Steve9347 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jan 10, 2014 -> 10:42 AM) I love Danks and all he's done, but if they could seriously just give Danks away right now, I wouldn't care. This minus the love part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 QUOTE (bmags @ Jan 10, 2014 -> 10:47 AM) Well this has been one of the more interesting offseasons of the last 5 years, that's for sure. Most enjoyable offseason for me since pre 2005. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jan 10, 2014 -> 10:42 AM) I love Danks and all he's done, but if they could seriously just give Danks away right now, I wouldn't care. Gotta disagree with you here. We aren't hurting for money and Danks is four good months away from being a valuable trade deadline chip. Trading him now for pennies on the dollar would be incredibly short-sighted. And for our own competitive purposes, Danks at 95% of his peak performance is still a much better starting option than Rienzo, Paulino, & Surkamp. I'll take my chances he'll be close to his former self in 2014 rather than just give him away in fear he'll never come close to returning to form. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jan 10, 2014 -> 11:00 AM) Gotta disagree with you here. We aren't hurting for money and Danks is four good months away from being a valuable trade deadline chip. Trading him now for pennies on the dollar would be incredibly short-sighted. And for our own competitive purposes, Danks at 95% of his peak performance is still a much better starting option than Rienzo, Paulino, & Surkamp. I'll take my chances he'll be close to his former self in 2014 rather than just give him away in fear he'll never come close to returning to form. Because if he performs anywhere close to his old self, he becomes an extremely valuable, cost-controlled trade chip at worst. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ultimate Champion Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Even a diminished Danks as a #4, being a lefty, is probably going to be about market value by the end of his deal if things keep going as they have been. And if not, and if so much good, pre-arb pitching enters the game that back-end starters aren't going to be paid as much, then he's still probably no more than a $4-5M per over payment, which puts him in reasonable dump territory. OTOH if Danks turns it around he'll have nice value & that will be great for us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jan 10, 2014 -> 10:42 AM) I love Danks and all he's done, but if they could seriously just give Danks away right now, I wouldn't care. I understand, but Tanaka would buy them time in hopes that he rehabs enough to get something back. As of today, Danks is an important part of the rotation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Jan 10, 2014 -> 10:52 AM) If the Sox sign Tanaka you keep Danks and let him rebuild value. Your staff becomes Sale - Tanaka - Quintana - Danks - Johnson with Rienzo-Paulino-Surkamp all ready to fill in. That looks pretty damn good and lets you move Danks once you've gotten his value back up. I just don't have much faith left I Danks these days. He certainly is young enough to rebound but what scares me is his delivery. I could be wrong but has he always showed the ball to the hitters the way he does now? Watching his delivery its like he's telegraphing (tipping) his next pitch to the batter on every pitch. He really does give the batter a good look. I guess it comes down to if you think he can rebound you keep him or if you think he cannot you get out from under him while you can which is what I'm leaning towards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 QUOTE (StRoostifer @ Jan 10, 2014 -> 11:33 AM) I just don't have much faith left I Danks these days. He certainly is young enough to rebound but what scares me is his delivery. I could be wrong but has he always showed the ball to the hitters the way he does now? Watching his delivery its like he's telegraphing (tipping) his next pitch to the batter on every pitch. He really does give the batter a good look. I guess it comes down to if you think he can rebound you keep him or if you think he cannot you get out from under him while you can which is what I'm leaning towards. Just throw out the last two years due to injury. 2012 was related to being injured, and 2013 was his first year back off of surgery. Both of the years he had are "normal" for the surgery he had. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 (edited) QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 10, 2014 -> 11:43 AM) Just throw out the last two years due to injury. 2012 was related to being injured, and 2013 was his first year back off of surgery. Both of the years he had are "normal" for the surgery he had. I totally understand and you're right. I'm just having a difficult time believing he will rebound as long as he keeps showing the ball to hitters the way he does. Edited January 10, 2014 by StRoostifer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 QUOTE (StRoostifer @ Jan 10, 2014 -> 11:50 AM) I totally understand and you're right. I'm just having a difficult time believing he will rebound as long as he keeps showing the ball to hitters the way he does. From 2008 to 2011, Johnny put up WARs of 5.0, 2.9, 4.3, & 3.1. Was he showing the ball to hitters then, because that's an incredibly productive stretch. Even at the low-end of his performance, he's a 3 WAR player and easily worth his contract. I get that we're all disappointed with his 2012 & 2013 seasons, but obviously they were the result of injuries. He should be closer to normal next year and I don't see why a 3.0 WAR is that unreasonable. That's incredibly valuable as our #3 or #4 starter and he gives us a much better chance to win than giving his 30 starts to Rienzo, Paulino, or Surkamp. With or without Tanaka, Danks make sense for our rotation in 2014. Let him rebuild his value and then reevaluate your SP situation. By next year, you may have Beck knocking at the door and/or Hoffman waiting in the wings. Until then, give him 30 starts next year and hope we see the Danks that was one of the better, young left-handed starters from 2008 to 2011. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jan 10, 2014 -> 12:10 PM) From 2008 to 2011, Johnny put up WARs of 5.0, 2.9, 4.3, & 3.1. Was he showing the ball to hitters then This my question. We all know how good Danks was back then so his stats are irrelevant to my question. I really don't recall him showing the ball back then the way he does now which is why I asked the question in the first place. I admit I could be wrong this, I'm just wondering if anyone else has noticed this or is it just me seeing a problem that isn't really a problem? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILMOU Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jan 10, 2014 -> 10:00 AM) Gotta disagree with you here. We aren't hurting for money and Danks is four good months away from being a valuable trade deadline chip. Trading him now for pennies on the dollar would be incredibly short-sighted. And for our own competitive purposes, Danks at 95% of his peak performance is still a much better starting option than Rienzo, Paulino, & Surkamp. I'll take my chances he'll be close to his former self in 2014 rather than just give him away in fear he'll never come close to returning to form. This. Regardless of Tanaka, best to wait on Danks. Value rebuilding could begin with his 1st start, if he's ready. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 QUOTE (StRoostifer @ Jan 10, 2014 -> 12:19 PM) This my question. We all know how good Danks was back then so his stats are irrelevant to my question. I really don't recall him showing the ball back then the way he does now which is why I asked the question in the first place. I admit I could be wrong this, I'm just wondering if anyone else has noticed this or is it just me seeing a problem that isn't really a problem? I don't recall his delivery being noticeably different now versus any time in the past. Any video evidence or something to gnaw on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Danks is already bought and paid for. He's a mid to back end rotation piece. At this point, he will cost us more money to get rid of. So we just have to use whatever productivity we bought from him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 10, 2014 -> 12:25 PM) I don't recall his delivery being noticeably different now versus any time in the past. Any video evidence or something to gnaw on? I was watching pretty close last year to see if his motion changed after surgery and I didn't notice much. However, I was watching mostly shoulder and elbow position and wasn't really paying attention to his wrist/hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 QUOTE (ptatc @ Jan 10, 2014 -> 12:30 PM) I was watching pretty close last year to see if his motion changed after surgery and I didn't notice much. However, I was watching mostly shoulder and elbow position and wasn't really paying attention to his wrist/hand. Since you are here, do you feel reasonably certain that Danks should get his velocity back to "normal" this year? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank_Thomas Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 (edited) So I did a little looking around on the Internet today, just googling Tanaka and the latest news surrounding him. I found it very interesting the White Sox have really been the only team to be rumored and confirmed to have spoken to Tanka and his agent personally. By that I mean, KW, Hahn, and Robin met him in person and told them what they had to offer. Now other teams very well could have done the same thing and the White Sox have been the only team that leaked. However, I find that hard to believe with the hype surrounding Tanaka. That being said, by the Sox showing the respect to show up personably and pitch him with really the three figure heads of the Org. Shouldn't be underestimated. Japan is a culture rooted in respect and by us reaching out like this could go a long way. Finally, I came across a Japanese article saying Tanaka plans to be in LA through Friday to meet teams take a physical and i took it as leave to go back to Japan and think befor 1/24. If that's true the process could be wrapped up as far as Tanaka and teams, obviously the agent and teams will be in contact. But if we were able to impress upon Tanaka in person with those three the significance he could bring to our franchise and city could separate us. It's been said this guy is a low key quiet competitor and exact opposite as Yu was who embraced the rock star figure in Japan. Here's some of the links I came across, that state teams interest, however it was through feeling out and a personal meeting has yet to take place. Again could be nothing but it's odd you haven't heard any other top tier Organizational guys meet Tanaka. Blue Jays: http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/gibbons-c...rest-in-tanaka/ Rangers: http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article/mlb/ranger...p;vkey=news_mlb Angels: http://www.monkeywithahalo.com/2014-articl...son-opener.html Japan News: http://the-japan-news.com/news/article/0000931576 Overall update: http://www.bleachernation.com/2014/01/10/o...rs-posting-fee/ MLB.com Sox article: http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20...sp&c_id=mlb Edited January 10, 2014 by Frank_Thomas35 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Jan 10, 2014 -> 10:58 AM) This minus the love part. That means "I Danks." That makes no sense! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Bob NightengaleVerified account @BNightengale The #Dodgers have let it be known they plan to go all-out in their efforts to sign Tanaka, saying they and certainly won't be out-bid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank_Thomas Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 And then there is this... Via MLbtr just now Dodgers Plan To Go "All Out" To Sign Tanaka By Steve Adams [January 10 at 1:04pm CST] While team president Stan Kasten said in a radio interview yesterday not to predict the Dodgers to land Masahiro Tanaka, Bob Nightengale of USA Today reports (via Twitter) that the Dodgers have made it known that they will go "all out" to sign the Japanese ace and "certainly won't be outbid." Of course, because of the new posting agreement between Major League Baseball and Nippon Professional Baseball, signing Tanaka is no longer simply a matter of outbidding your opponents. Any team that wishes to pay the $20MM posting fee can negotiate with Tanaka as if he were a free agent, and the team would only lose that $20MM if an agreement between the two sides were to be reached. In other words, virtually any team in the Majors can afford to negotiate with Tanaka, and he could have preferences beyond signing for top dollar. We've heard a great number of teams connected to Tanaka over the past two days, as the right-hander is in Los Angeles at this time meeting with teams face-to-face. In the past 24 hours alone, the Yankees, Diamondbacks, Angels, Dodgers, Cubs, White Sox, Blue Jays and Indians have all been linked to Tanaka. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Wellp, it was fun while it lasted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 QUOTE (bmags @ Jan 10, 2014 -> 08:13 PM) Wellp, it was fun while it lasted. I'm not upset...I actually think Garza makes more sense for the Sox. With that said, it wouldn't surprise me at all if in 3 years, the Sox are trying to trade for Tanaka if he disappoints the team he signs with (ie: Contreras) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank_Thomas Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 (edited) QUOTE (bmags @ Jan 10, 2014 -> 01:13 PM) Wellp, it was fun while it lasted. I'm still optimistic, maybe this guy doesn't just want the $. Maybe he wants to be "The Guy" and can certaintly be that here. In the MLBTR update it quote their team president not to predict him to land with LA on a radio show and now this???. This could all be desperation. Although Nightengale is usually damn good and spot on, the winds out of the sail, but I still say we have a chance. Those three don't take that trip if they hadn't been in contact with his agent and believed they had a shot with a good pitch. That coupled with Rocks update with the Accounting Geeks coming together, if we can offer a competitive offer in terms of dollars who know what Hahn can work in the contract and what was said to sell him and separate the south side. Edited January 10, 2014 by Frank_Thomas35 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 QUOTE (Frank_Thomas35 @ Jan 10, 2014 -> 07:18 PM) I'm still optimistic, maybe this guy doesn't just want the $. Maybe he wants to be "The Guy" and can certaintly be that here. In the MLBTR update it quote their team president not to predict him to land with LA on a radio show and now this???. This could all be desperation. Although Nightengale is usually damn good and spot on, the winds out of the sail, but I still say we have a chance. Those three don't take that trip if they hadn't been in contact with his agent and believed they had a shot with a good pitch. That coupled with Rocks update with the Accounting Geeks coming together, if we can offer a competitive offer in terms of dollars who know what Hahn can work in the contract and what was said to sell him and separate the south side. But what about the rumor he wants to play on the west coast? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank_Thomas Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 It would also be interesting to know of this 3 are still out west our have made it back this way. I wish someone had a hook up at American Airlines. Or we could get Clohe O'Brien on it ( sry 24 reference) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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