southsider2k5 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 09:20 AM) Apparently Deng's camp wanted $15M+ per year. Looking around the NBA, there is no reason he shouldn't get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 09:20 AM) Apparently Deng's camp wanted $15M+ per year. Yeah no thanks. Deng should get a chance to compete for a title and the Bulls arent it for awhile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (RockRaines @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:21 AM) Yeah no thanks. Deng should get a chance to compete for a title and the Bulls arent it for awhile. If the Bulls could clear Noah or Gibson off in exchange for an expiring, perhaps even while adding a draft pick somewhere, and put themselves in a position to offer a max deal while also signing Mirotic this offseason, and they hired our lord and savior Jesus Christ as their athletic trainer and had him rub DRose's knees up after every game, that "a while" could turn around really fast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 This could be the year the Bulls get Charlottes pick as well. http://www.csnchicago.com/bulls/bulls-may-...irst-round-pick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 The max deal guys are LeBron, Wade, Bosh, Amare, Melo...who else? What are the chances the Bulls land any of them, and except for LeBron, which one makes them championship material if they land him? Maybe Melo. But if you have to get rid of Noah to get Melo, I don't think that team is a crown waiting to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 09:35 AM) The max deal guys are LeBron, Wade, Bosh, Amare, Melo...who else? What are the chances the Bulls land any of them, and except for LeBron, which one makes them championship material if they land him? Maybe Melo. But if you have to get rid of Noah to get Melo, I don't think that team is a crown waiting to happen. I know you are arguing just to argue, again, but what about this group screams keep it together? Is it a crown waiting to happen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:35 AM) The max deal guys are LeBron, Wade, Bosh, Amare, Melo...who else? What are the chances the Bulls land any of them, and except for LeBron, which one makes them championship material if they land him? Maybe Melo. But if you have to get rid of Noah to get Melo, I don't think that team is a crown waiting to happen. If the Bulls were to, hypothetically, add Mirotic and trade one of Gibson and Noah, then have 2 picks somewhere around #10 which could plausibly both be spent on big men (that's right in the range where Vonleh would be projected if he came out), and add Melo, and again hire Jesus as their athletic trainer, they could be sporting a lineup of Butler/Rose/NoahorGibsonplusdraftpicks/Melo/Mirotic with decent depth at several positions counting guys like Snell and a little bit of excess money to go after backups. That team could darn well be a crown waiting to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 09:38 AM) I know you are arguing just to argue, again, but what about this group screams keep it together? Is it a crown waiting to happen? I love this new "arguing to argue" a couple of guys are giving me now when, of course, they are arguing against me. I already stated this Deng move was IMO the correct move. The point is, there really isn't a max contract realistic target out there right now. Trading Noah or Gibson to get enough to offer a max contract this coming offseason doesn't make things better, it will make things worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:55 AM) I love this new "arguing to argue" a couple of guys are giving me now when, of course, they are arguing against me. I already stated this Deng move was IMO the correct move. The point is, there really isn't a max contract realistic target out there right now. Trading Noah or Gibson to get enough to offer a max contract this coming offseason doesn't make things better, it will make things worse. How are "Melo and Lebron" not realistic targets when Melo has already dropped the Bulls name personally? Yeah it could just be leverage, yeah they could strike out and have to sign someone lesser like Luol Deng, but both Gibson and Noah are perfect fits for any team wanting to win now and a poor fit for a team that needs to see what happens in the draft first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:01 AM) How are "Melo and Lebron" not realistic targets when Melo has already dropped the Bulls name personally? Yeah it could just be leverage, yeah they could strike out and have to sign someone lesser like Luol Deng, but both Gibson and Noah are perfect fits for any team wanting to win now and a poor fit for a team that needs to see what happens in the draft first. Didn't Kobe drop the Bulls name before? Keep Gibson and Noah, if Melo is serious, one could be included in a sign and trade, but Melo on the Bulls is slim to none. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowand44 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 09:26 AM) If the Bulls could clear Noah or Gibson off in exchange for an expiring, perhaps even while adding a draft pick somewhere, and put themselves in a position to offer a max deal while also signing Mirotic this offseason, and they hired our lord and savior Jesus Christ as their athletic trainer and had him rub DRose's knees up after every game, that "a while" could turn around really fast. It's the NBA, a while is one draft pick away especially if Derrick isn't completely broken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:04 AM) Didn't Kobe drop the Bulls name before? Keep Gibson and Noah, if Melo is serious, one could be included in a sign and trade, but Melo on the Bulls is slim to none. If only Kevin Love was a FA this off-season. He would have made a ton of sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Jan 6, 2014 -> 10:06 PM) This is a great trade. We got no worthwhile picks and saved some money this year. I realize the tankers are going to like it and if we end up with a great pick (by virtue of making the lottery), I suppose it works. But we clear Deng's money irregardless at year end and it is likely that we are getting 3 2nd round picks (plus the right to swap non-lottery picks with the Cavs in 2015). I'd have to think we could have at least gotten a legitimate future 1st for Deng. At this point, if we are truly tanking, we might as well amnesty boozer now. Is Noah going to get dealt? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (chw42 @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:09 AM) If only Kevin Love was a FA this off-season. He would have made a ton of sense. If only Derrick Rose would get out and recruit a little bit... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 09:55 AM) I love this new "arguing to argue" a couple of guys are giving me now when, of course, they are arguing against me. I already stated this Deng move was IMO the correct move. The point is, there really isn't a max contract realistic target out there right now. Trading Noah or Gibson to get enough to offer a max contract this coming offseason doesn't make things better, it will make things worse. They are winning a crown? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:10 AM) We got no worthwhile picks and saved some money this year. I realize the tankers are going to like it and if we end up with a great pick (by virtue of making the lottery), I suppose it works. But we clear Deng's money irregardless at year end and it is likely that we are getting 3 2nd round picks (plus the right to swap non-lottery picks with the Cavs in 2015). I'd have to think we could have at least gotten a legitimate future 1st for Deng. At this point, if we are truly tanking, we might as well amnesty boozer now. Is Noah going to get dealt? I'd be fine with all of that. Load up on 2014 picks, bring Rose back, and try to get Mirotic over. Really they should have done this last with Rose hurt, but it is time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 Mirotic isn't going to be cheap to bring over. He's pulling in about $5 million a year converted, and Real Madrid wants to sign him to an extension. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZoomSlowik Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 (edited) QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 09:47 AM) If the Bulls were to, hypothetically, add Mirotic and trade one of Gibson and Noah, then have 2 picks somewhere around #10 which could plausibly both be spent on big men (that's right in the range where Vonleh would be projected if he came out), and add Melo, and again hire Jesus as their athletic trainer, they could be sporting a lineup of Butler/Rose/NoahorGibsonplusdraftpicks/Melo/Mirotic with decent depth at several positions counting guys like Snell and a little bit of excess money to go after backups. That team could darn well be a crown waiting to happen. Unless Mirotic is Dirk basically right away, it's going to be several years before that team is any kind of threat. Trading Noah and/or Gibson seriously hurts the defense, which is reason 1 or 1A why this team has been good of late. It also usually takes draft picks at least a couple of years to be real impact players, especially big men outside the top-5. Finally, the depth isn't exactly stellar. You'd basically have Snell and two draft picks as your role players, with one of them potentially having to start. You wouldn't have the MLE the first year in this scenario since you used cap space to get Melo. Even this year's team had 8 decent options before injuries hit. They're not in a horrible spot right now, depending on Rose's health of course. They have a championship level defense, a top Euro prospect and potentially two relatively high draft picks coming. If they do nothing, they could have an Indiana-type roster even if they miss on a pick or signing. That margain for error disappears if they start dumping their few productive players. It'd be one thing if they could get someone like Love or Durant in a few years that's excellent and still fairly young. But Melo isn't quite on that tier and is about to turn 30. He'll also cost significantly more. Edited January 7, 2014 by ZoomSlowik Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowand44 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:10 AM) We got no worthwhile picks and saved some money this year. I realize the tankers are going to like it and if we end up with a great pick (by virtue of making the lottery), I suppose it works. But we clear Deng's money irregardless at year end and it is likely that we are getting 3 2nd round picks (plus the right to swap non-lottery picks with the Cavs in 2015). I'd have to think we could have at least gotten a legitimate future 1st for Deng. At this point, if we are truly tanking, we might as well amnesty boozer now. Is Noah going to get dealt? You would have to assume they went through all their offers and this one made the most sense. Hanging on to Lu just makes no sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 (edited) QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:17 AM) They are winning a crown? They could be part of winning one. You trade those guys and fail on your attempt to land a star, like what happened when they had to settle for Boozer, what do you have? NBA hell, and now you need a few big men. Draft picks are nice. Sometimes great, sometimes Marcus Fizer or Stacey King. Trading Noah or Gibson just to get more under the cap isn't doing your team a favor unless getting that far under actually gets you something, not the chance of doing something. If you think Melo or LeBron becoming Bulls is realistic, it makes sense, but I don't. I'm sure the Knicks would love to have Noah or Gibson and Butler if Melo was leaving them. So keep them until you are sure you are getting replacements. If Rose is anywhere near healthy, it isn't like this team is going to be horrible. They would be in NBA hell regardless. Edited January 7, 2014 by Dick Allen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZoomSlowik Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:01 AM) How are "Melo and Lebron" not realistic targets when Melo has already dropped the Bulls name personally? Yeah it could just be leverage, yeah they could strike out and have to sign someone lesser like Luol Deng, but both Gibson and Noah are perfect fits for any team wanting to win now and a poor fit for a team that needs to see what happens in the draft first. How is having productive players on reasonable deals (slightly less so for Taj, though he's probably going to be starting soon) a poor fit for a team that's still trying to win? The odds of finding big men better than those two around pick #10 aren't terribly high, especially over the first couple of years of their career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:25 AM) They could be part of winning one. You trade those guys and fail on your attempt to land a star, like what happened when they had to settle for Boozer, what do you have? NBA hell, and now you need a few big men. Draft picks are nice. Sometimes great, sometimes Marcus Fizer or Stacey King. Which means you still need to free up space to get the guys you want. Common sense pretty clearly shows that this group was in NBA hell. Not only were they going to be in luxury tax jail, they weren't going to win anything. The worst possible thing would be to keep this group together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:28 AM) Which means you still need to free up space to get the guys you want. Common sense pretty clearly shows that this group was in NBA hell. Not only were they going to be in luxury tax jail, they weren't going to win anything. The worst possible thing would be to keep this group together. Deng and Boozer will be gone. Rose, Noah, Butler hopefully Morotic, Gibson are who they should build with. You dump Noah or Gibson now and don't land the star, you still will be looking for a star and a Noah or Gibson replacement. These 2 aren't terrific stars but are definitely guys that help you win. Replacing that would be tough. As stated, you still could use them in sign and trades, which would offer you some protection in case you fail to land the star. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:34 AM) Deng and Boozer will be gone. Rose, Noah, Butler hopefully Morotic, Gibson are who they should build with. You dump Noah or Gibson now and don't land the star, you still will be looking for a star and a Noah or Gibson replacement. These 2 aren't terrific stars but are definitely guys that help you win. Replacing that would be tough. As stated, you still could use them in sign and trades, which would offer you some protection in case you fail to land the star. Who are you getting in sign and trades that improve the team to the point where they can win as is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 (edited) QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:44 AM) Who are you getting in sign and trades that improve the team to the point where they can win as is? Again, one of the max guys, which would be probably Melo as LeBron isn't coming to the Bulls. I don't think Melo is either, but to trade Noah or Gibson for a draft pick now to make room for a theoretical max guy is putting your franchise out on a limb. If Melo stays in NY or goes to LA, you just made your team worse, but not bad enough to improve your draft status all that much. It's pretty funny who the one doing the arguing just to argue really is. Why don't I ask the question. If the Bulls trade Noah, what should they receive and who are they going to sign in the future with the extra cap space? . Edited January 7, 2014 by Dick Allen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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