Make a case for a new manager in 2014

[kitekrazy]

Most of you watch the games, I don't. If the manager was not a former beloved player, how soon would you want a guy gone?

 

My question is did the team go through that many changes (minus AJ and Youk) that puts them flirting with the 100 loss mark? Could we say last season was over achievement and this season is under achievement?

[CWSpalehoseCWS]

I wouldn't mind Ventura stepping down this offseason, but I doubt the Sox will fire him. Especially with JR still in control. I do think after next season, if he is still around, we are going to see McEwing get a shot.

[2nd_city_saint787]

Meh, I'm fine with Robin staying on next year.

 

To go along with AJ and to an extent Youk, the difference between this and last years team is a healthy producing Paul Konerko, and Tanks "sophomore slump".

 

For once, the Sox don't have enough power.

 

 

[greg775]

Sox blew it when they didn't hire Francona. Since we didn't get him, I'd be all for keeping Robin, cause there's really nobody impactful out there. If the Rays would fire Madden, or Madden would want to move to a big market, sure. But that's not happening. Maybe if LaRussa would do it. If we can't get LaRussa, I'd say keep Robin. I don't want any current coaches off teams like Martinez. I want a proven manager with our next hire.

With our talent, it's really not going to matter for a few years, unless Tito is in charge. I think Francona would have this team in the hunt probably. If Robin decides to step down, I'd immediately promote Coop and let him try.

Edited July 15, 2013 by greg775

[caulfield12]

Sox blew it when they didn't hire Francona. Since we didn't get him, I'd be all for keeping Robin, cause there's really nobody impactful out there. If the Rays would fire Madden, or Madden would want to move to a big market, sure. But that's not happening. Maybe if LaRussa would do it. If we can't get LaRussa, I'd say keep Robin. I don't want any current coaches off teams like Martinez. I want a proven manager with our next hire.

With our talent, it's really not going to matter for a few years, unless Tito is in charge. I think Francona would have this team in the hunt probably. If Robin decides to step down, I'd immediately promote Coop and let him try.

 

Why wouldn't the same exact argument hold for Cito Gaston? He also has two World Series titles...

[nickofypres]

During 2011 it was rumored that the Sox were going to replace Ozzie with Ken Macha. I would be down with that.

[Leonard Zelig]

Why wouldn't the same exact argument hold for Cito Gaston? He also has two World Series titles...

Gaston is 69 years old and retired.

[Quin]

In before #BringBackOzzie

[Balta1701]

If Robin had signed that extension, I'd be annoyed at this point due to the quality of play on the field but begrudgingly accepting that he would be here for at least another year.

 

He's not under contract? Perfect. Bring in someone else and see if they can pull the players' heads out of their tails. The guy whose job it is to do that this year has utterly failed.

[witesoxfan]

Sox blew it when they didn't hire Francona. Since we didn't get him, I'd be all for keeping Robin, cause there's really nobody impactful out there. If the Rays would fire Madden, or Madden would want to move to a big market, sure. But that's not happening. Maybe if LaRussa would do it. If we can't get LaRussa, I'd say keep Robin. I don't want any current coaches off teams like Martinez. I want a proven manager with our next hire.

With our talent, it's really not going to matter for a few years, unless Tito is in charge. I think Francona would have this team in the hunt probably. If Robin decides to step down, I'd immediately promote Coop and let him try.

 

Well this post is about the most absurd one I've seen in a while. They never interviewed Francona. Are you going to say they blew it when they didn't hire Leyland? Or Hurdle? How about when they didn't hire Eric Wedge?

 

I'm really not sure why you are obsessed with Francona. This team be in a similar predicament with Francona as they would with Casey Stengel. It's just not a very good team.

 

Next, Cooper just does not seem like he is manager's material. He's far more valuable coaching up the pitchers. It's why he's been in that position for like 10 years now.

 

---

 

In the end, I think you give Ventura another year. For some reason, we seem to assume he's not doing the same thing he did last year, but maybe he is. At some point, you have to fault the players for not performing too. I'd give Ventura another year at this point.

 

[cabiness42]

Well this post is about the most absurd one I've seen in a while. They never interviewed Francona. Are you going to say they blew it when they didn't hire Leyland? Or Hurdle? How about when they didn't hire Eric Wedge?

 

I'm really not sure why you are obsessed with Francona. This team be in a similar predicament with Francona as they would with Casey Stengel. It's just not a very good team.

 

Next, Cooper just does not seem like he is manager's material. He's far more valuable coaching up the pitchers. It's why he's been in that position for like 10 years now.

 

---

 

In the end, I think you give Ventura another year. For some reason, we seem to assume he's not doing the same thing he did last year, but maybe he is. At some point, you have to fault the players for not performing too. I'd give Ventura another year at this point.

 

I believe that if Cooper had wanted to be a manager, he would be the manager of the Sox right now instead of Robin. That's not to say that his ambitions can't change, but I agree that he seems likely to remain a pitching coach.

 

[southsider2k5]

Well this post is about the most absurd one I've seen in a while. They never interviewed Francona. Are you going to say they blew it when they didn't hire Leyland? Or Hurdle? How about when they didn't hire Eric Wedge?

 

I'm really not sure why you are obsessed with Francona. This team be in a similar predicament with Francona as they would with Casey Stengel. It's just not a very good team.

 

Next, Cooper just does not seem like he is manager's material. He's far more valuable coaching up the pitchers. It's why he's been in that position for like 10 years now.

 

---

 

In the end, I think you give Ventura another year. For some reason, we seem to assume he's not doing the same thing he did last year, but maybe he is. At some point, you have to fault the players for not performing too. I'd give Ventura another year at this point.

 

The Sox had the choice of the players or the manager, and it looks like they are taking the hard way and choosing the manager.

[Balta1701]

The Sox had the choice of the players or the manager, and it looks like they are taking the hard way and choosing the manager.

Until Ventura is under contract for 2014, the option to choose "Neither" remains.

[Kyyle23]

The Sox should have hired Joe Torre as manager. Fail. If they didnt hire Joe Torre, they should have hired Bobby Cox, because Cox has done nothing but win games for his entire career, and he taught Ozzie Guillen how to coach and has the same amount of world series trophies as Ozzie Guillen, so that means he is awesome. If those two guys werent available, well i guess Robin is fine as manager.

[Eminor3rd]

I guess I could technically care less, but I couldn't possibly care enough to "make a case" either way.

[LittleHurt05]

Sox blew it when they didn't hire Francona. Since we didn't get him, I'd be all for keeping Robin, cause there's really nobody impactful out there. If the Rays would fire Madden, or Madden would want to move to a big market, sure. But that's not happening. Maybe if LaRussa would do it. If we can't get LaRussa, I'd say keep Robin. I don't want any current coaches off teams like Martinez. I want a proven manager with our next hire.

With our talent, it's really not going to matter for a few years, unless Tito is in charge. I think Francona would have this team in the hunt probably. If Robin decides to step down, I'd immediately promote Coop and let him try.

 

I wish Francona was here in 2012. He would never ever be part of a big collapse in September. Never.

[kwolf68]

 

Ventura can't do anything with this team. It's not a very good team. A rebuild is the best thing. Lets see how he works with that before making a case to remove him.

[cabiness42]

In the actual course of managing baseball games, managers have little impact on the outcome of most games. Managerial decisions may make an impact of at most 3-4 games in the standings over the course of a season. The biggest impact a manager has is whether or not players want to play for him. As a game tactician, Ozzie was pretty poor (outside of bullpen management, where I thought he was pretty good) but you could argue that good players took below-market money to play for him so he was effective from that standpoint, except that he abused his status until things got so bad that he had to go.

 

I don't know what kind of impact Robin is having on the players, but I do read about players like Rios and Peavy stating a preference to remain with a team that is destined to win about 70 games rather than get traded to a contender so that says something about the organization if not Robin.

 

I worry that letting Robin go after two seasons sends the message of instability in the organization and scares away whatever potential free agents the Sox might have their eyes on.

[lostfan]

If we get a new manager can we get better players too?

[kitekrazy]

Ventura can't do anything with this team. It's not a very good team. A rebuild is the best thing. Lets see how he works with that before making a case to remove him.

 

That makes me think that maybe someone else can do something.

 

[kitekrazy]

If Robin had signed that extension, I'd be annoyed at this point due to the quality of play on the field but begrudgingly accepting that he would be here for at least another year.

 

He's not under contract? Perfect. Bring in someone else and see if they can pull the players' heads out of their tails. The guy whose job it is to do that this year has utterly failed.

 

I'm starting to see it that way. I'm also worried about the Sale pitch count. Where's Coop in this? Are they going to mirror the Baker/Rothschild regime?

 

[Princess Dye]

The lineup almost doesnt have a hitter. A hitter.

[witesoxfan]

That makes me think that maybe someone else can do something.

 

Jesus Christ turned water into wine. He did not turn a pile of s*** into a successful baseball team.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

Robin's been kind of inflexible as a manager. He trots out basically the same line up every day . Then if a player gets hot he says I don't want to move him because he's had success in that spot. I know the production as whole hasn't been there and we strand a lot of runners. I think a manager has a lot more to do with outcomes of games than people think, not on strategic decision making but on the line up construction. Group the hot hitters together , play matchup, show some creative thinking. The tried and true lineup hasn't hit and more than likely pretty much any line up wouldn't hit either so why not experiment with it ?

 

Rios hasn't hit all year with RISP but he is always 3rd in the line up and lately he takes the 1st pitch constantly and is always behind 0-1 and often 0-2. De Aza is our 2nd best HR hitter and maybe our best hitter with RISP and only hits lead off.

 

Robin hardly ever pinch hits against AL teams . How many times do we have to see Flowers making outs in the 9th of a close game ? Seems like Robin thinks he's dealing with a bunch of babies who can only hit where he puts them and couldn't hack being moved up or down in the lineup or being PH for.

Edited July 15, 2013 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[Balta1701]

Rios hasn't hit all year with RISP but he is always 3rd in the line up and lately he takes the 1st pitch constantly and is always behind 0-1 and often 0-2. De Aza is our 2nd best HR hitter and maybe our best hitter with RISP and only hits lead off.

The sad thing is we heard all last year how Robin needed to move Rios to the 3rd spot instead of Dunn because Rios was the most consistent hitter.