A week of groceries in pictures

[iamshack]

Here are the % of law students who walk away from law school with debt:

 

http://grad-schools.usnews.rankingsandrevi...d-debt-rankings

 

Not seeing a lot of low percents there.

You can see the old money there though if you look at the more prominent schools. In many cases, their percentages are a little lower than the less-prominent institutions.

 

Wow though, that makes me feel a bit better about my debt.

 

I remember a lot of these kids signing private loans at like $40k/year to live in these plush condo-like facilities...just idiots.

[Soxbadger]

Here are the % of law students who walk away from law school with debt:

 

http://grad-schools.usnews.rankingsandrevi...d-debt-rankings

 

Not seeing a lot of low percents there.

 

First those numbers are much higher than 1%. Second look at schools like U of Miami (private schools where money matters) and you are already down to 80%. Then add to the fact that those numbers dont mean anything...

 

 

IE

 

I took law school loans because my parents asked me to. While I was in law school they were 0 interest (ie free money). During that time period my parents invested the tuition into cds/bonds/etc.

 

When I left law school I had X debt. The day before the deferment ended my parents paid the entire amount.

 

Thus while I left school with debt, I never really had it. It was just a scheme to get free interest. So on that report I would have had "debt" even though it wasnt real.

[iamshack]

First those numbers are much higher than 1%. Second look at schools like U of Miami (private schools where money matters) and you are already down to 80%. Then add to the fact that those numbers dont mean anything...

 

 

IE

 

I took law school loans because my parents asked me to. While I was in law school they were 0 interest (ie free money). During that time period my parents invested the tuition into cds/bonds/etc.

 

When I left law school I had X debt. The day before the deferment ended my parents paid the entire amount.

 

Thus while I left school with debt, I never really had it. It was just a scheme to get free interest. So on that report I would have had "debt" even though it wasnt real.

I really doubt there are a whole lot of folks that did that represented in these numbers.

[Harry Chappas]

The life expectency of white collar v blue collar as well as quality of life while working is what makes college different.

 

 

 

[Jenksismyhero]

1% was clearly an exaggeration. You were making it sound like people that go to law school do so after evaluating the cost of going to school. I totally disagree. The focus is on salary potential and employment rate post-graduation. If it cost 100k a year and you think that you can get a good paying job afterwards, you're going to do it. Whether you can afford it is irrelevant since you're taking out loans anyway (or, at least 80-90% of students will)

[pettie4sox]

First those numbers are much higher than 1%. Second look at schools like U of Miami (private schools where money matters) and you are already down to 80%. Then add to the fact that those numbers dont mean anything...

 

 

IE

 

I took law school loans because my parents asked me to. While I was in law school they were 0 interest (ie free money). During that time period my parents invested the tuition into cds/bonds/etc.

 

When I left law school I had X debt. The day before the deferment ended my parents paid the entire amount.

 

Thus while I left school with debt, I never really had it. It was just a scheme to get free interest. So on that report I would have had "debt" even though it wasnt real.

 

Not many parents would be that financial savvy to pull of something like that.

[Soxbadger]

I really doubt there are a whole lot of folks that did that represented in these numbers.

 

That really isnt the point. The point is that law school is becoming prohibitively expensive which will cause people who have to take loans to potentially not go to law school.

 

 

Not many parents would be that financial savvy to pull of something like that.

 

My parents were told how to do this by the High School I went to because they suggest parents do it for undergrad as well.

Edited October 22, 2013 by Soxbadger

[Soxbadger]

1% was clearly an exaggeration. You were making it sound like people that go to law school do so after evaluating the cost of going to school. I totally disagree. The focus is on salary potential and employment rate post-graduation. If it cost 100k a year and you think that you can get a good paying job afterwards, you're going to do it. Whether you can afford it is irrelevant since you're taking out loans anyway (or, at least 80-90% of students will)

 

I cant speak for everyone, but cost of graduate school was the main factor in my decision.

[Y2HH]

What do you call all the lawyers of Soxtalk at the bottom of the ocean?

[iamshack]

That really isnt the point. The point is that law school is becoming prohibitively expensive which will cause people who have to take loans to potentially not go to law school.

 

 

 

 

My parents were told how to do this by the High School I went too because they suggest parents do it for undergrad as well.

 

True, especially since there are so many out there who did not find jobs upon graduation. However, some folks do what Jpenks is suggesting and go because the job market is rotten anyways. I know that what a lot of folks were doing when I was graduating in '07.

 

[Jenksismyhero]

I cant speak for everyone, but cost of graduate school was the main factor in my decision.

 

Because your parents were going to pay for it? That's a totally different discussion.

[IlliniKrush]

1% was clearly an exaggeration. You were making it sound like people that go to law school do so after evaluating the cost of going to school. I totally disagree. The focus is on salary potential and employment rate post-graduation. If it cost 100k a year and you think that you can get a good paying job afterwards, you're going to do it. Whether you can afford it is irrelevant since you're taking out loans anyway (or, at least 80-90% of students will)

I think you're right on here. We just went through this with my brother-in-law - he had the choice of staying in state, and having most of college paid for, or going out of state to USC, and paying a lot more out of his own pocket. Then we got into the discussion of a graduate degree. 18 year old's don't have a good concept of money and what it will cost later, what the loans will look like, etc. Until you're living it, it's hard to really understand it.

 

I also doubt most people's parents explain it as well as we did to my brother-in-law and went through numbers, etc. They say great, more school, I'm proud of you, but the kids don't have any idea what they are actually getting themselves into.

[Soxbadger]

Because your parents were going to pay for it? That's a totally different discussion.

 

Not really. Its the same idea as to why I didnt go to a Masters Program that I would have had to take loans for.

 

I think you're right on here. We just went through this with my brother-in-law - he had the choice of staying in state, and having most of college paid for, or going out of state to USC, and paying a lot more out of his own pocket. Then we got into the discussion of a graduate degree. 18 year old's don't have a good concept of money and what it will cost later, what the loans will look like, etc. Until you're living it, it's hard to really understand it.

 

I also doubt most people's parents explain it as well as we did to my brother-in-law and went through numbers, etc. They say great, more school, I'm proud of you, but the kids don't have any idea what they are actually getting themselves into.

 

 

I dont know, this was really common for me in High School. Friend X went to Illinois instead of Wisconsin because his parents said theyd buy him a car if he stayed in state. I tried to negotiate a deal with my parents that theyd give me money to stay instate, but they refused. So I went to Wisconsin.

 

I mean it may have been a while ago, but my friends and I lived it. Most kids went with what was going to be paid for. The few that did not were excessively hard working/driven/motivated and they were doing it for a reason, IE school has #1 ranked program.

 

I guess its possible that kids who werent going to top tier schools were making random decisions that made no economical sense, but I really dont have a clue.

 

[illinilaw08]

I don't think the price going up has changed anyone's decision not to go to law school the last decade. Until you get the degree you're just signing a meaningless piece of paper obligating you to decades of repayment. At 18 or 22 you're more concerned about the hot blonde that just smiled at you at the financial aid office.

 

This!

 

Especially for people who go straight through from undergrad to law school and have never really had to use that paycheck to budget. My parents saved and paid for my undergrad. Money I earned working during the summer took care of my expenses (read, cheap beer). Grad school was on me. There isn't a day that goes by where I don't regret the voluntary decision to go into debt. And I think my law school debt is probably fairly manageable by comparison to a lot of my peers.

 

The other issue with law school is that there is a sense that there are plenty of big dollar legal jobs to go around out of law school and that just isn't the case. So plenty of 22 year olds signing that meaningless piece of paper with decades of repayment are assuming that they will have that 6 figure job out of school and repayment will be a breeze and are operating with faulty information.

 

In conclusion, don't go to law school...

[Soxbadger]

This!

 

Especially for people who go straight through from undergrad to law school and have never really had to use that paycheck to budget. My parents saved and paid for my undergrad. Money I earned working during the summer took care of my expenses (read, cheap beer). Grad school was on me. There isn't a day that goes by where I don't regret the voluntary decision to go into debt. And I think my law school debt is probably fairly manageable by comparison to a lot of my peers.

 

The other issue with law school is that there is a sense that there are plenty of big dollar legal jobs to go around out of law school and that just isn't the case. So plenty of 22 year olds signing that meaningless piece of paper with decades of repayment are assuming that they will have that 6 figure job out of school and repayment will be a breeze and are operating with faulty information.

 

In conclusion, don't go to law school...

 

People are really like this?

 

I thought I was the most irresponsible person in college but its like the exact opposite of what I thought/did.

 

I went to law school because I wanted to change the way people think/act. I really should have been a teacher, but law school was an easier sell than graduate school for whatever reason.

[Jenksismyhero]

People are really like this?

 

I thought I was the most irresponsible person in college but its like the exact opposite of what I thought/did.

 

I went to law school because I wanted to change the way people think/act. I really should have been a teacher, but law school was an easier sell than graduate school for whatever reason.

 

I still like what I do, I just don't like not getting paid what I thought I'd be paid, on top of having to pay a s*** ton in loans.

 

It doesn't help that I have a friend who made 150k+/year, paid off her loans in like 6 months, quit after a few years, and traveled the world for a year with her husband.

[LittleHurt05]

I still like what I do, I just don't like not getting paid what I thought I'd be paid, on top of having to pay a s*** ton in loans.

 

It doesn't help that I have a friend who made 150k+/year, paid off her loans in like 6 months, quit after a few years, and traveled the world for a year with her husband.

 

Instead of working so hard at law school, it sounds like you should have spent the effort on wooing your friend!

[southsider2k5]

I love how threads move on Soxtalk. A weeks worth of groceries around the world ends up becoming a b**** about law school thread

[Soxbadger]

I still like what I do, I just don't like not getting paid what I thought I'd be paid, on top of having to pay a s*** ton in loans.

 

It doesn't help that I have a friend who made 150k+/year, paid off her loans in like 6 months, quit after a few years, and traveled the world for a year with her husband.

 

Unless she was really lucky, she probably was a slave to the company. My friends who work at Winston have terrible lives. I always ask them what point is making money if they cant do anything fun with it.

 

 

Instead of working so hard at law school, it sounds like you should have spent the effort on wooing your friend!

 

So yeah, back when I was in HS I used to tell people I was going to law school so that I could find a more driven/career oriented girl and convince her that Id give up my career to take care of the kids.

 

Its a great plan.

[iamshack]

Well, there's plenty of money to be made as a law school graduate in other industries, guys...I can't tell you how few lawyers are involved in utility/energy regulation, especially out west. And if you can learn a complex industry and then apply your legal background to it, you'll be in a very unique position.

 

Best thing I ever did was NOT go into practicing law after graduation and instead get involved in energy trading.

[Soxbadger]

Learning? booo hiss boo hiss

 

Nah actually I agree completely. The difference is most industries I cant help regular everyday people and go home knowing that I did more good than bad.

 

Yeah it wont pay the bills, but at some point my brain was damaged into thinking that helping people is worth more than money.

[iamshack]

Learning? booo hiss boo hiss

 

Nah actually I agree completely. The difference is most industries I cant help regular everyday people and go home knowing that I did more good than bad.

 

Yeah it wont pay the bills, but at some point my brain was damaged into thinking that helping people is worth more than money.

You can in a lot though. I work on a trade floor where every penny we save gets passed through to our ratepayers. So every bit of knowledge I can arm our traders/managers with regarding what is and is not permissible, gives them more ability to buy and sell power from all over the country and therefore cut costs/earn revenue.

 

 

[Jenksismyhero]

Well, there's plenty of money to be made as a law school graduate in other industries, guys...I can't tell you how few lawyers are involved in utility/energy regulation, especially out west. And if you can learn a complex industry and then apply your legal background to it, you'll be in a very unique position.

 

Best thing I ever did was NOT go into practicing law after graduation and instead get involved in energy trading.

 

Hey I'll move to Vegas. Find me a job at your company

[iamshack]

Hey I'll move to Vegas. Find me a job at your company

You just never know...

[Soxbadger]

Ill trade for your company Shack, but only if youre my boss and I get access to your pool bi-monthly.

 

Trading is actually fun, I spent a summer trading eurodollars through globex. Its one of the few jobs that I actually sometimes consider doing.