Who willl win the Boras/Jay-Z agent war?

[Texsox]

You don't need to try it a different way.

 

I don't think you understand the cultural force that this guy is.

 

Cultural force = success as a sports agent?

 

Ok, you win.

[LittleHurt05]

You don't need to try it a different way.

 

I don't think you understand the cultural force that this guy is.

 

Not to mention, he has a net worth estimated at over $500 million. People want to do business with him because they see dollar signs too.

[iamshack]

Let's use an example from sports, Michael Jordan. Ten years after retiring he's still raking it in with endorsements out earning most of the active athletes.

 

Will Jordan help you get an endorsement with Nike (his brand) or Adidas? Gatorade or All Sport? Hanes or Jockey? In one he's saying hey, use me also, in another he's working against one of his endorsements and with a company that possibly would prefer to have him endorse their product.

 

I just see the endorsement side being much murkier and much less a slam dunk win for Jay-Z. Again, I am certain he would be successful for his clients, but it won't be as easy as was written way back in that first post I quoted.

Comparing Jordan and Jay-Z isn't a correct analogy.

 

You're thinking about Jay-Z in the wrong context...he's not someone that is going to be competing with these guys for endorsements. Jay-Z doesn't have endorsements himself. Jay-Z is not the guy who takes a product someone else made and tells other people to like it. Jay-Z is the guy who makes the product what it is in the first place.

 

Jay-Z is the product.

[iamshack]

Cultural force = success as a sports agent?

 

Ok, you win.

Again, he's hiring like actual sports agents...you know he's not just going to draft the agreements himself, right?

[Soxbadger]

You guys have very little knowledge of Jay-Z.

 

Sean Carter (his real name) founded a label called "Roc-A-Fella Records" aka "the Roc". Perhaps youve heard Kayne reference this in his rap. Anyway, Jay-Z founded the roc and then leveraged the Roc label into becoming CEO for Def Jam and having Def Jam purchase the Roc.

 

Jay-Z also has something called proteges, his most famous being Kanye West.

 

So when you compare Boras and Cater, compare them as business men.

 

Boras net worth- approximately $100 mil. Derived almost exclusively from being a sports agent.

 

Jay Z net worth- approximately $500mil. Derived from branding. Roc A Wear, sold for $204 million. Co Brand director of Budweiser select, Def Jam, Roc, etc.

 

So if the question is, who has more experience creating brands for talent, the answer is Jay Z. If the question is, who has more experience negotiating baseball contracts, the answer is Boras.

 

But saying that "Jay Z" is only a rapper is kind of absurd.

 

http://www.celebritynetworth.com/articles/...rs-alive-today/

 

Not saying that he will beat Boras, but If I was given a choice, Id go with Jay. Jay can open doors that Boras cant. The reason is that Boras just doesnt have cache with anyone. Its not like all of these companies he drafts endorsement deals for have any love for him, they have no loyalty to him and no incentive to give him anything besides for the players he represents.

 

Jay on the other hand is the talent that the companies have been paying for. They like him, they want him to represent their brands.

 

Its kind of hilarious actually. You dont think Jay Z has a stable of lawyers who draft contracts? Thats all Boras is.

 

And even funnier, no one mentioned the Master P/Ricky Williams disaster.

[iamshack]

You guys have very little knowledge of Jay-Z.

 

Sean Carter (his real name) founded a label called "Roc-A-Fella Records" aka "the Roc". Perhaps youve heard Kayne reference this in his rap. Anyway, Jay-Z founded the roc and then leveraged the Roc label into becoming CEO for Def Jam and having Def Jam purchase the Roc.

 

Jay-Z also has something called proteges, his most famous being Kanye West.

 

So when you compare Boras and Cater, compare them as business men.

 

Boras net worth- approximately $100 mil. Derived almost exclusively from being a sports agent.

 

Jay Z net worth- approximately $500mil. Derived from branding. Roc A Wear, sold for $204 million. Co Brand director of Budweiser select, Def Jam, Roc, etc.

 

So if the question is, who has more experience creating brands for talent, the answer is Jay Z. If the question is, who has more experience negotiating baseball contracts, the answer is Boras.

 

But saying that "Jay Z" is only a rapper is kind of absurd.

 

http://www.celebritynetworth.com/articles/...rs-alive-today/

 

Not saying that he will beat Boras, but If I was given a choice, Id go with Jay. Jay can open doors that Boras cant. The reason is that Boras just doesnt have cache with anyone. Its not like all of these companies he drafts endorsement deals for have any love for him, they have no loyalty to him and no incentive to give him anything besides for the players he represents.

 

Jay on the other hand is the talent that the companies have been paying for. They like him, they want him to represent their brands.

 

Its kind of hilarious actually. You dont think Jay Z has a stable of lawyers who draft contracts? Thats all Boras is.

 

And even funnier, no one mentioned the Master P/Ricky Williams disaster.

It's not "you guys."

 

It's Tex.

 

 

[Soxbadger]

Again, he's hiring like actual sports agents...you know he's not just going to draft the agreements himself, right?

 

You mean he has a stable of lawyers dating back to the formation of Roc A Fella Records?

 

You mean hes been signing talent to labels since 1995?

 

Damn its almost like running a record label is similar to being a sports agent. Although I guess its possible that Jay Z wrote up the Kanye agreement himself. Thatd make sense.

 

 

[Soxbadger]

It's not "you guys."

 

It's Tex.

 

Southsider said something similar when he compared Jay Z to Dr. Suess and said hes good at rhyming and that hes never done this before.

 

 

[Texsox]

Is there anything that Jay-Z can't do?

 

 

[caulfield12]

 

 

Here's another reason.

 

Cross-branding.

 

That's where the Michael Jordan example doesn't work.

 

Let's say I hire Michael Jordan to represent my product. He's not going to introduce me to his contact/s with Hanes or Chevrolet or Gatorade, it's just a business transaction.

 

Jay-Z can connect a company he might be lining up an endorsement deal with to 3-5 other companies/businesses all operating in different areas, like clothing, for example. Or getting someone in a movie/tv show, appearing on American Idol, X Factor, The Voice, what have you...

 

If he had the ego to think he could do it all by himself, without CAA, that would be another thing entirely....following more in line with the Master P example just referenced.

 

This is more than a black entertainer thinking clients will flock to him just because he's black, that's too simplistic in this day and age.

 

 

[iamshack]

Southsider said something similar when he compared Jay Z to Dr. Suess and said hes good at rhyming and that hes never done this before.

Oh sorry, I think I confused your post with Caufield's, thinking you had commented on this earlier already and therefore your most recent post was just about the discussion we've been having this morning.

 

 

[caulfield12]

To whom? And do teams pay players more when they like the agent?

 

 

 

Bring back Jerry Maguire/Leigh Steinberg!

[Texsox]

And btw, I said at least four times in this thread that he will be successful, I just did not see it being a slam dunk over anyone.

 

 

 

[iamshack]

Is there anything that Jay-Z can't do?

Hah...of course. But when I see wealthy white democrats fawning over every word the guy says in regards to politics, when he is a black hip hop artist and entrepreneur...well, I know this guy is powerful.

[Soxbadger]

Is there anything that Jay-Z can't do?

 

Hes not really good at partying or doing drugs. Hes kind of straight edge. Im pretty sure hes bad at sports. And I bet Boras can write a better agreement.

 

I mean lets be honest here. Boras used his friends with talent to get into the agent game. His first clients were ex-teammates and those 2 guys are now on his staff.

 

Actually kind of similar to what Jay is doing. Yet Jay is a clueless rapper?

[Texsox]

You mean he has a stable of lawyers dating back to the formation of Roc A Fella Records?

 

You mean hes been signing talent to labels since 1995?

 

Damn its almost like running a record label is similar to being a sports agent. Although I guess its possible that Jay Z wrote up the Kanye agreement himself. Thatd make sense.

 

We've been discussing their personal impact.

 

But if you want to mention staffs. Boras' legal team have been drafting sports contracts since 1985? Including the largest and most complex. Wow, it's almost like running a record company. Of course I guess it is possible he wrote up the Prince Fielder contract himself.

[Soxbadger]

And btw, I said at least four times in this thread that he will be successful, I just did not see it being a slam dunk over anyone.

 

I dont think anything in the world is a slam dunk. The biggest thing working against Jay is the probability that he gets bored with it.

 

I wouldnt be surprised if in 5 years Boras agency buys Jay out, with Jay becoming a figurehead. Thats basically what hes done with all of his brands.

[Texsox]

Hes not really good at partying or doing drugs. Hes kind of straight edge. Im pretty sure hes bad at sports. And I bet Boras can write a better agreement.

 

I mean lets be honest here. Boras used his friends with talent to get into the agent game. His first clients were ex-teammates and those 2 guys are now on his staff.

 

Actually kind of similar to what Jay is doing. Yet Jay is a clueless rapper?

 

Seriously, What the f***?!

 

Where did I ever say he was a clueless rapper? How many times do I have to say he's a successful businessman and players would do well to emulate him? How many times do I have to say he will be successful?

 

One area, endorsements, I don't see it being a slam dunk for him.

 

Anything short of Jay-Z is the greatest and will crush all competition gets attacked.

[southsider2k5]

Agent A has a stake in several companies offering endorsements and has also dealt with companies in obtaining his own endorsements.

 

Agent B only has a history of negotiating and by all accounts is a major pain in the ass to deal with.

 

I think Agent A wins in my book.

 

Except you left out that Agent B holds records for the biggest contracts in MLB history.

[iamshack]

Seriously, What the f***?!

 

Where did I ever say he was a clueless rapper? How many times do I have to say he's a successful businessman and players would do well to emulate him? How many times do I have to say he will be successful?

 

One area, endorsements, I don't see it being a slam dunk for him.

 

Anything short of Jay-Z is the greatest and will crush all competition gets attacked.

I actually took a similar position to you, except for different reasons. I think most people believe the opposite of what you believe...that he won't just attract a ton of clients because of his celebrity; that he'll have to show he can really work his magic on the "non-baseball contract" side of things in order to earn his stripes as someone that can compete with Boras.

[LittleHurt05]

Except you left out that Agent B holds records for the biggest contracts in MLB history.

 

True, but I was more referring to the outside of baseball stuff. When it comes to baseball contracts Boras is #1 and teams are way more desperate so being an asshole has its major benefits.

[Soxbadger]

We've been discussing their personal impact.

 

But if you want to mention staffs. Boras' legal team have been drafting sports contracts since 1985? Including the largest and most complex. Wow, it's almost like running a record company. Of course I guess it is possible he wrote up the Prince Fielder contract himself.

 

If its just personal impact, it isnt close.

 

Baseball wonks on message boards know who Scott Boras is, not many others. Scott Boras facebook 489 likes. Scott Boras twitter 706 followers.

 

Jay Z facebook 18mil likes. Jay Z twitter 3mil followers.

 

Warren Buffet facebook 500k. Twitter 700k

 

One of those guys just doesnt belong.

 

http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2010/1011/ric...-interview.html

 

Hint, hes the guy who wasnt invited to the Buffett/Forbes interview.

Edited November 8, 2013 by Soxbadger

[Soxbadger]

Seriously, What the f***?!

 

Where did I ever say he was a clueless rapper? How many times do I have to say he's a successful businessman and players would do well to emulate him? How many times do I have to say he will be successful?

 

One area, endorsements, I don't see it being a slam dunk for him.

 

Anything short of Jay-Z is the greatest and will crush all competition gets attacked.

 

Did I quote your statements?

 

Someone in this thread compared Jay Z to Dr Suess and said flippantly that he could "rhyme".

 

Thats a joke. A guy doesnt make $500mil, become friends with people like Warren Buffett because hes some stupid rapper who can just put together a few verses.

 

[southsider2k5]

He sells the client as a product, just as Scott Boras does! Except people actually like Jay-Z.

 

No one likes Scott Boras, so what. Has it ever stopped him? Look at the contracts the guy has gotten for his guys, despite being reviled. The guy has gotten 3 $200 million contracts. He has gotten 10 $100 million deals. He was the first agent to break the $50 million, $100 million, and $200 million levels. If ARod could have kept his s*** together, he would have been teh first over $300 million already as well. He also own the records for the biggest first professional contracts signed, both from a HS and college player.

[southsider2k5]

Hah...of course. But when I see wealthy white democrats fawning over every word the guy says in regards to politics, when he is a black hip hop artist and entrepreneur...well, I know this guy is powerful.

 

Why? Politicians love to exploit minorities for political points.