bulokis Posted December 14, 2002 Share Posted December 14, 2002 Its so hard to think of the trade rumor as either good or bad. First I dont want us to trade Garland. I think he is a better than average pitcher, he's young and will help us in the long run. I agree with some of the post that if there is a way we could give up other pitchers instead of Garland then bring it on. Garland is one of my favorite sox players and he fits perfectly with the SOX as a bunch of young and good players. If this trade takes place we end up having 2 ACES on our rotation. I like the sound of that. Then, Vidro and Jimenez at the middle will be awesome. And Vidro hits for average, has speed, and power also. If we can keep Garland I am all for this trade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted December 14, 2002 Share Posted December 14, 2002 Originally posted by MoltoI don't like that trade at all. I want Jimenez to play and I don't want to deal Garland. Mario, Jimenez won't get benched. I'll say this once I'll say it a million times, Vidro isn't a leadoff hitter. Jimenez is the only guy on our roster that can leadoff. Manos isn't a leadoff hitter, neither is Vidro, he's a 2 hitter and thats where he will be. Look for the Sox to try to move Manos or just keep him as backup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted December 14, 2002 Share Posted December 14, 2002 Originally posted by bulokisIts so hard to think of the trade rumor as either good or bad. First I dont want us to trade Garland. I think he is a better than average pitcher, he's young and will help us in the long run. I agree with some of the post that if there is a way we could give up other pitchers instead of Garland then bring it on. Garland is one of my favorite sox players and he fits perfectly with the SOX as a bunch of young and good players. If this trade takes place we end up having 2 ACES on our rotation. I like the sound of that. Then, Vidro and Jimenez at the middle will be awesome. And Vidro hits for average, has speed, and power also. If we can keep Garland I am all for this trade. You mean, if we can keep Garland without giving up anyone named Borchard, Rauch, Honel, Malone or Diaz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulokis Posted December 14, 2002 Share Posted December 14, 2002 yeah if we can give them wright or ritchie then I would be all for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaliSoxFan Posted December 14, 2002 Share Posted December 14, 2002 If this trade does not go through what do think the confidence of the players will be. If I remember correctly garland was supposed to go to the angles in the erstand deal that didn't happen, and wasn't Lee as well. Two years in a row my teams wants to get rid of me. I would be pissed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted December 14, 2002 Share Posted December 14, 2002 Originally posted by CaliSoxFanIf this trade does not go through what do think the confidence of the players will be. If I remember correctly garland was supposed to go to the angles in the erstand deal that didn't happen, and wasn't Lee as well. Two years in a row my teams wants to get rid of me. I would be pissed You would have been traded for two studs, Erstad in CF who has great defense, a good bat and good speed, and Bartolo Colon, who is a stud pitcher, one of the better ones in the league. And you were the main part of each deal. I wouldn't be pissed....my confidence would be high, because I would realize that I am worth a lot of and I would help whichever team greatly that I would be going to. If I were compared to Bartolo Colon, which is basically what he's doing right now, then I am very high on myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cali Posted December 14, 2002 Share Posted December 14, 2002 Originally posted by CaliSoxFanIf this trade does not go through what do think the confidence of the players will be. If I remember correctly garland was supposed to go to the angles in the erstand deal that didn't happen, and wasn't Lee as well. Two years in a row my teams wants to get rid of me. I would be pissed well the main difference is that the garland-erstad deal actually happened, than it was called off, this is still a rumor as of right now. I would do this deal, I really hate to lose Garland, but getting Garland for Colon is fine with me, Lee is replacable, Willie Harris is whatever, the only thing that scares the s*** out of me, is the minor leaguers I know it won't be Honel or Borch, but I'm afraid we'll give up someone good, I don't have names, but someone good, like Munoz or Diaz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaliSoxFan Posted December 14, 2002 Share Posted December 14, 2002 I see your point, but For me I would think my team really didn't want me because every year I come up in rumors for great players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Showtime Posted December 15, 2002 Share Posted December 15, 2002 Originally posted by HeatherTheRedbirdColon Buehrle Garland sign Paul Byrd Rauch You'll get one pitcher, and one only. Sub in Ritchie for Byrd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Showtime Posted December 15, 2002 Share Posted December 15, 2002 Originally posted by RedPinStripesThat would be so stupid. We tried that already. Manos throws like a ss from CF. If anything, Manuel would have his tinkering ways with Jiminez and Manos at SS. You know Jerry has never figured out who the ss is since 2000. If that trade happened, Jose would be the starter and D'ang would be on the pine. I know Jason hates Jose, but deal with it. Manuel knew it was Valentine but had to play b**** boy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxplosion Posted December 15, 2002 Share Posted December 15, 2002 The rumor I read is wed get Michael Bennett too and our ML would be Paul. 4-3 Expos favor but Paul hardly counts as a player... Lets so it! YEAH! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted December 15, 2002 Share Posted December 15, 2002 I hardly ever count it as a player for player deal, ie, them getting 4 players and us getting 3....I count it as talent for talent...and we are getting much more talent then they are....and don't forget, they will bascially get another player, as we would be sending them cash too...or in other words, we'd be putting in slightly more money to their payroll than the other 28 teams are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxplosion Posted December 15, 2002 Share Posted December 15, 2002 Exactly wsf. We are giving up two players that have actually shown skill in the majors, they are giving up three. Colon is better than Garland and if we want to contend now, hes better because God knows when Garland will come to life. Lee is good and hes the only guy Id rather not lose but with what wed get, so be it. Barrett or Bennett whatever i smuch better than Paul. I dont need any facts or evidence to support this. And Vidro is easily better than Harris. Harris is a hustler with a good glove but he didnt show much with the bat. Vidro is already a star (2 time AS?) with great power for a second baseman. Id do this deal in a second. Wed be ripping someone else off for once. KW would be laughing himself instead of being laughed at for once. GOOD DEAL! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baggio202 Posted December 15, 2002 Author Share Posted December 15, 2002 another thing i like about this trade is vidro is LF.. a couple things about vidro that seem to be misundersttod...he is not fast in 6 seasons he as 14 sb's and been caught 12 times...i believe he is a power hitter in the sense that durham was..lots of doubles and homers in the 15-20 range..alot more consistent then ray having hit 300 each of the past 4 seasons...as good as a nuber 2 hitter he is , i think with the sox he would have great production protecting konerko...with vidro behind konerko paulie would see alot more fastballs...or to break up the line up have vidro bat between paulie and maggs... what to do with manos???..i havent seen anyone mention this but what about manos in LF???..i love him on SS myself but we know W's new b**** is jimenez and im sure JM will be under orders to play him.. jimenez SS valentin LF thomas DH maggs RF vidro 2b konerko 1B borchard CF crede 3B olivo / barrett C if we ran a line up out like that..i would get the '00 feeling all over again...the question marks.. 1.will an outfield of manos - borchard - maggs kill us defensively??..rowand would be the 4th outfielder and can replace manos and move to cf moving borchard to LF for late inning defense...i think if we lived with carlos in LF we can live withv manos - borchard in left and center.. 2. can jimenez lead off and play SS???..thats a big question mark that we didnt have in '00 ..durham had an awesome'00..120 runs scored??...for this to work jimenez HAS TO COME THROUGH!!! i think we are in better shape at C , 3b , 1b , and starting pitching then we were going into the '00 season our pitching staff 1. colon 2. buehrle 3. wright 4. rauch 5. ritchie / biddle thats better going in then the '00 staff was..though the '00 taff did pitch its ass off i thin kthe bullpens are close with '00 being a little better going in as far as rumors go i think this one is realistic..a deal like this or similiar is sitting on the expos desk..unfortanuately there are about 20 other offers from other GM's sitting on the spos desk too...will they take this one??...i dont know...one advantage we got going in is that reinsy and selig are good buds and MLB is running the spos... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted December 15, 2002 Share Posted December 15, 2002 Originally posted by CaliSoxFanIf this trade does not go through what do think the confidence of the players will be. If I remember correctly garland was supposed to go to the angles in the erstand deal that didn't happen, and wasn't Lee as well. Two years in a row my teams wants to get rid of me. I would be pissed Its part of the game. You can't take rumors for much, at least not the Expos deal. The Erstad deal was for sure. If the deal doesn't go through, they'll simply say its a rumor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CubKilla Posted December 15, 2002 Share Posted December 15, 2002 Originally posted by theoldroman Lee is good and hes the only guy Id rather not lose but with what wed get, so be it. I'd rather not lose the guy who's still in his early 20's with 3 seasons under his belt who has shown, at times, that he could be dominating in the ML's..... but that's just me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted December 15, 2002 Share Posted December 15, 2002 Originally posted by CubKillaI'd rather not lose the guy who's still in his early 20's with 3 seasons under his belt who has shown, at times, that he could be dominating in the ML's..... but that's just me. Me too....Garland is going to be a stud someday....I gotta good feeling about him....he will figure it out. He's got pretty good stuff....it's a matter of figuring out what to do with it about now. I'd give them Wright and Malone if that's what they want....regardless of whether or not Malone was just battling an injury this past year. Malone could be a good starting pitcher someday, but with control concerns, I have think he may have Rick Ankiel written all over him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted December 15, 2002 Share Posted December 15, 2002 Malone is extremely young and since their aren't many hard throwing lefties out their. Corwin should bounce back this year. The guy has stud written all over him, but I'd probably do something like that if they were to take Wright, but I'm going to like it either way as long as Corwin or one of our top prospects isn't the other prospect. I don't mind giving up Paul what-soever Right now I see this as Lee and Garland for Colon. Then Harris for Vidro, and Paul for Barret and then an extra player(Hopefully just a crappy ptbnl or Ginter) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cali Posted December 15, 2002 Share Posted December 15, 2002 not that there's much validity to it, Gammons was just on SC, and he said that nobody was interested in Colon, and that everybody was interested in Vasquez, so who knows... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted December 15, 2002 Share Posted December 15, 2002 Jas, I totally forgot about Ginter...hell, give them Ginter and Josh Stewart to sweeten the deal...it would be Lee and Garland for Colon, Ginter and Harris for Vidro, and Paul and Stewart for Barret...hell, no one said it had to be an 8-player deal...let's make it 9...nothing wrong with that...but it makes the deal sweeter for the Expos, since they'd be getting another starting pitching prospect...and he could make their rotation this year. They have no lefty starter at the time, I believe, and that is something they may consider using, who knows. Goddamn this deal is making more sense the more and more I think about it...all the players we give them cancel all but $500,000 of Vidro's salary out. Then Colon makes $8.5 million...which is $9 million. Then Barret makes about $1.25 million...which is $10.25 million that we take on. We then give them about $1.75 million, which basically means we take on $12 million, and they only have $3 more million to deal with. This also means they could move Fernando Tatis and at the same time take on over half his salary, which is sweeter for the other team...maybe take a shot on a 3B and only have to give up $3 million and a decent 3B or CF prospect...Atlanta, the sCrUBS, Pittsburgh possibly, maybe San Francisco and Colorado, where I think he would be best traded to...the Rockies don't have that great of a 3B, whoever it is right now....Tatis to Colorado for Gabe Kapler or Jay Payton would be a great move for the Expos if they could pull it off, especially it they wouldn't have to pay for any of Tatis's salary. Those would be two incredible moves by the Expos...those two moves alone put them at their goal of cutting $15 million($12 million from the White Sox, $3 million from the Rockies) and they remain a decent team, but not good, team. They could win 80 games next year with their team. Which is why the White Sox proposal makes so much f***in sense....the Tim Kurkjian thinks he's smart when he says that Juan Rivera and Nick Johnson for Bartolo Colon/Javy Vazquez would be a good move, filling both of Montreal's needs...bulls***. If that move occurred, then the Expos would have Guerrero in RF, Macias in CF, Rivera in LF, Wilkerson at 1B and Tatis at 3B, with no room for Johnson...no one is going to take a $6.25 million risk on Tatis, but they will take a $3 million risk on Tatis...that's what they'd be able to get with out deal. God, I am starting to like this...and one reason why this could happen in the next 24 hours...it's going to take a hell of a lot to get a deal this good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerbaho-WG Posted December 15, 2002 Share Posted December 15, 2002 Gammons knows nothing, really. THEO (new BoSox GM), WHAT HAVE YOU HEARD ABOUT BARTOLO COLON!@!!~!! Um, nothing really. I want Vazquez, though. YOU HEARD IT HERE, FIRST! NO ONE WANTS COLON, AND JAVIER VAZQUEZ IS A HOT COMMOTIDY! WAIT, JUST ONE MINUTE, BREAKING NEWS! I AM A DOUCHE! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted December 15, 2002 Share Posted December 15, 2002 Cerb, that's exactly what I think of Gammons Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted December 15, 2002 Share Posted December 15, 2002 You know teams are talking about Colon. I know Vazquez is considered hot stuff, but Colon is the stud out their. I also think they'll be getting tons of calls on Vidro or they should cause that guys a stud too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hotsoxchick1 Posted December 15, 2002 Share Posted December 15, 2002 no one can afford colon........as much as this seems like a typical kw move here i dont take it to heart....i just cant see him moving a bunch of young guys he has faith in for a one year deal on colon and vidro......sorry to be the doubtful one here guys but i just dont see this happening............. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted December 17, 2002 Share Posted December 17, 2002 If we make any of these trades, I'm out. Not that anybody would care, but if we make a batch of bad trades, I will get a new hobby. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.