bogans was.

Edited July 12, 2013 by Boogua

[Balta1701]

If the Heat win again next year, wouldn't that lessen the chance of Lebron moving on? He couldn't leave a team going for 4 in a row could he?

Seriously, with him, who the heck knows.

[Jordan4life_2007]

Yeah, the Heat do give Rose a lot of problems with their collapsing D, but hopefully Butler can help with that. He seems like a much better scorer than Bogans was.

 

No, LeBron's freakish size and athleticism gives Rose a lot of problems. Rose already testified to this. You searching youtube for one or 2 instances in which Rose got by LeBron means nothing. Overall, LeBron is Rose's daddy.

[Balta1701]

No, LeBron's freakish size and athleticism gives Rose a lot of problems. Rose already testified to this. You searching youtube for one or 2 instances in which Rose got by LeBron means nothing. Overall, LeBron is Rose's daddy.

He's right though, the way to beat that is on the wings. If Lebron drops onto Rose, then anything Miami has remotely resembling size gets pushed into the lane. If you have guys on the outside who can move a little bit with the ball and make a shot, then Lebron taking Rose on the drive becomes a solid scoring opportunity. Rose can pass the ball out of that to someone on the outside with a lot of space to maneuver.

 

In the 2011 playoff series, the guy who should have been able to take advantage was Korver but his shooting was a disaster. That left guys like Bogans and Brewer as the guy the Heat left open on the outside, and they were ok with that.

[SoxAce]

If the Heat win again next year, wouldn't that lessen the chance of Lebron moving on? He couldn't leave a team going for 4 in a row could he?

 

I could easily see him going back to Cleveland, especially now that they have great young pieces in place. He did promise them an NBA championship. He would still fulfill that promise.

[Boogua]

No, LeBron's freakish size and athleticism gives Rose a lot of problems. Rose already testified to this. You searching youtube for one or 2 instances in which Rose got by LeBron means nothing. Overall, LeBron is Rose's daddy.

Means nothing? To you, yes, because you take evidence with a grain of salt and rely on what you think is right. I'll stick to my video evidence and you can stick to a quote.

 

And it's not like I'm calling Lebron a bad defender or something. I'm just saying that people thinking he shut down Rose by himself are way, way off.

Edited July 12, 2013 by Boogua