witesoxfan Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 12:03 PM) They're not going to contend next year with Headley You really need to stop using this argument. You could say that about damn near anybody but the fact of the matter is, if they bring in enough talented players, they could compete. I'm not saying they will do either. I'm saying you don't stop yourself from acquiring a good player because "you're not going to compete," especially if the cost is right. and the Padres asking price will be too high. This is a valid reason, but I don't think it's that they'll ask too much but rather than someone else is likely to pay more for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 12:10 PM) You really need to stop using this argument. You could say that about damn near anybody but the fact of the matter is, if they bring in enough talented players, they could compete. I'm not saying they will do either. I'm saying you don't stop yourself from acquiring a good player because "you're not going to compete," especially if the cost is right. When you have control of that player for only one year . . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 11:50 AM) Correct. I don't understand concepts that make zero sense. So how do you understand your own posts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 12:17 PM) So how do you understand your own posts? I expect no less from you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 12:15 PM) When you have control of that player for only one year . . . You are not barred from re-signing him or making a qualifying offer to him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 12:17 PM) So how do you understand your own posts? Personally, I think my posts make a lot of sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 12:22 PM) You are not barred from re-signing him or making a qualifying offer to him. Then wait for him to become a free-agent instead of giving anything up for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorStSox Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 I think Conor's potential is similar to what I'd expect out of Headley, 270/340/420ish with 20 HR's. Admittedly, I don't know much about Headley's defense, but the GG doesn't impress me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 01:26 PM) Then wait for him to become a free-agent instead of giving anything up for him. For once, Marty is right. "We could make him a $14 million qualifying offer" should not be viewed as an excuse to trade for anyone with only 1 year on their deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lillian Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 With the several promising infielders and the likely signing of Trea Turner, perhaps a short term solution at third would be reasonable. Between Gillaspie, Semien, Tim Anderson, Trea Turner Carlos Sanchez and Micah Johnson they might not need to spend on a long term solution at third. One or two years might be just perfect, and require less of a price in both money and players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (TaylorStSox @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 12:56 PM) I think Conor's potential is similar to what I'd expect out of Headley, 270/340/420ish with 20 HR's. Admittedly, I don't know much about Headley's defense, but the GG doesn't impress me. Gillaspie is basically the same age as Beckham. Why does he have so much potential but you think Beckham is just awful and cannot get better? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (Lillian @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 02:21 PM) With the several promising infielders and the likely signing of Trea Turner, perhaps a short term solution at third would be reasonable. Between Gillaspie, Semien, Tim Anderson, Trea Turner Carlos Sanchez and Micah Johnson they might not need to spend on a long term solution at third. One or two years might be just perfect, and require less of a price in both money and players. Frankly, if we're just looking for a short-term solution, run Gillaspie and Keppinger out there and wait until a solid long-term option presents itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 Would you guys do Santiago + Keppinger for Headley? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 01:36 PM) Would you guys do Santiago + Keppinger for Headley? Of course. SD wouldn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 01:36 PM) Would you guys do Santiago + Keppinger for Headley? I would think the deal would be more realistic without Kepp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 01:36 PM) Would you guys do Santiago + Keppinger for Headley? No. Santiago will be more valuable than Headley this year and probably every successive year, is under team control, and is cheap. Headley is an old free agent to be that has been worth top talent for a period of about 6 months of his life. I'm happy to have Headley on the team, but I'm not sure if I'd even give up Rienzo-caliber players for him. I'm guessing there is some team that will give up more than that, especially if they hold on to Headley until the deadline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiliIrishHammock24 Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 02:36 PM) Would you guys do Santiago + Keppinger for Headley? Oh yeah. I really like Hector, but trading away Keppinger actually makes this deal better for us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiliIrishHammock24 Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (Jake @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 02:40 PM) No. Santiago will be more valuable than Headley this year and probably every successive year, is under team control, and is cheap. Headley is an old free agent to be that has been worth top talent for a period of about 6 months of his life. I'm happy to have Headley on the team, but I'm not sure if I'd even give up Rienzo-caliber players for him. I'm guessing there is some team that will give up more than that, especially if they hold on to Headley until the deadline. I know that comparing pitcher WAR to hitter WAR isn't exact, but in what everyone considers a very bad year for Headley, he STILL put up a 3.6 WAR. Assuming his real value is somewhere in between his 2012 and 2013 years, I would expect a 4-5 WAR season in 2014. Hector, on the other hand, put up a 1.5 WAR last season. That's a big difference, despite it being pitcher vs. hitter. I wouldn't expect Hector to out perform Headley at ALL next year. The obvious value in Hector lies in his cost and team controllable years. Also, you characterize Headley as "old". He will be 29 at the start of the season. That is younger than other playerss being discussed for this team, like Brandon Phillips, Brian McCann, Robinson Cano, Curtis Granderson, Jacoby Ellsbury. Hell, I think Jarrod Saltalamacchia is the only player who is YOUNGER than Headley, and that's by 1 year. To say Headley is an "old free agent" is not fair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorStSox Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 01:28 PM) Frankly, if we're just looking for a short-term solution, run Gillaspie and Keppinger out there and wait until a solid long-term option presents itself. I've been watching Beckham fail for 4 years. Gillaspie is better right now, has far better mechanics and a far better approach. Do you realize how screwed up Beckham's mechanics are? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (TaylorStSox @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 01:57 PM) I've been watching Beckham fail for 4 years. Gillaspie is better right now, has far better mechanics and a far better approach. Do you realize how screwed up Beckham's mechanics are? You do realize Beckham was hitting.309 when he went down with a quad injury in August. Gillaspie was no better than Tank at 3B the last 3 months of the season as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (Jake @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 02:40 PM) No. Santiago will be more valuable than Headley this year and probably every successive year, is under team control, and is cheap. Headley is an old free agent to be that has been worth top talent for a period of about 6 months of his life. I'm happy to have Headley on the team, but I'm not sure if I'd even give up Rienzo-caliber players for him. I'm guessing there is some team that will give up more than that, especially if they hold on to Headley until the deadline. I concur with no. Hector put up 1.5 WAR last year and pitched out of the bullpen for 1/3 of the year. If he's a 2 WAR player for the next 3 years (i.e. he doesn't improve at all), he'll basically be paid $5 million to put up $30+ million in value. Read the trade this way and ask if you'd do it...would you send along Keppinger and $25 million extra in exchange for Headley, while still taking on his $10 million next year? I sure wouldn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorStSox Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 01:59 PM) You do realize Beckham was hitting.309 when he went down with a quad injury in August. Gillaspie was no better than Tank at 3B the last 3 months of the season as well. Quad injury my ass. So the alternative to awful Beckham is a slap hitter with no power, that doesn't walk and has no speed. Sweet. Beckham has had 1975 more PA's than Gillespie to prove he doesn't belong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (TaylorStSox @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 02:04 PM) Quad injury my ass. So the alternative to awful Beckham is a slap hitter with no power, that doesn't walk and has no speed. Sweet. Beckham has had 1975 more PA's than Gillespie to prove he doesn't belong. Same age. Wrist injury zapped his power. Quad injury hurt his speed and range. If Beckham is healthy and can stay healthy, admittedly big ifs, he'll still be a really good player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (TaylorStSox @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 02:04 PM) Quad injury my ass. So the alternative to awful Beckham is a slap hitter with no power, that doesn't walk and has no speed. Sweet. Beckham has had 1975 more PA's than Gillespie to prove he doesn't belong. Well technically Beckham's ass... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorStSox Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 02:12 PM) Well technically Beckham's ass... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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