Reasons Rick Hahn Would Land Cano

[caulfield12]

But, with Belle...

 

1) That team wasn't competitive

2) A lot of that damage was done in the 2nd half when the season was over...garbage time

3) He wasn't popular at all with fans and maybe drove some away

4) Looking at statistics alone doesn't measure the negative impact on the clubhouse chemistry-wise

5) In the end, we were quite lucky he had an out with that contract or look at the situation Baltimore ended up in with him

Edited September 11, 2013 by caulfield12

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

But, with Belle...

 

1) That team wasn't competitive

2) A lot of that damage was done in the 2nd half when the season was over...garbage time

3) He wasn't popular at all with fans and maybe drove some away

4) Looking at statistics alone doesn't measure the negative impact on the clubhouse chemistry-wise

5) In the end, we were quite lucky he had an out with that contract or look at the situation Baltimore ended up in with him

You'll have to show me some proof that in a season of 49 Hr's 48 doubles, 152 RBI and a 1.054 OPS that " a lot " (w/e that means )was done in garbage time. Also please prove a guy who had such a monster season was unpopular with fans or that he was a negative clubhouse influence. I can say he was well liked by his team mates and the fans liked him without any proof.

 

Also the 2 years he had with Baltimore before he retired would make him the best hitter on this year's Sox. Even in his last year he still had 37 doubles 23 HR's 103 RBI . His 1st year with Baltimore was better than his 1st year with the Sox. No one has ever had 50 50 in HR's and double except Belle and he was 2 doubles and 1 HR short of doing it with the Sox.

Baltimore signed him to a 5 year contract keeping him as one of the top 3 paid players in baseball but even after he retired because of a degerative hips after 2 years Baltimore kept him on the 40 man roster and recooped most of their investment in him from insurance.

Edited September 11, 2013 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

While the latter is hard to prove, it is known that Belle was a dick. What caulfield had meant when he was saying "haven't we learned from Belle" was because I believe we signed him to a 5 year contract but he had opted out after 2 years. The years after those two with us he went to Baltimore and his hip fell apart and he sucked.

He didnt exactly suck he just wasnt the same player . Either one of his 2 years in Baltimore would make him easily the Sox best hitter though he could barely run anymore by the end of the 2nd season .

And what's there to learn ? That was a great contract because we got out of it. Also Baltimore recooped a lot of their money from insurance.

 

Plenty of players have been dicks and still played great baseball and won World Series. Chemistry is only made as a point on losing teams to detract from how crappy most of your players are.

Edited September 12, 2013 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[caulfield12]

40% is not recouping a LOT of their money...not even a majority of their money.

[lasttriptotulsa]

While the latter is hard to prove, it is known that Belle was a dick. What caulfield had meant when he was saying "haven't we learned from Belle" was because I believe we signed him to a 5 year contract but he had opted out after 2 years. The years after those two with us he went to Baltimore and his hip fell apart and he sucked.

 

Your definition of sucking must be quite different than mine. His first season with Baltimore he put up a .297/.400/.541 slash and his second year (with a failing hip) he put up a .281/.342/.474 line.

[witesoxfan]

That 2000 season would look good in 2013, but his OPS+ was 109 and his wRC+ was 104. Frankly, it was barely above average. It's impressive he did it with a banged up hip, but it was still barely above average.

[southsider2k5]

You'll have to show me some proof that in a season of 49 Hr's 48 doubles, 152 RBI and a 1.054 OPS that " a lot " (w/e that means )was done in garbage time. Also please prove a guy who had such a monster season was unpopular with fans or that he was a negative clubhouse influence. I can say he was well liked by his team mates and the fans liked him without any proof.

 

Also the 2 years he had with Baltimore before he retired would make him the best hitter on this year's Sox. Even in his last year he still had 37 doubles 23 HR's 103 RBI . His 1st year with Baltimore was better than his 1st year with the Sox. No one has ever had 50 50 in HR's and double except Belle and he was 2 doubles and 1 HR short of doing it with the Sox.

Baltimore signed him to a 5 year contract keeping him as one of the top 3 paid players in baseball but even after he retired because of a degerative hips after 2 years Baltimore kept him on the 40 man roster and recooped most of their investment in him from insurance.

 

I'm pretty sure the lions share of his numbers were put up in the second half when the Sox were out of it.

[iamshack]

I'm pretty sure the lions share of his numbers were put up in the second half when the Sox were out of it.

Yeah, he went on a crazy run in the second half.

[Soxfest]

You are right. There is always a place for super athletic, toolsy players. The problem was that KW wanted athletic players and JR did not want to spend money on the draft. In turn, the Sox end up with players like Mitchell, Walker, and Thompson because of it.

That is correct, If the draft picks were not slotted now nothing would of changed draft wise.

Edited September 11, 2013 by Soxfest

[witesoxfan]

That is correct, If the draft picks were not slotted now nothing would of changed draft wise.

 

#1) You don't know that

#2) They are, so who cares?

[NorthSideSox72]

#1) You don't know that

#2) They are, so who cares?

#3) Things already have changed dramatically in LatAm, another avenue for amateur talent, and it has nothing to do with the draft rules.

 

[southsider2k5]

Yeah, he went on a crazy run in the second half.

 

I looked it up.

 

1st half - 18 HR 66 RBI .278/.354/.517 87 games played

2nd half - 31 HR 86 RBI .387/.451/.816 76 games played

[LittleHurt05]

I looked it up.

 

1st half - 18 HR 66 RBI .278/.354/.517 87 games played

2nd half - 31 HR 86 RBI .387/.451/.816 76 games played

 

[witesoxfan]

The 1998 White Sox finished 80-82 despite giving up 32 more runs than anyone else in the league. 12 of 20 pitchers - no matter the number of plate appearances - finished with an ERA above 5, every member of the opening day rotation finished with an ERA of 5.10 or above, and our old friend Jamie Navarro threw 172 innings and put up an ERA of 6.36.

 

If that team had 2 good starters - and I am talking 4.50 ERA good here - they are probably a playoff team.

 

And, to be fair, they did go 45-31 in the second half, and it's not as if Belle hadn't played on winning teams before.

[southsider2k5]

The 1998 White Sox finished 80-82 despite giving up 32 more runs than anyone else in the league. 12 of 20 pitchers - no matter the number of plate appearances - finished with an ERA above 5, every member of the opening day rotation finished with an ERA of 5.10 or above, and our old friend Jamie Navarro threw 172 innings and put up an ERA of 6.36.

 

If that team had 2 good starters - and I am talking 4.50 ERA good here - they are probably a playoff team.

 

And, to be fair, they did go 45-31 in the second half, and it's not as if Belle hadn't played on winning teams before.

 

Without a doubt, there has never been a Sox player I despised more than him.

[Donny Lucy's Avocado Farm]

Didnt the whitesox ask Frank Thomas who he would rather play with, Bonds or Belle - so the Sox signed Belle?? Seems like the Sox were damned with a dickhead player regardless of who they signed between the two.

[Soxfest]

#1) You don't know that

#2) They are, so who cares?

I care because Sox minor league system is in the s***ter because of it.

Edited September 12, 2013 by Soxfest

[witesoxfan]

I care because Sox minor league system is in the s***ter because of it.

 

They're doing something about that now though. Maybe appreciate that rather than worrying about Ken Williams did as GM 4 years ago.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

40% is not recouping a LOT of their money...not even a majority of their money.

Where did you ome up with the 40% figure ? Link please ? And even if it was 40% , the contract was 5 yrs. $65M he played 2 years at 13M per season so they paid $26 for his services. That leaves 3 yrs at $39 M remaining so it's safe to say insurance paid at least most of that $39 million which I would call a lot and upwards of 50% of the orignal contract.

[caulfield12]

Where did you ome up with the 40% figure ? Link please ? And even if it was 40% , the contract was 5 yrs. $65M he played 2 years at 13M per season so they paid $26 for his services. That leaves 3 yrs at $39 M remaining so it's safe to say insurance paid at least most of that $39 million which I would call a lot and upwards of 50% of the orignal contract.

 

 

That's pretty much the industry standard...a range between 35-50%, depending on the player/contract/injury history/age, because if they're (insurance companies) agreeing to pay out much more than that, the cost of insuring those huge contracts becomes prohibitively expensive to underwrite on both sides. Too much risk, not enough reward.

 

It's also the rate we were paid back for David Wells' 2001 lost season.