witesoxfan Posted September 12, 2013 Share Posted September 12, 2013 QUOTE (greg775 @ Sep 12, 2013 -> 02:00 PM) How has Dunn's last 4 weeks affected the "how good he's been the second half?" Hasn't he been gawdawful the last four weeks or so? I do realize without him we probably will have fewest homers in all of baseball next year. Hahn has so much work to do to avoid a repeat of this season. Sometimes things get worse before they get better Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILMOU Posted September 12, 2013 Share Posted September 12, 2013 (edited) QUOTE (Lemon_44 @ Sep 12, 2013 -> 08:32 AM) I know he's been pretty good but I'm changing the whole attitude of the team. I'm not saying he's a problem, I just wouldn't expect any kind of significant return for him. We'd get rid of his salary and replace him younger options that can be part of the future. I don't see any way Dunn is here after his contract is up. This. We need a changing of the guard, even if the "leaders" of the new team aren't on the roster, currently. Also, while I totally love the dude, and look forward to his statue and managerial tenure with the team , I really hope they don't bring back Paulie in any capacity next year. Eeyore version of Paulie just isn't helping in any way. I do want McCann however, but so many other suitors might make it unrealistic. I think he'd help the most , as a high OBP/OPS, LHB, we could put in the 3 hole most games. I also would love to land Abreu, assuming they love what they see at the workouts - he'd be a logical cleanup, I'd hope. It's likely we have a much better chance of landing Abreu, of the two. I still want to add a lefty or SH bat, somewhere, to the mix, regardless of what we're able to do with Dunn. Edited September 12, 2013 by Stan Bahnsen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted September 12, 2013 Share Posted September 12, 2013 QUOTE (Stan Bahnsen @ Sep 12, 2013 -> 02:17 PM) This. We need a changing of the guard, even if the "leaders" of the new team aren't on the roster, currently. Also, while I totally love the dude, and look forward to his statue and managerial tenure with the team , I really hope they don't bring back Paulie in any capacity next year. Eeyore version of Paulie just isn't helping in any way. I do want McCann however, but so many other suitors might make it unrealistic. I think he'd help the most , as a high OBP/OPS, LHB, we could put in the 3 hole most games. I also would love to land Abreu, assuming they love what they see at the workouts - he'd be a logical cleanup, I'd hope. It's likely we have a much better chance of landing Abreu, of the two. I still want to add a lefty or SH bat, somewhere, to the mix, regardless of what we're able to do with Dunn. Haha, Eeyore version. I always use Zombie, but I think I like Eeyore better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILMOU Posted September 12, 2013 Share Posted September 12, 2013 QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Sep 12, 2013 -> 04:00 PM) Haha, Eeyore version. I always use Zombie, but I think I like Eeyore better. Can't claim it, saw it on SSS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGajewski18 Posted September 14, 2013 Share Posted September 14, 2013 How's everyone feel about Saltalamacchia as a potential signing next year? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted September 14, 2013 Share Posted September 14, 2013 QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Sep 14, 2013 -> 02:15 AM) How's everyone feel about Saltalamacchia as a potential signing next year? How bout sending a Class AA pitcher to the Royals for their backup catcher, Kottaris, if we aren't going to sign AJ. He could platoon with Phegs. Kottaris will take a walk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted September 14, 2013 Share Posted September 14, 2013 QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Sep 13, 2013 -> 09:15 PM) How's everyone feel about Saltalamacchia as a potential signing next year? Is there a reason why the Red Sox won't resign him? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickofypres Posted September 14, 2013 Share Posted September 14, 2013 Time to end the Viciedo experiment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lemon_44 Posted September 14, 2013 Share Posted September 14, 2013 QUOTE (whitesox901 @ Sep 14, 2013 -> 12:45 AM) Time to end the Viciedo experiment. Maybe as a LF but I'd like to keep his bat around. Even then, I think there a lot worse problems on the team than him and his play in LF, which has not been good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted September 14, 2013 Share Posted September 14, 2013 QUOTE (Lemon_44 @ Sep 14, 2013 -> 05:42 AM) Maybe as a LF but I'd like to keep his bat around. Even then, I think there a lot worse problems on the team than him and his play in LF, which has not been good. Yeah, I'm in no rush to get rid of a 24 year old with 4 years of team control left that has hit well when healthy this year and has more power potential than anyone on the team not named Adam Dunn. And while his play in LF hasn't been great, at least he is new to the position unlike the rest of these bums. Unless you can get something signicant for him, I think he should be our starting LF in 2014. And no to 1B next year. I think he has to make or break it as an outfielder or at least demonstrate plus offensive numbers before you consider a move to 1B. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted September 14, 2013 Share Posted September 14, 2013 I've gone back and forth on what the best course of action is this winter and as this season draws to an end, I think 2016 is a realistic season to think about contention. I hope there are opportunities to use their money over the next couple of years to take on bad contracts for prospects instead of signing any free-agents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted September 14, 2013 Share Posted September 14, 2013 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Sep 14, 2013 -> 10:03 AM) I hope there are opportunities to use their money over the next couple of years to take on bad contracts for prospects instead of signing any free-agents. Seems like a fool-proof strategy to rebuild this team quickly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted September 14, 2013 Share Posted September 14, 2013 QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Sep 14, 2013 -> 10:11 AM) Seems like a fool-proof strategy to rebuild this team quickly. How did that work in Toronto? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted September 14, 2013 Share Posted September 14, 2013 QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Sep 14, 2013 -> 10:11 AM) Seems like a fool-proof strategy to rebuild this team quickly. You're missing the point. It's to rebuild the team correctly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted September 14, 2013 Share Posted September 14, 2013 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Sep 14, 2013 -> 10:14 AM) How did that work in Toronto? +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted September 14, 2013 Share Posted September 14, 2013 (edited) QUOTE (Marty34 @ Sep 14, 2013 -> 10:22 AM) You're missing the point. It's to rebuild the team correctly. Throwing away our financial flexibility on some B prospects is the correct way to the rebuild the team? Edited September 14, 2013 by Chicago White Sox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted September 14, 2013 Share Posted September 14, 2013 QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Sep 14, 2013 -> 10:29 AM) Throwing away our financial flexibility on some B prospects is the correct way to the rebuild the team? When the alternative is adding to this team from the available free agents, yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2nd_city_saint787 Posted September 14, 2013 Share Posted September 14, 2013 (edited) QUOTE (Marty34 @ Sep 14, 2013 -> 10:03 AM) I've gone back and forth on what the best course of action is this winter and as this season draws to an end, I think 2016 is a realistic season to think about contention. I hope there are opportunities to use their money over the next couple of years to take on bad contracts for prospects instead of signing any free-agents. This, to me, doesn't make any sense. Why are they taking on bad contracts for prospects when they can simply sign free agents and save the prospects? Was this sarcasm? miss worded? To your other post about this being the "proper way" to rebuild, was that sarcasm too? I hope I'm just misunderstanding you because I don't see how trading prospects makes sense for a "rebuilding" team. EDIT- after reading the last 2 posts I see whats going on here, nevermind. I agree with CWS, I don't think you're gonna get good enough prospects back in these sorts of trades....Show me some deals that prove otherwise. And at this point the FA market doesn't look half bad. Edited September 14, 2013 by scs787 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted September 14, 2013 Share Posted September 14, 2013 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Sep 14, 2013 -> 10:33 AM) When the alternative is adding to this team from the available free agents, yes. So B.J. Upton at $15M/per over the next 4 years plus a B prospect makes us better than Abreu at $12M/per over the next 5 years? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted September 14, 2013 Share Posted September 14, 2013 QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Sep 14, 2013 -> 10:39 AM) So B.J. Upton at $15M/per over the next 4 years plus a B prospect makes us better than Abreu at $12M/per over the next 5 years? As I've detailed before, there quite possibly is a team out there that would trade for Upton if his price tag were $25-$30M over 4 years. Take the $30M hit on the payroll over the next two years and the prospect. The Braves get rid of the entire contract, the team that traded for Upton gets what it wants, and the Sox basically buy a prospect while keeping their long-term financial flexibility. Better than Abreu for 4-years? I would say yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted September 14, 2013 Share Posted September 14, 2013 QUOTE (scs787 @ Sep 14, 2013 -> 10:36 AM) This, to me, doesn't make any sense. Why are they taking on bad contracts for prospects when they can simply sign free agents and save the prospects? Was this sarcasm? miss worded? To your other post about this being the "proper way" to rebuild, was that sarcasm too? I hope I'm just misunderstanding you because I don't see how trading prospects makes sense for a "rebuilding" team. EDIT- after reading the last 2 posts I see whats going on here, nevermind. I agree with CWS, I don't think you're gonna get good enough prospects back in these sorts of trades....Show me some deals that prove otherwise. And at this point the FA market doesn't look half bad. The problem is this team itself. How do you go from losing 100 games to contending buying free agents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2nd_city_saint787 Posted September 14, 2013 Share Posted September 14, 2013 QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Sep 14, 2013 -> 10:39 AM) So B.J. Upton at $15M/per over the next 4 years plus a B prospect makes us better than Abreu at $12M/per over the next 5 years? And the Sox have to give something up as well. What are some deals where the team got a good prospect back with a bad contract for a virtual nobody? The Blue Jays trades came up earlier but those aren't good examples because Toronto got back all "bad contracts" and no prospects. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted September 14, 2013 Share Posted September 14, 2013 Marty is just trolling again. Dan Berstein brought up this concept of teams dumping bad contracts and sending along prospects as bait. He was also mentioning salary caps and other things thinking MLB is the NBA. Teams don't give up top prospects unless they are desperate. Teams also get an additional $25 million to play with starting this offseason. There is not one example of a team giving up a top prospect for taking on a bad contract. Then BJ Upton is mentioned. He is owed $60 million the next 4 years. What prospect, even if the Braves were so desperate to get rid of Upton, do they have that is worth that price? It isn't going to happen. The board panned the thought, Marty decided to bring it back for arguments. He is covering his bases though. He did mention a couple of months ago, the "heavy lifting" of a rebuild was done. He also mentioned if a rebuild was done "correctly" it could be accomplished in 2 years. Now he is saying 2016. No matter what happens, he will tell everyone he was the first to tell you what was going to happen. Just read his posts for comedy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted September 14, 2013 Share Posted September 14, 2013 QUOTE (scs787 @ Sep 14, 2013 -> 10:58 AM) And the Sox have to give something up as well. What are some deals where the team got a good prospect back with a bad contract for a virtual nobody? The Blue Jays trades came up earlier but those aren't good examples because Toronto got back all "bad contracts" and no prospects. The Sox pay $30M for the team that theoretically wants Upton. These deals rarely present themselves because in part there have been few high revenue teams in the last 20 years who have been as bad as the Sox are and who have the kind of financial flexibility the Sox will have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted September 14, 2013 Share Posted September 14, 2013 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Sep 14, 2013 -> 10:55 AM) The problem is this team itself. How do you go from losing 100 games to contending buying free agents. See 2012 Cleveland Indians. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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