Peavy to Boston, Avisail Garcia + 3 low lv specs to Sox

[GGajewski18]

I dont want him to give into the demands of other GMs and settle for their price. He isnt a rental. We have him under control next year. Wait until winter then to start up trade talks.

 

I see your point. Makes sense. Someone will crack.

[NCsoxfan]

Obviously a year and a half of Peavy is more valuable than one year. Plus we run the risk of him getting injured and getting nothing back. Doubt Hahn wants to risk it.

[DirtySox]

The posturing continues. Somebody will crack

 

Yep. It's clearly posturing. And to be honest Russell and Gray is probably too much for Peavy. Russell is a top 20 prospect in baseball to many. You start out asking for the moon and negotiate from there. Gray and Russell will probably lead to some sort of combination of Gray/Ynoa/Choice/Alcantara/Bostick.

[GGajewski18]

Yep. It's clearly posturing. And to be honest Russell and Gray is probably too much for Peavy. Russell is a top 20 prospect in baseball to many. You start out asking for the moon and negotiate from there. Gray and Russell will probably lead to some sort of combination of Gray/Ynoa/Choice/Alcantara/Bostick.

 

I would like a package of Gray, Choice +

[Chisoxfn]

i really want the Cards to get Alexei and Peavy. I think a package with two of their top prospects + another good prospect and I'm a happy camper. Anything more is gravy.

[Chisoxfn]

Yep. It's clearly posturing. And to be honest Russell and Gray is probably too much for Peavy. Russell is a top 20 prospect in baseball to many. You start out asking for the moon and negotiate from there. Gray and Russell will probably lead to some sort of combination of Gray/Ynoa/Choice/Alcantara/Bostick.

I'd be quite happy with Russell and Gray. I wonder if the Sox would add someone like Lindstrom or pick up some cash. If they picked up some cash, A's really makes sense. I could see where they would value having a guy like Peavy around next year as well. Plus in that division, they have to strike while the iron is hot and the Angels are a hot mess and Texas is really struggling right now.

[fathom]

I'd be quite happy with Russell and Gray. I wonder if the Sox would add someone like Lindstrom or pick up some cash. If they picked up some cash, A's really makes sense. I could see where they would value having a guy like Peavy around next year as well. Plus in that division, they have to strike while the iron is hot and the Angels are a hot mess and Texas is really struggling right now.

 

For Russell and Gray, the Sox should be eating a lot more than 1-2 million. Russell would far and away be the top prospect in the system.

[Chisoxfn]

For Russell and Gray, the Sox should be eating a lot more than 1-2 million. Russell would far and away be the top prospect in the system.

They could send over 5-7M for all I care. Getting Russell + another top prospect would be a major coup, imo.

[Jake]

Russell would be a guy worth paying 10 million bucks for. He'd probably get that as international FA right now

[GGajewski18]

For Russell and Gray, the Sox should be eating a lot more than 1-2 million. Russell would far and away be the top prospect in the system.

 

Yeah I was thinking of eating anywhere 7-10 million if you want those guys.

[CyAcosta41]

I see your point. Makes sense. Someone will crack.

 

I'm as anxious as anyone to start moving from the rubble of what KW has left us with towards a hopefully brighter future, but you fellas are going to drive yourselves crazy hanging as many of you do on ever rumor, innuendo, and smokescreen, particularly the supposedly "inside" info coming from the paid (broadly defined) shills.

 

Deadline based negotiation is not for the faint of heart. The old boys' club is testing Rick "the Rook" Hahn -- and he knows it too. Falling apart and giving up on his convictions because shills and pundits like Gammons, Olney, Rosenthal, and others say he is being "unreasonable" in his demands is self-defeating. It gives up on the game before we've nearly completed it! Other than with Jesse Crain, we don't have a single expiring contract in our group of principle trade chips. Given the way things are progressing (or not), I'm quite sure that Hahn is making this clear at every opportunity, but then adding that he's open to trades provided they meet or exceed what his ball club needs. Period. Want some of our guys? Fine. Make it worth our while. Otherwise, we'll try to find someone else who will. Don't cry to me if you miss out on the arm/bat you need for your stretch run because you wouldn't make us what we'd consider a "fair" trade.

 

We have absolutely no way of knowing what offers have or have not been discussed. None. We don't know whether Hahn already has multiple deals that he's prepared to take, although he perhaps hasn't told the other team that, all the while trying to find a last minute suitor who feels enough pressure at the last moment to lap the pack with an offer. Agents have been doing this to Hahn and other GMs/Owners for years. I'd bet my last dollar that KW and the Chairman have long been advised that Hahn's plan is to keep negotiating on various players, on various fronts, until the last few hours before the deadline. We don't have to trade. It's critical to maximize the return - whether now or in the off season.

 

I know we're all anxious, but I truly hope that nobody really thinks that a professional baseball GM should cave because the hardcore fans of the world (like us) think that he might miss the boat altogether if he takes the plan to the conclusion. IF this IS the plan -- and I think it is -- we're just getting to the 7th inning, folks. We have plenty of opportunities left to win this nail-biter!

 

Keep on keepin' on, Rick ("Rook") Hahn!

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

Royals no longer sellers

 

The Royals will not be sellers at the deadline, Yahoo! Sports' Jeff Passan tweets

Per MLBTR

 

This is good news obviously. Takes another "frontline" starter off the market in Santana. I don't believe this nonsense about other teams backing off. They are testing Ricky boy. This is his first deadline and all eyes are on him to get a great package back. The FO knows the need to get impact players back that generates excitement for us fans. If we are trading away JP and others they need to make sure it doesn't hurt attendance. We just have to have patients Hahn is winning the staredown for now. Not to mention we need to get back a package as good or better than the Flubs got, it would be an epic failure if we dont for a contorlled pitcher like jake. He knows he has the cards and is playing them right. We have till Wednesday and although it sucks to wait for us. It only creates more leverage for us regardless of what the writers are saying. We don't have to move our guys, the teams interested need the players in order to make a Pennet run and a October run. I have a feeling by Wednesday we will all be praising Hahn for waiting it out.

I'm not sure. It's like a pack group think, if they hear others are backing out the more likely they are to back out to or make offers so low that Hahn has no choice but to refuse the offers. I hop e I am sooo wrong, but I thought from the beginning these GM would horde their prosepcts because baseball is cycling that way again. Big free agent contracts and veteran salaries are out of control and this is the backlash.

Edited July 29, 2013 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[hi8is]

...

Post.More.

[iamshack]

Yeah, I agree...the dance is just getting interesting now...hold your ground, Rick

[Soxfest]

•The White Sox have shown no interest in absorbing any of the approximately $24MM owed Peavy and that, along with health concerns, are big issues for the Braves.

 

 

Per Mlb rumors

[CyAcosta41]

I guess what I'm also saying is this ...

 

HAVE FUN with all of this. For a lot of us, the serious fans, many of whom know a heck of a lot about prospects throughout baseball, it's kind of similar to fantasy sports as we have fun speculating, deciding what we would do, extrapolating as to what we think our favorite teams should do, and so forth.

 

But, like fantasy sports - it IS fantasy. We don't know what is happening. There is mis, dis, and non information aplenty out there. We can easily work ourselves up into a lather when, in actuality, there isn't one ounce of "truth" in the speculation being discussed.

 

To me, recognizing this reality, it doesn't make the process less fun, it makes it MORE fun - I can have fun with all the speculation and fantasy of the situation, but the REAL GMs and owners, on their own private calls and in their 1:1 meetings, will in the end do whatever they feel like doing.

 

And then we can have a new round of fun dissecting THAT!

 

Enjoy the ride, fellas!

Edited July 29, 2013 by CyAcosta41

[mike65]

I'm as anxious as anyone to start moving from the rubble of what KW has left us with towards a hopefully brighter future, but you fellas are going to drive yourselves crazy hanging as many of you do on ever rumor, innuendo, and smokescreen, particularly the supposedly "inside" info coming from the paid (broadly defined) shills.

 

Deadline based negotiation is not for the faint of heart. The old boys' club is testing Rick "the Rook" Hahn -- and he knows it too. Falling apart and giving up on his convictions because shills and pundits like Gammons, Olney, Rosenthal, and others say he is being "unreasonable" in his demands is self-defeating. It gives up on the game before we've nearly completed it! Other than with Jesse Crain, we don't have a single expiring contract in our group of principle trade chips. Given the way things are progressing (or not), I'm quite sure that Hahn is making this clear at every opportunity, but then adding that he's open to trades provided they meet or exceed what his ball club needs. Period. Want some of our guys? Fine. Make it worth our while. Otherwise, we'll try to find someone else who will. Don't cry to me if you miss out on the arm/bat you need for your stretch run because you wouldn't make us what we'd consider a "fair" trade.

 

We have absolutely no way of knowing what offers have or have not been discussed. None. We don't know whether Hahn already has multiple deals that he's prepared to take, although he perhaps hasn't told the other team that, all the while trying to find a last minute suitor who feels enough pressure at the last moment to lap the pack with an offer. Agents have been doing this to Hahn and other GMs/Owners for years. I'd bet my last dollar that KW and the Chairman have long been advised that Hahn's plan is to keep negotiating on various players, on various fronts, until the last few hours before the deadline. We don't have to trade. It's critical to maximize the return - whether now or in the off season.

 

I know we're all anxious, but I truly hope that nobody really thinks that a professional baseball GM should cave because the hardcore fans of the world (like us) think that he might miss the boat altogether if he takes the plan to the conclusion. IF this IS the plan -- and I think it is -- we're just getting to the 7th inning, folks. We have plenty of opportunities left to win this nail-biter!

 

Keep on keepin' on, Rick ("Rook") Hahn!

 

A thoughtful analysis but I think the problem your team has, at least at this moment, is that your owner appears to not want to pay any salary for players that aren't on his team. Your have my Cardinals, Red Sox, Braves, Orioles, and A's that have all checked in on Peavy and they have all checked out with an empty basket. There is something not right about this picture, You say it is the 7th inning of a 9 inning game. Unlike a baseball game, your competition can just leave you standing at the altar with your demands in hand. Do you really want to still have Peavy on Thursday morning?

 

The White Sox may ultimately get a deal done here but I am pretty sure that they will either lower their player demands or increase the money they are willing to put in a deal. You guys are not trading Sandy Koufax.

 

 

 

[iamshack]

A thoughtful analysis but I think the problem your team has, at least at this moment, is that your owner appears to not want to pay any salary for players that aren't on his team. Your have my Cardinals, Red Sox, Braves, Orioles, and A's that have all checked in on Peavy and they have all checked out with an empty basket. There is something not right about this picture, You say it is the 7th inning of a 9 inning game. Unlike a baseball game, your competition can just leave you standing at the altar with your demands in hand. Do you really want to still have Peavy on Thursday morning?

 

The White Sox may ultimately get a deal done here but I am pretty sure that they will either lower their player demands or increase the money they are willing to put in a deal. You guys are not trading Sandy Koufax.

Absolutely...not a lot to lose though right now...

[Frank_Thomas]

I'm not sure. It's like a pack group think, if they hear others are backing out the more likely they are to back out to or make offers so low that Hahn has no choice but to refuse the offers. I hop e I am sooo wrong, but I thought from the beginning these GM would horde their prosepcts because baseball is cycling that way again. Big free agent contracts and veteran salaries are out of control and this is the backlash.

 

 

I hear ya, I just don't think GMs are calling and discussing what they are offering or what they have offered. It may be considered collusion if they were plotting which level spect's to give up. Not to mention a lot of these teams are competing against each for a playoff spot and hopefully for a long October run, so I don't think we have to worry about that. Rick just has to give them the 10 yard stare and make them pay for a impact player. They're aren't many out there and we have just about one at every position, IF, OF, SP, RP, and even a CP if we decide Reed is expenndible. I still see us making out well. My prediction is Jake and Alexi to StL for a package of Wong and Martinez and a few lower level aspects with high ceilings. Rios goes to TX although I have a feeling Pitt may end up with him. And finally we part with Lindstrom to Boston.

 

I do think you're right on with GMs hoarding spects with the way contracts are getting, but a GM get an itch around this time when they feel a WS trophy is a legit possibility. We sox fans have been on the other side of this more than a few times an know if a GM feels there's a guy out there that sets up for the last few months and October they will pull the trigger whether now or Wednesday. Just look at the Garza deal and dude has been on the DL a lot the past year or so.

Edited July 29, 2013 by Frank_Thomas35

[greg775]

•The White Sox have shown no interest in absorbing any of the approximately $24MM owed Peavy and that, along with health concerns, are big issues for the Braves.

 

 

Per Mlb rumors

 

You guys despise me, but I've been saying this all along, that Jerry won't wanna pay teams money for taking Peavy/Rios/Dunn off our hands.

[bighurt4life]

It would be a shame to miss out on the opportunity to get 3-5 young talented players into our minor league system because the owner is too cheap to pony up a few million bucks. That is a very short sighted point of view. You go from paying one guy 14.5 million per season to paying several guys rookie scale salaries (provided some of the prospects pan out) for the next several seasons. This is an obvious win and much cheaper in the long run. Reinsdorf only sees the 5 million coming out of his pocket right now instead of the 20 million he'll get to keep in the next 3-5 years because we replaced an expensive and aging player with several cheap and young players.

 

Thats one of the great follies of any business(baseball) man, only seeing the short term loss/gain instead of looking at the long term savings of having a constant stream of young talent. This is why teams like the Rays compete nearly every season on a shoestring budget. They plan for the future by always looking to stock their minor league teams with talented players. When these guys mature, they come to the big team and play for relative pennies keeping the overall cost down while still providing quality play on the field. When someone starts to get some years under their belt and become too expensive they swap him out, let someone else pay the big salary and take on 3 or 4 young guys in return and start the cycle all over again. Case in point is the James Shields for Wil Myers swap this last offseason. They dumped Shields and his big salary for a 22 year old who is going to be a perennial all star and get paid peanuts while doing it. It's a smart way to do business, I wish we did things the same way.

[Soxfest]

It would be a shame to miss out on the opportunity to get 3-5 young talented players into our minor league system because the owner is too cheap to pony up a few million bucks. That is a very short sighted point of view. You go from paying one guy 14.5 million per season to paying several guys rookie scale salaries (provided some of the prospects pan out) for the next several seasons. This is an obvious win and much cheaper in the long run. Reinsdorf only sees the 5 million coming out of his pocket right now instead of the 20 million he'll get to keep in the next 3-5 years because we replaced an expensive and aging player with several cheap and young players.

 

Thats one of the great follies of any business(baseball) man, only seeing the short term loss/gain instead of looking at the long term savings of having a constant stream of young talent. This is why teams like the Rays compete nearly every season on a shoestring budget. They plan for the future by always looking to stock their minor league teams with talented players. When these guys mature, they come to the big team and play for relative pennies keeping the overall cost down while still providing quality play on the field. When someone starts to get some years under their belt and become too expensive they swap him out, let someone else pay the big salary and take on 3 or 4 young guys in return and start the cycle all over again. Case in point is the James Shields for Wil Myers swap this last offseason. They dumped Shields and his big salary for a 22 year old who is going to be a perennial all star and get paid peanuts while doing it. It's a smart way to do business, I wish we did things the same way.

Why is anyone surprised JR does not want to pay any money in deals? The ONLY reason Sox are getting better players through the draft is the slotted system or it would be the old draft the guy who will sign the cheapest.

Edited July 29, 2013 by Soxfest

[iamshack]

It would be a shame to miss out on the opportunity to get 3-5 young talented players into our minor league system because the owner is too cheap to pony up a few million bucks. That is a very short sighted point of view. You go from paying one guy 14.5 million per season to paying several guys rookie scale salaries (provided some of the prospects pan out) for the next several seasons. This is an obvious win and much cheaper in the long run. Reinsdorf only sees the 5 million coming out of his pocket right now instead of the 20 million he'll get to keep in the next 3-5 years because we replaced an expensive and aging player with several cheap and young players.

 

Thats one of the great follies of any business(baseball) man, only seeing the short term loss/gain instead of looking at the long term savings of having a constant stream of young talent. This is why teams like the Rays compete nearly every season on a shoestring budget. They plan for the future by always looking to stock their minor league teams with talented players. When these guys mature, they come to the big team and play for relative pennies keeping the overall cost down while still providing quality play on the field. When someone starts to get some years under their belt and become too expensive they swap him out, let someone else pay the big salary and take on 3 or 4 young guys in return and start the cycle all over again. Case in point is the James Shields for Wil Myers swap this last offseason. They dumped Shields and his big salary for a 22 year old who is going to be a perennial all star and get paid peanuts while doing it. It's a smart way to do business, I wish we did things the same way.

But you're forgetting that the guys you get in return might never turn out to be productive players. That's part of the benefit of trading for prospects - because although they are somewhat unknowns at this point, at least they're saving you money. If you give that benefit up by paying all kinds of salary, then what the heck are you trading for anymore?

 

You've got to be getting some kind of consideration out if this, or else you may as well never move a productive veteran.

[chw42]

You guys despise me, but I've been saying this all along, that Jerry won't wanna pay teams money for taking Peavy/Rios/Dunn off our hands.

 

We shouldn't have to pay other teams money to trade Peavy. He's probably the best pitcher available at the deadline right now.

 

When was the last time a team had to throw in money for a big name starting pitcher dealt at the deadline?

 

I can understand Dunn and I can understand Rios to a point, but we better not pay other teams for taking Peavy off our hands.

 

The JR is cheap crap that uneducated Bulls fan spout is annoying enough (they point to the fact that the White Sox have a higher payroll). But now White Sox fans are saying Jerry's too cheap for not paying others to take the best pitcher available at the trading deadline? It's come full circle now.

Edited July 29, 2013 by chw42

[CyAcosta41]

A thoughtful analysis but I think the problem your team has, at least at this moment, is that your owner appears to not want to pay any salary for players that aren't on his team. Your have my Cardinals, Red Sox, Braves, Orioles, and A's that have all checked in on Peavy and they have all checked out with an empty basket. There is something not right about this picture, You say it is the 7th inning of a 9 inning game. Unlike a baseball game, your competition can just leave you standing at the altar with your demands in hand. Do you really want to still have Peavy on Thursday morning?

 

The White Sox may ultimately get a deal done here but I am pretty sure that they will either lower their player demands or increase the money they are willing to put in a deal. You guys are not trading Sandy Koufax.

 

Who says our owner appears not to want to pay ANY salary for departed players? Gammons? Others? What do they actually know? Anything more than what others with vested interests tell them? Or plant with them? Do they know what Rick Hahn actually will do? What Chairman Jerry will ultimately do?

 

And these reports of "checking out with an empty basket" ... these actions are without agendas? To be believed at face value?

 

All of this ... every bit of this ... is big league negotiations. None of us -- none of Gammons and his cronies -- know exactly what has happened to this point and the true bottom-lines for all teams. In the end, I'm enjoying the twists and turns of all of the reporting, but it's really just fluff and entertainment. Everyone concerned has self-interest and an agenda. I hesitate to take ANYTHING I'm hearing at face value because everyone - and the plants and shills - are posturing. This goes for the White Sox, your Cards, and every other team in baseball!

 

And you know what? I personally have no problem whatsoever if we're left with Peavy on Thursday morning -- he's an excellent pitcher, with a contract for the remainder of 2013 and all of 2014 which is very fair for a pitcher of his ilk, and if nobody makes a "fair" deal for him now, then somebody might during the offseason, or at next year's trade deadline. You're right - we're not trading Sandy Koufax here. But, not a single one of the prospects being discussed are the second coming of Strasburg, Harper, or Trout either. Prospects are prospects. No guarantees. But there is a heck of a lot more certainty that an excellent pitcher like Peavy (or current above-average major league players like Rios or Ramirez) will actually help a current contender to possibly win the whole thing than ANY of these prospects being a contributor on a future pennant winner. AND THAT is why some GM will ultimately pay a fair asking price -- because nobody is guaranteed the next shot at winning it all at any particular time.

 

Quite honestly, I think Peavy/Ramirez wind up going to the Cards (my NL team). GM Mo is a smart MOfo ... and a tough one ... and someone who I hope Rook Hahn turns into ... and the fit is so obvious, and the timing/need just right ... that the two of them will find the right combo of players and money.

Edited July 29, 2013 by CyAcosta41