Your Realistic 2014 Lineup

[The Ultimate Champion]

No doubt both of you guys are right, but the key point is we can now enter the 2014 season with a lineup full of talented 22 to 27 year olds, six months ago this wasn't the case. Even if some of the young guys flop, we'll still be in much better shape for 2015 & forward.

Hahn's moving 100% in the appropriate direction. This is exactly what he needs to be doing.

 

I'm just saying, and I've said this about Kenny all along as I've defended him as a very good GM, that you can't judge everything in hindsight. Hahn's making moves now that are 100% sensible and apparently based on good information. He's doing exactly what a quality GM is supposed to do in this type of situation. But some of these moves aren't going to work out & when they don't it's important for people to remember that it's the nature of the game and the nature of prospects in general, and it's not because Hahn has some major flaw somewhere.

[BigHurt3515]

Just imagine if Hawkins, Anderson, and Micah Johnson ban out. Hope they all have great years. Johnson could end up being the most interesting one with his speed

[BigHurt3515]

And Carlos Sanchez. We might have a lot of trade chips soon

[2nd_city_saint787]

Still a lot of good LH relievers out there.

 

One of Eric O'Flaherty, Jose Mijares, J.P. Howell, or Scott Downs, in that order would be great additions

[BigHurt3515]

Still a lot of good LH relievers out there.

 

One of Eric O'Flaherty, Jose Mijares, J.P. Howell, or Scott Downs, in that order would be great additions

 

I think Howell just signed with the Dodgers.

[LittleHurt05]

I think Howell just signed with the Dodgers.

 

 

 

 

Yup. 2 years, $11.5 million

 

 

[Jose Abreu]

Still a lot of good LH relievers out there.

 

One of Eric O'Flaherty, Jose Mijares, J.P. Howell, or Scott Downs, in that order would be great additions

Downs is sort of old. Get me O'Flaherty for 3-4 years and Rick Hahn is a God.

[2nd_city_saint787]

Yup. 2 years, $11.5 million

 

Ahh, MLBTR hasn't updated their list....5.75M for Howell probably means 7-8M a year for O'Flaherty. I think I'd probably do that since he's still young

[SoxAce]

7. Alex Jackson, C (Taken with 3rd pick this year)

 

Highly doubtful Jackson stays at catcher for the foreseeable future.

 

And I still think Hahn should do everything he can to get Yasmani Grandal out of SD. PED's be damned, his pitch recognition + OBP would be an outstanding fit here as a catcher (use him as a #2, #6/7 hitter). Another patient Cuban (if Abreu is as advertised).. just what the doctor ordered. One of the biggest team weaknesses the sox had going into the offseason (OBP) can be seriously addressed.

 

Or.. see if Seattle's GM is still "all in" this year and if he's lost his marbles enough to give us Mike Zunino.

Edited December 17, 2013 by SoxAce

[Quin]

Highly doubtful Jackson stays at catcher for the foreseeable future.

 

And I still think Hahn should do everything he can to get Yasmani Grandal out of SD. PED's be damned, his pitch recognition + OBP would be an outstanding fit here as a catcher (use him as a #2, #6/7 hitter). Another patient Cuban (if Abreu is as advertised).. just what the doctor ordered. One of the biggest team weaknesses the sox had going into the offseason (OBP) can be seriously addressed.

 

Or.. see if Seattle's GM is still "all in" this year and if he's lost his marbles enough to give us Mike Zunino.

 

Problem is, what would it take to get Grandal?

[beautox]

Highly doubtful Jackson stays at catcher for the foreseeable future.

 

And I still think Hahn should do everything he can to get Yasmani Grandal out of SD. PED's be damned, his pitch recognition + OBP would be an outstanding fit here as a catcher (use him as a #2, #6/7 hitter). Another patient Cuban (if Abreu is as advertised).. just what the doctor ordered. One of the biggest team weaknesses the sox had going into the offseason (OBP) can be seriously addressed.

 

Or.. see if Seattle's GM is still "all in" this year and if he's lost his marbles enough to give us Mike Zunino.

 

 

Problem is, what would it take to get Grandal?

 

If Hahn can get Grandal from the padres that would be huge, Hedges should make it to the show later this year and the projections expect Hundley to produce roughly the same WAR as last season. looking at the padres roster and farm it would appear they need MLReady starting pitching, and a solution at 2B/3B shortly. I think Headley fully intends to test the FA market seeing how thin third base is around baseball. Gyorko can slide over to 3B or remain at second depending on what they do. Their farm has a lot of nice arms and Hedges a few older OF bats in the low minors and Jace Peterson a good looking albeit old for his league SS that should be starting AA this year.

 

I would think the sox would have to offer up something like E & M Johnson or Sanchez, flowers or phegley and maybe someone like Barnum. Or prospects the sox acquire by moving De Aza and Beckham.

[caulfield12]

If Hahn can get Grandal from the padres that would be huge, Hedges should make it to the show later this year and the projections expect Hundley to produce roughly the same WAR as last season. looking at the padres roster and farm it would appear they need MLReady starting pitching, and a solution at 2B/3B shortly. I think Headley fully intends to test the FA market seeing how thin third base is around baseball. Gyorko can slide over to 3B or remain at second depending on what they do. Their farm has a lot of nice arms and Hedges a few older OF bats in the low minors and Jace Peterson a good looking albeit old for his league SS that should be starting AA this year.

 

I would think the sox would have to offer up something like E & M Johnson or Sanchez, flowers or phegley and maybe someone like Barnum. Or prospects the sox acquire by moving De Aza and Beckham.

 

You can't afford to trade Johnson since he's most likely your #5 starter and seems to have a much higher upside than Rienzo.

 

Flowers or Phegley won't do anything in terms of sparking an interest, and neither will Micah Johnson or Carlos Sanchez.

 

Trading Barnum coming off a disappointing/injury-plagued year would be silly. In the long-term, you still need big LH bats to replace Dunn, and he's one of the best bets, at least in our system (at the moment).

 

If it was Rienzo, and Semien, you could get it done, but that's going to be considered an overpay by most. However, if you made it Rienzo, M. Johnson/Sanchez and prospects acquired from a DeAza deal, you might have a chance, but taking Semien off the board would probably doom that trade.

Edited December 17, 2013 by caulfield12

[brian310]

If Hahn can get Grandal from the padres that would be huge, Hedges should make it to the show later this year and the projections expect Hundley to produce roughly the same WAR as last season. looking at the padres roster and farm it would appear they need MLReady starting pitching, and a solution at 2B/3B shortly. I think Headley fully intends to test the FA market seeing how thin third base is around baseball. Gyorko can slide over to 3B or remain at second depending on what they do. Their farm has a lot of nice arms and Hedges a few older OF bats in the low minors and Jace Peterson a good looking albeit old for his league SS that should be starting AA this year.

 

I would think the sox would have to offer up something like E & M Johnson or Sanchez, flowers or phegley and maybe someone like Barnum. Or prospects the sox acquire by moving De Aza and Beckham.

 

What about Sanchez, Rienzo, and either one of Thompson and Mitchell for Grandal?

[Eminor3rd]

What about Sanchez, Rienzo, and either one of Thompson and Mitchell for Grandal?

 

Would you accept that deal?

[Balta1701]

Would you accept that deal?

I liked the first 2...then I got to the "either" part.

[brian310]

I liked the first 2...then I got to the "either" part.

 

I kinda just threw them in because the potential is still there, but maybe a switch to another organization and coaching might help. I don't know what kind of realistic deal we can make with them.

[Balta1701]

I kinda just threw them in because the potential is still there, but maybe a switch to another organization and coaching might help. I don't know what kind of realistic deal we can make with them.

The problem is they basically don't have much value at all in a deal for a guy teams would have to pay a price for. They're effectively throw ins. Basically you're saying "Rienzo and Sanchez plus a PTBNL" for Grandal and I have a hard time seeing the Padres accepting that. If you replaced the 3rd guy with someone of value like Semien, then you have a deal that looks like it works.

 

But like I noted in the other thread...Rick Hahn so far has not traded a single person out of his minor league system. He has done the exact opposite, he's traded heavily from his big league team to improve the upper levels of the system. Such a move would int hat light be the exact opposite of what he's been doing so far.

[GreenSox]

Grandal is off a bad injury and PEDs. No reason to pay top dollar for him. It's not really the time yet to ship out prospects anyway. We aren't ready to win yet

[SoxAce]

Padres are currently looking for a good set-up man according to their beat writers. They were discussing it on MLB Network if they're willing to "pay the price" to get one. (trade/FA)

 

Oh, and too bad the Pirates weren't looking to take on salary. (I don't believe) They are trying to get a 1B and Dunn might be perfect for them. (If Hahn can convince them Dunn is an NL player, which he might be)

[brian310]

Padres are currently looking for a good set-up man according to their beat writers. They were discussing it on MLB Network if they're willing to "pay the price" to get one. (trade/FA)

 

Oh, and too bad the Pirates weren't looking to take on salary. (I don't believe) They are trying to get a 1B and Dunn might be perfect for them. (If Hahn can convince them Dunn is an NL player, which he might be)

 

Include Jones in a deal for Grandal? Maybe Grandal and low-level arm for Sanchez Rienzo Jones? And I don't understand why some people are concerned about trading a prospect (Sanchez). We would still getting a young player with team control for what 5 years (?) in an area where our organization is empty.

Edited December 17, 2013 by chisoxfan310

[witesoxfan]

Include Jones in a deal for Grandal? Maybe Grandal and low-level arm for Sanchez Rienzo Jones?

 

No. I don't understand the obsession with Grandal. He is just as unproven as Phegley, Flowers, and Nieto. If you could get him for a song, sure, why not, but otherwise it doesn't make a ton of sense.

 

I just don't see a match with the Padres. They are a more talented team that people realize, but their biggest weakness right now is their starting rotation. The Sox really can't afford to deal another starting pitcher.

[Balta1701]

The Sox really can't afford to deal another starting pitcher.

Worth noting - this might only be true until the end of this season.

[SoxAce]

Just started to be more active on the board again, but good god Blake what the hell has happened to you? Don't understand the obsession? Advocating for John Buck? What is this crap..

[witesoxfan]

Grandal was awful last year, is coming off a significant knee injury, and was named in the Biogenesis case. I'm aware Nieto was too, but he cost $50k, and the Sox can recoup $25k of that if they are not happy with him. With Grandal, they have to trade for him (why the Padres would be motivated to move him now, I have no idea).

 

If they can get him for someone like Petricka or Veal or Santos Rodriguez or whatever, then sure. I would not give up Sanchez or Rienzo or Jones. Maybe Mitchell or Thompson, but San Diego has no need for an outfielder.

 

At the prices you guys are talking about, the Sox are better off going with Phegley (whose minor league career has been zapped by illness, but he was absolutely dominant in AAA last year), Flowers (who, MLB track record aside, can still hit the ball 500 feet), and Nieto (who broke out and played well last year).

 

 

And just to clarify, I'm not advocating the Sox bring in Buck, just that there have been worse players the Sox have brought in.

[Dick Allen]

I agree. Moving prospects for a young controlled piece is not counterproductive for any team if that piece turns into a nice player.

 

 

 

Wite he slashed a .297/.394/.469/.863 in 2012 in 226 PAs. Small sample size but still very nice. He had a .967 OPS away from Petco that year in 112 PAs. Even in an injured/down season in '13 he had .352 OBP.

 

Alonso's Minor League Career - 755 PAs - .310/.408/.487/.895

Phegley's Minor League Career - 1573 PAs - .263/.313/.417/.730

Flower's Minor League Career - 2233 PAs - 275/.391/.484/.876

Nieto's Minor League Career - 1414 PAs - .254/.346/.386/.732

 

The only one who is even remotely close to Alonso's minor league numbers is Flowers and we all know how he has produced over 5 different years in the bigs. Not to mention Alonso was a first round talent and is the only one with any success in the majors. He is much more proven and much more likely to provide at the big league level.

 

3 out of 4 either busted or linked to PEDs.