Balta1701 Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 02:23 PM) Please explain where all this pitching depth is. A solid starting 5 right now for a team rebuilding would be Sale, Santiago/Quintana, Danks, Rienzo, and Johnson. At Charlotte next year we will have Bassitt and Snodgress, both of whom have major league arms even if they aren't heralded (and let's be honest, this is one team that gets the most out of their arms). On top of that, Chris Beck right now is actually ahead of where Erik Johnson was coming in to this season. He'll start at AA next year and there is a very good chance he's knocking on the door of the big leagues by the middle of next season. I would have no issue running those 5 starting pitchers out there including the 2 rookies on this team after the way they finished up last year, and frankly there's a good chance that's still an above average rotation. Yes it's a gamble to run 2 rookies out there, but if the team thinks Rienzo and Johnson are potential starting pitching options (and both look like they are) there is little to be gained by putting them in Charlotte or wasting a year in the bullpen with them next year. Put them out there and let them develop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macsandz Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 01:31 PM) It would take a ton to get me to trade Quintana if I'm Rick Hahn. We're talking about a 25 year left-handed starter who will be under team control for 5 more years coming off a 3.7 WAR season. I'd want a major league position player of similar value plus a top pitching propsect. I doubt anyone bites on that, but the point is I'd want to be overwhelmed to move him. Could be Quintana to Toronto for 3B Lawrie and RHP Aaron Sanchez. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (bucket-of-suck @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 01:47 PM) Could be Quintana to Toronto for 3B Lawrie and RHP Aaron Sanchez. I like Quintana, but I would do this trade before Toronto could change their mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoGoSox2k2 Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (bucket-of-suck @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 01:47 PM) Could be Quintana to Toronto for 3B Lawrie and RHP Aaron Sanchez. oh boy bucket is breaking out some specifics.. what you think the likelihood we make a deal with the jays built around Quintana for Lawrie? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoGoSox2k2 Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 01:53 PM) I like Quintana, but I would do this trade before Toronto could change their mind. as would I. If Rick can pull that off wow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macsandz Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (GoGoSox2k2 @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 01:53 PM) oh boy bucket is breaking out some specifics.. what you think the likelihood we make a deal with the jays built around Quintana for Lawrie? Tough to call likelihood. It's been talked about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macsandz Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 01:34 PM) A solid starting 5 right now for a team rebuilding would be Sale, Santiago/Quintana, Danks, Rienzo, and Johnson. At Charlotte next year we will have Bassitt and Snodgress, both of whom have major league arms even if they aren't heralded (and let's be honest, this is one team that gets the most out of their arms). On top of that, Chris Beck right now is actually ahead of where Erik Johnson was coming in to this season. He'll start at AA next year and there is a very good chance he's knocking on the door of the big leagues by the middle of next season. I would have no issue running those 5 starting pitchers out there including the 2 rookies on this team after the way they finished up last year, and frankly there's a good chance that's still an above average rotation. Yes it's a gamble to run 2 rookies out there, but if the team thinks Rienzo and Johnson are potential starting pitching options (and both look like they are) there is little to be gained by putting them in Charlotte or wasting a year in the bullpen with them next year. Put them out there and let them develop. Scouts like Myles Jaye as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (bucket-of-suck @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 01:47 PM) Could be Quintana to Toronto for 3B Lawrie and RHP Aaron Sanchez. Much more interested in that... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 What can you folks tell us about this Aaron Sanchez, other than the fact that he is a chef on the Food Network? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (bucket-of-suck @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 02:59 PM) Scouts like Myles Jaye as well. Another good point. And let's be honest, would anyone be surprised if the Sox had another contributor step up in their minor league pitching staff in the next year beyond the guys I listed? I wouldn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (bucket-of-suck @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 02:47 PM) Could be Quintana to Toronto for 3B Lawrie and RHP Aaron Sanchez. This is about the only structure of a deal that I think makes sense involving Q. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (iamshack @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 02:01 PM) What can you folks tell us about this Aaron Sanchez, other than the fact that he is a chef on the Food Network? He makes a mean beef brisket Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 02:03 PM) Another good point. And let's be honest, would anyone be surprised if the Sox had another contributor step up in their minor league pitching staff in the next year beyond the guys I listed? I wouldn't. No, that is what makes trading a pitcher a heck of a lot easier. It isn't like a guy the Sox groomed who can hit and you may not see another one for almost a decade. They have plenty of pitchers scattered all over the league. Not a lot of stars, but serviceable. The Sox deal one, they will probably develop one, and an article I read said they were a little leery about the pitching getting thin, that they probably would address that in the draft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hi8is Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (bucket-of-suck @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 11:47 AM) Could be Quintana to Toronto for 3B Lawrie and RHP Aaron Sanchez. Are you bleeping me? Exactly the deal I wanted and then some with Sanchez. I'll be pining for this all offseason! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 12:05 PM) He makes a mean beef brisket Even with that very important strength, I don't like the idea of trading Quintana for a prospect and another guy that seems to be on the same path as Gordon Beckham. Sure the 22nd best prospect is nice and all, but I'll take the guy who has been proving it in mlb for the last two seasons anytime unless I am getting something better than Lawrie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoGoSox2k2 Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (iamshack @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 02:11 PM) Even with that very important strength, I don't like the idea of trading Quintana for a prospect and another guy that seems to be on the same path as Gordon Beckham. Sure the 22nd best prospect is nice and all, but I'll take the guy who has been proving it in mlb for the last two seasons anytime unless I am getting something better than Lawrie. i agree with some of points. but brett lawrie is exactly what this organization needs.. a young 3rd baseman who is full of potential (still only 23) and he is also a BUNDLE of ENERGY.. something that this team severely lacks.. throw in a top 50 prospect. sign me up, get it done rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 I like Quintana, but there is something telling me if you can get that kind of offer, the time is right to deal him. I just wonder if he can keep it up. He definitely came in stronger last year, but he just seems like someone whose success is short-term, not unlike several Toronto pitchers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted October 23, 2013 Author Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (iamshack @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 02:11 PM) Even with that very important strength, I don't like the idea of trading Quintana for a prospect and another guy that seems to be on the same path as Gordon Beckham. Sure the 22nd best prospect is nice and all, but I'll take the guy who has been proving it in mlb for the last two seasons anytime unless I am getting something better than Lawrie. Agreed. Santiago for Lawrie, the Jays probably wouldn't do. I think the Sox and Jays match up well for some kind of deal though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowand44 Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (iamshack @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 02:11 PM) Even with that very important strength, I don't like the idea of trading Quintana for a prospect and another guy that seems to be on the same path as Gordon Beckham. Sure the 22nd best prospect is nice and all, but I'll take the guy who has been proving it in mlb for the last two seasons anytime unless I am getting something better than Lawrie. I've been very against trading a starter for Lawrie but you add in Sanchez and it gets much more interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 12:20 PM) I've been very against trading a starter for Lawrie but you add in Sanchez and it gets much more interesting. I mean I guess it depends on what your scouts think of Lawrie and why he is regressing the last two years. Is it just injuries? Is it something mechanical? The thing that frightens me about Lawrie (and our ability to accurately scout him) is the fact that he IS so similar to Gordon, who we can't seem to get on track. I just think trading Q is difficult because he isn't flashy. I don't feel like you're going to get fair value for him very easily. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowand44 Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (iamshack @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 02:24 PM) I mean I guess it depends on what your scouts think of Lawrie and why he is regressing the last two years. Is it just injuries? Is it something mechanical? The thing that frightens me about Lawrie (and our ability to accurately scout him) is the fact that he IS so similar to Gordon, who we can't seem to get on track. I just think trading Q is difficult because he isn't flashy. I don't feel like you're going to get fair value for him very easily. Oh ya I'm definitely with you when it comes to Q. Lawrie and Sanchez at least makes some sort of a starting point when before we were just talking Q straight up for Lawrie which was ridiculous to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeoSchumacher Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 12:19 PM) Agreed. Santiago for Lawrie, the Jays probably wouldn't do. I think the Sox and Jays match up well for some kind of deal though. How about Santiago, Beckham and Flowers for Lawrie, Gose and Arencibia. Fills holes for both sides as well as change of scenery for the two catchers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 12:38 PM) Oh ya I'm definitely with you when it comes to Q. Lawrie and Sanchez at least makes some sort of a starting point when before we were just talking Q straight up for Lawrie which was ridiculous to me. If it were up to me, Q would be a guy I would hold unless someone specifically came to me asking about him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (Leonard of Berwyn @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 12:42 PM) How about Santiago, Beckham and Flowers for Lawrie, Gose and Arencibia. Fills holes for both sides as well as change of scenery for the two catchers. I don't think the Blue Jays would have any desire to do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 QUOTE (Leonard of Berwyn @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 02:42 PM) How about Santiago, Beckham and Flowers for Lawrie, Gose and Arencibia. Fills holes for both sides as well as change of scenery for the two catchers. I highly doubt the Jays would do this, but I want nothing to do with JP Arencibia ever. He has a worse approach at the plate than just about anybody in the league. He wants to swing the bat no matter what is given to him. Arencibia's on base percentage last year was about as bad as Adam Dunn's batting average (.227 to .219). His K/BB was 8.2 and his K% was 29.8%. He might seriously be the worst hitter in the major leagues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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