Paul Konerko Returning to White Sox

[harfman77]

Who did you have in mind for the 25th roster spot? For all we know, this move prevents the White Sox from using Marcus Semien as a utility infielder because Ventura "likes his hustle" or whatever. Maybe they use it on Brent Morel. What difference does it make in the end?

 

This move is meaningless. Anybody the Sox would have used it on is better off getting regular ABs in AAA or AA.

 

 

 

Again I ask, what is the ultimate effect? Whose roster spot is this affecting?

 

 

It pretty much handcuffs what the Sox can do in the rule V draft as they wont be able to use that spot to carry an extra player that could contribute to the roster long term. If there is no one the Sox think could help long term, it makes sense. But this signing does nothing to move the organization forward.

[LittleHurt05]

Adam Dunn is the 2nd most important player in our franchise's future?

 

Yup, just slightly behind Donnie Veal.

[Dick Allen]

Oh for f***s sake if you want to bury your head in the sand go right ahead. Excuse me if I don't like getting bulls***ted by Sox management or wanting a better team as quickly as possible.

They aren't BSing you. The first baseman in 2014 is a 26 year old Cuban who may be the most prolific hitter in that country's history.

 

Angel Sanchez, Tyler Greene, Koske Fukudome...those are some of the 25th roster spots in the past. Paul Konerko is no worse than those players.

 

Konerko isn't penciled in for 150 starts batting clean up.

[Balta1701]

I find it amazing there are people who actually think Konerko is going to take significant at bats away from Abreu. Or even more hilarious, that they think Konerko will take over starting time if Abreu struggles in April/May.

 

There is no foundation for this in reality. We are not talking about a Brent Morel, or even a Brian Anderson here - this is a guy with a $63M contract. There is zero chance he sits in 2013. He'll play at least 130 game, probably more like 130-140, maybe even 150. Konerko's being on the team has zero effect on that - that is what would have happened either way.

 

There are plenty of good reasons to dislike the PK14 signing. Irrational fears about benching a guy they just signed for $63M is not one of them.

The White Sox have been more than happy to screw around with "Key long-term players" in the past. Repeatedly. Viciedo's callups and position shifts are on that list.

 

More so is the Chris Sale bullpen garbage. Not just sticking him there for 2011, but going so far as to try to push him back there in 2012 only a month into making him a starter.

 

We tried to put the most important long-term piece for the organization in the bullpen forever because of a tired arm, he publicly said "No" and forced his way back into the rotation where he nearly pitched the team to the playoffs that season leading to the remarkable circumstance of a pitcher publicly disagreeing with statements by his manager about how he would be used...and I'm supposed to just trust that we'll treat this piece right because he's an important long term piece and it'd be completely insane to screw around with that important of a long-term piece...which we have a record of doing.

[witesoxfan]

The who is not the point and you know it . The point is we've been fed garbage about competting and getting younger ,more versatile , more speed , better D the future and now we're getting older, less versatile , slower, bad D and the past. I have no idea what the butterfly-effect could be on this team ,what one move that might have been made can effect other moves.

 

If the Sox had intentions of being seriously competitive, then yes, I'd agree. Right now, I ultimately believe this move to be meaningless. They know they are going to struggle/suck this year. If they win 80 games, people will be doing jumping jacks. This is a move to give a veteran player and a guy who has been with the organization almost 15 years a farewell, even if he does not believe it to be a farewell.

 

I'm sure that the Sox will have an offer out to Buehrle too. If he were the 12th pitcher on the roster 3-4 years from now, would you be this upset?

[Dick Allen]

The White Sox have been more than happy to screw around with "Key long-term players" in the past. Repeatedly. Viciedo's callups and position shifts are on that list.

 

More so is the Chris Sale bullpen garbage. Not just sticking him there for 2011, but going so far as to try to push him back there in 2012 only a month into making him a starter.

 

We tried to put the most important long-term piece for the organization in the bullpen forever because of a tired arm, he publicly said "No" and forced his way back into the rotation where he nearly pitched the team to the playoffs that season leading to the remarkable circumstance of a pitcher publicly disagreeing with statements by his manager about how he would be used...and I'm supposed to just trust that we'll treat this piece right because he's an important long term piece and it'd be completely insane to screw around with that important of a long-term piece...which we have a record of doing.

You should send your resume to JR.

[witesoxfan]

It pretty much handcuffs what the Sox can do in the rule V draft as they wont be able to use that spot to carry an extra player that could contribute to the roster long term. If there is no one the Sox think could help long term, it makes sense. But this signing does nothing to move the organization forward.

 

If the Sox take Carlos Perez in the Rule 5 draft, like I believe they will, they can send Phegley to the minors. If they take a reliever, they can send Petricka or Webb down. I fail to see how this affects their rationale in the Rule 5.

[2nd_city_saint787]

How many DH's do you need ? With the Sox defense last year we need all the defensive replacements we can get. Do you want to see PK get a hit in the late innings or extra innings and watch him try to score the winning run ? If the game goes into more innings do you want to have his range at 1st base ? Can he play 3rd base or outfield or catcher when one of our bad offensive players gets pinch hit for ? There's no way you can argue that a team needs more versatility at DH than they do at all the other positions. When you have a team full of offensive and defensive suck yes you need to pinch hit and replace them defensively as much as possible or platoon them in the 1st place . Can PK platoon with anyone but Dunn ? ABreu DH/1st base, Dunn DH /1st Base Konerko DH/1stbase , Viciedo DH/future 1st base . Woo hoo we have a whole team of DH's.

 

 

With the Sox defense last year we need all the defensive replacements we can get- Ok so in a late game situation who do you wanna see replaced? With Leury and/or Danks you clean up 2 positions by putting one of them in CF and moving De Aza to LF where he is better suited. If they carry both Leury and Danks, which is a possibility then you can have Leury at 3B. Who else do you wanna take out?

 

Do you want to see PK get a hit in the late innings or extra innings and watch him try to score the winning run ?- Why can't they just put Danks or Leury in the game to pinch run after Paul gets on?

 

If the game goes into more innings do you want to have his range at 1st base ? Assuming he came in to face a LHP, I'll take that chance all day.

 

Can he play 3rd base or outfield or catcher when one of our bad offensive players gets pinch hit for ? No but Leury Garcia or Jordan Danks can.

 

It's a non story to me. We have the versatility, much like the Indians did last year with players like Aviles and Raburn, to counteract having a player like Pauley(or Giambi in Clevelands case) on the bench.

 

 

 

 

 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

They aren't BSing you. The first baseman in 2014 is a 26 year old Cuban who may be the most prolific hitter in that country's history.

 

Angel Sanchez, Tyler Greene, Koske Fukudome...those are some of the 25th roster spots in the past. Paul Konerko is no worse than those players.

 

Konerko isn't penciled in for 150 starts batting clean up.

Fine see ya in the 10th year of the rebuild when we are the Royals and the Pirates. Look at the trickle down effect of not signing Thome for one year. It's been chronicled before. Signing PK is one less move the Sox could've made. How do I know the road not taken could make all the difference ?

[Dick Allen]

If the Sox take Carlos Perez in the Rule 5 draft, like I believe they will, they can send Phegley to the minors. If they take a reliever, they can send Petricka or Webb down. I fail to see how this affects their rationale in the Rule 5.

Besides, expecting much from the Rule 5 is dreaming.

[Dick Allen]

Fine see ya in the 10th year of the rebuild when we are the Royals and the Pirates. Look at the trickle down effect of not signing Thome for one year. It's been chronicled before. Signing PK is one less move the Sox could've made. How do I know the road not taken could make all the difference ?

Paul Konerko is the 25th man. He isn't expected to be a key contributor. He has signed to occassionally DH, and maybe play 1B on occassion. It isn't remotely like passing on Thome. It is passing on a Tyler Greene-type.

[LittleHurt05]

If the Sox had intentions of being seriously competitive, then yes, I'd agree. Right now, I ultimately believe this move to be meaningless. They know they are going to struggle/suck this year. If they win 80 games, people will be doing jumping jacks. This is a move to give a veteran player and a guy who has been with the organization almost 15 years a farewell, even if he does not believe it to be a farewell.

 

I'm sure that the Sox will have an offer out to Buehrle too. If he were the 12th pitcher on the roster 3-4 years from now, would you be this upset?

 

Is he taking away innings from a top young player that the Sox paid $68 million to? If so, I'll be just as upset.

 

Yesterday they said that PK may face some tough right-handers in place of Abreu. How is he supposed to learn how to hit against a Verlander or Scherzer if he isn't allowed to face them?

Edited December 5, 2013 by LittleHurt05

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

With the Sox defense last year we need all the defensive replacements we can get- Ok so in a late game situation who do you wanna see replaced? With Leury and/or Danks you clean up 2 positions by putting one of them in CF and moving De Aza to LF where he is better suited. If they carry both Leury and Danks, which is a possibility then you can have Leury at 3B. Who else do you wanna take out?

 

Do you want to see PK get a hit in the late innings or extra innings and watch him try to score the winning run ?- Why can't they just put Danks or Leury in the game to pinch run after Paul gets on?

 

If the game goes into more innings do you want to have his range at 1st base ? Assuming he came in to face a LHP, I'll take that chance all day.

 

Can he play 3rd base or outfield or catcher when one of our bad offensive players gets pinch hit for ? No but Leury Garcia or Jordan Danks can.

 

It's a non story to me. We have the versatility, much like the Indians did last year with players like Aviles and Raburn, to counteract having a player like Pauley(or Giambi in Clevelands case) on the bench.

Wonderful Leury Garcia is your answer . Have fun looking up from the bottom again in 2014.

[Balta1701]

I'm sure that the Sox will have an offer out to Buehrle too. If he were the 12th pitcher on the roster 3-4 years from now, would you be this upset?

If we drafted a starter #3 this year, he pitched in AAA the year beforehand, the Sox bring in Buehrle and he's the 6th starter on the roster, and the only guy with options left in the rotation is the former #3 draft pick...wouldn't you be a bit annoyed with competition for him being brought in?

[Balta1701]

You should send your resume to JR.

Your highly detailed, well thought out reply to my post has clearly improved my feelings and I now accept that putting Chris Sale in the bullpen in 2012 was the right decision.

[Dick Allen]

Wonderful Leury Garcia is your answer . Have fun looking up from the bottom again in 2014.

Well, he is a guy whose spot might be taken by Konerko. You complain about Konerko coming back. You write off a young, fast, plus defensive player as well. Just shows, no matter what, you would have complained.

[Y2Jimmy0]

They aren't BSing you. The first baseman in 2014 is a 26 year old Cuban who may be the most prolific hitter in that country's history.

 

Angel Sanchez, Tyler Greene, Koske Fukudome...those are some of the 25th roster spots in the past. Paul Konerko is no worse than those players.

 

Konerko isn't penciled in for 150 starts batting clean up.

 

 

Come on Dick. That's not the issue. Konerko can't play a position other than 1B. Dunn, Abreu, Keppinger, and Gillaspie can all play 1B. It hamstrings what the Sox can do with the roster. If you like the novelty of it then that's fine but bringing Konerko back does nothing to help the long term future of the franchise.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

Paul Konerko is the 25th man. He isn't expected to be a key contributor. He has signed to occassionally DH, and maybe play 1B on occassion. It isn't remotely like passing on Thome. It is passing on a Tyler Greene-type.

You don't know what it's passing on ,no one does, but I'd sure like to find out. But you might be right I am placing to much faith in managements ability to make a right decision for the franchise's future.

[Chicago White Sox]

I do think it's hilarious at one point we refused to bring back Jim Thome because we wanted a "rotating DH" and now we'll enter 2014 with two legitimate DHs on our roster.

 

I'm not going to complain too much about bringing Paulie back, but I seriously hate when people say "it's the 25th man on the roster so who cares" to justify the move. I'm sorry, but even the last guy on the bench has a role to play and can impact the team's W/L regardless of what his WAR might be.

 

Context comes in play here. For example, if Jordan Danks can get to one more ball than Viciedo can late in a game he can have a significant impact outcome of that particular game. The same can go for a pinch runner with elite speed or a backup with tons of defensive flexibility. These guys can have a big impact on close games and how teams do in those games can ultimately make or break a season. Bringing back Konerko limits what our bench will be capable of. Maybe it doesn't matter in this particular season, but if we're legitimately trying to win this move makes any sense IMO.

[witesoxfan]

Fine see ya in the 10th year of the rebuild when we are the Royals and the Pirates. Look at the trickle down effect of not signing Thome for one year. It's been chronicled before. Signing PK is one less move the Sox could've made. How do I know the road not taken could make all the difference ?

 

Thome was going to be the starting DH for the White Sox with Kotsay moving to DH. Thome ultimately signed with the Sox most direct rival and had a monstrosity of a season.

 

Konerko was only going to sign with the White Sox. He is going to be a bench player.

 

Those situations are not comparable. I liken this signing to that Kosuke Fukudome.

 

Besides, expecting much from the Rule 5 is dreaming.

 

Agree 100%. If you can get a bench player out of it, then you are lucky. Most Rule 5 picks are returned to their original teams within the first 2 weeks of Spring Training. The Sox Rule 5 pick last year was so bad, the Angels didn't want him back and he was eventually released.

[Dick Allen]

I do think it's hilarious at one point we refused to bring back Jim Thome because we wanted a "rotating DH" and now we'll enter 2014 with two legitimate DHs on our roster.

 

I'm not going to complain too much about bringing Paulie back, but I seriously hate when people say "it's the 25th man on the roster so who cares" to justify the move. I'm sorry, but even the last guy on the bench has a role to play and can impact the team's W/L regardless of what his WAR might be.

 

Context comes in play here. For example, if Jordan Danks can get to one more ball than Viciedo can late in a game he can have a significant impact outcome of that particular game. The same can go for a pinch runner with elite speed or a backup with tons of defensive flexibility. These guys can have a big impact on close games and how teams do in those games can ultimately make or break a season. Bringing back Konerko limits what our bench will be capable of. Maybe it doesn't matter in this particular season, but if we're legitimately trying to win this move makes any sense IMO.

Well, Konerko did put up a .900+ OPS last year vs. LHP, and he keeps Dunn from hitting against many LHP. It's not like he is totally worthless.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

Well, he is a guy whose spot might be taken by Konerko. You complain about Konerko coming back. You write off a young, fast, plus defensive player as well. Just shows, no matter what, you would have complained.

I write off being forced to accept Leury Garcia because of PK not Leury Garcia.

[2nd_city_saint787]

Paul Konerko is the 25th man. He isn't expected to be a key contributor. He has signed to occassionally DH, and maybe play 1B on occassion. It isn't remotely like passing on Thome. It is passing on a Tyler Greene-type.

 

Exactly, any bench player you bring in isn't going to help them in the future. Hell bringing in Paul could actually help the future by masking Dunns deficiencies against LHP and thus making him look more attractive in a trade around the deadline. The regular rest might also serve him well as well.

[NorthSideSox72]

You have more faith in the White Sox organization and management than I do.

 

Zero to do with faith. If you want to choose to believe some wild, unfounded conspiracy theory about this, go right ahead. But you cannot find any fact in evidence to support it.

 

Again, we are talking about the Sox having paid the largest bonus and contract to an international player.... EVER. On a long term contract, at age 26. Any comparison to someone like Brian Anderson or Hector Santiago are ridiculous. Viciedo was 20 friggin years old and considered raw. None of these are in he same realm as Abreu.

 

Find me a guy the Sox signed for 10's of millions of dollars, then sat in favor of some old guy. Heck, find one instance of that ever in ANY organization. You can't.

 

 

The White Sox have been more than happy to screw around with "Key long-term players" in the past. Repeatedly. Viciedo's callups and position shifts are on that list.

 

More so is the Chris Sale bullpen garbage. Not just sticking him there for 2011, but going so far as to try to push him back there in 2012 only a month into making him a starter.

 

We tried to put the most important long-term piece for the organization in the bullpen forever because of a tired arm, he publicly said "No" and forced his way back into the rotation where he nearly pitched the team to the playoffs that season leading to the remarkable circumstance of a pitcher publicly disagreeing with statements by his manager about how he would be used...and I'm supposed to just trust that we'll treat this piece right because he's an important long term piece and it'd be completely insane to screw around with that important of a long-term piece...which we have a record of doing.

 

See above. You have no related comparison to make here. No organization has ever done what you are suggesting will be done here. There is no foundation in reality for the idea that Abreu struggles and Konerko becomes a starter as a result. Such an occurance has zero chance of happening, and has never happened in any similar way before.

 

The paranoia of some Sox fans astounds me.

 

[Balta1701]

See above. You have no related comparison to make here. No organization has ever done what you are suggesting will be done here. There is no foundation in reality for the idea that Abreu struggles and Konerko becomes a starter as a result. Such an occurance has zero chance of happening, and has never happened in any similar way before.

 

The paranoia of some Sox fans astounds me.

I'm not saying "becomes a starter". Pushes Abreu down to 400-ish PA's? I could totally believe that and that would be almost as dumb as putting Chris Sale in the bullpen was.

 

You changed the game there to say that something has never happened that isn't what I'm fearing. Sending Abreu to the bench 2-3 times a week is what I'm afraid of and it's exactly what I'm expecting.