Elgin-O'Hare Expressway Expansion

[southsider2k5]

Well, I think just about any interstate that carries as much truck traffic as 65 is already 3+ lanes in each direction, and when an interstate has 3+ lanes in each direction, semi trucks are not allowed in the left lane (at least that's the law in every state that I'm aware of). So it's more of a problem on 65 than anywhere else.

 

The problem is it just pushed traffic out another lane. The jackass semi-drivers move to the middle lane going 66. and then the cars going 68 (which is under the Indiana speed limit for those who don't know) in the left lane to pass.

[Balta1701]

China 352.5 people per square mile

US 79.5 people per square mile

Which should mean that the U.S. actually has a whole lot fewer difficulties with "lots of people living on the land we need" as well. Both countries have large geographic obstacles, but if you want to build something new in China there's probably something already sitting there you have to demolish.

[Balta1701]

The problem is that the population density out there is nil compared to many other places in the world that have high speed rail.

The thing you have to view it as is hitting areas that aren't well suited for either air travel or car travel. Denver to Chicago is probably best served by air travel, but Chicago to Detroit/Indy/Milwaukee/St. Louis, you spend 4x the time at airport security as you do in the air. Same thing on the U.S. East coast, where the population density is the highest in the country and you have large cities that would be ideally connected by HSR. San Francisco, Las Vegas, L.A., and San Diego makes sense as well.

[NorthSideSox72]

Which should mean that the U.S. actually has a whole lot fewer difficulties with "lots of people living on the land we need" as well. Both countries have large geographic obstacles, but if you want to build something new in China there's probably something already sitting there you have to demolish.

However, China's government probably has no hesitation in simply plowing right over those properties. That becomes much more difficult (though not impossible) in the US.

 

Acquiring right-of-ways for any new lines is a huge obstacle in this country. They need to focus on using the land they already have access to, to a great extent.

 

[Balta1701]

However, China's government probably has no hesitation in simply plowing right over those properties. That becomes much more difficult (though not impossible) in the US.

 

Acquiring right-of-ways for any new lines is a huge obstacle in this country. They need to focus on using the land they already have access to, to a great extent.

And "The land already accessible" is often terrible for HSR because you can't, you know, make sharp turns.

[LittleHurt05]

Which should mean that the U.S. actually has a whole lot fewer difficulties with "lots of people living on the land we need" as well. Both countries have large geographic obstacles, but if you want to build something new in China there's probably something already sitting there you have to demolish.

 

And in China the people have no say and whatever needs to get demolished does immediately, even if it affects people living there. They also have workers that work for pennies under much worse conditions than in America. It's much easier to get stuff built when there are very little rules the government has to follow.

[NorthSideSox72]

And "The land already accessible" is often terrible for HSR because you can't, you know, make sharp turns.

That's why I said "to the extent possible". You can work with the ROW's you have, and make only the changes necessary. You can also focus on doing land swaps and making your angle changes in places it is easier to do. Point is, while it would be nice to simply draw straight lines between cities, that is basically impossible. Start with what you have, work out from there.

 

[NorthSideSox72]

I also think that Elon Musk's idea of above-ground tube systems (hyperloop), which will be much faster and much cheaper to operate than HSR, are a better long term plan anyway. Can be operated using mostly solar energy from the tubes themselves, equipment is cheaper, land acquisition is easier in some ways, it is much cheaper to build and dynamic trip costs are much lower. It just makes so much sense. If you want to go full-leap, that is a better way to go than HSR, IMO.

 

 

[Balta1701]

I also think that Elon Musk's idea of above-ground tube systems (hyperloop), which will be much faster and much cheaper to operate than HSR, are a better long term plan anyway. Can be operated using mostly solar energy from the tubes themselves, equipment is cheaper, land acquisition is easier in some ways, it is much cheaper to build and dynamic trip costs are much lower. It just makes so much sense. If you want to go full-leap, that is a better way to go than HSR, IMO.

Just so it's said, pretty much all of this isn't true. And one more link for good measure.

[NorthSideSox72]

Just so it's said, pretty much all of this isn't true. And one more link for good measure.

I've read that first one before I think, it sure sounded familiar. It reminds me of the book that quy wrote about the evils of recycling, the name of which escapes me (but which I read). It is good for pointing out some flaws, but it then makes unfounded leaps while taking in external costs and additions without doing the same on the other side. That article does not come close to saying it isn't all true - in fact it reinforces it is mostly true, but that (duh) it is a prototype idea that will have a lot of variance when studied in greater detail for true cost.

 

I am not an engineer at all, but I have read articles on this, positive and negative, and I am sold on it being worth pursuing, at least to the point of getting real, practical cost and efficiency measures for a few given routes. Then an actual decision can be made.

 

[southsider2k5]

Which should mean that the U.S. actually has a whole lot fewer difficulties with "lots of people living on the land we need" as well. Both countries have large geographic obstacles, but if you want to build something new in China there's probably something already sitting there you have to demolish.

 

What is means is they have five times more people to support a rail system. That is why they don't really go anywhere in the US, except on the East Coast, where there is some real population density.

[southsider2k5]

The thing you have to view it as is hitting areas that aren't well suited for either air travel or car travel. Denver to Chicago is probably best served by air travel, but Chicago to Detroit/Indy/Milwaukee/St. Louis, you spend 4x the time at airport security as you do in the air. Same thing on the U.S. East coast, where the population density is the highest in the country and you have large cities that would be ideally connected by HSR. San Francisco, Las Vegas, L.A., and San Diego makes sense as well.

 

This is a product of the last 10 years, which is nothing in terms of time for infrastructure planning.

[Iwritecode]

Well, I think just about any interstate that carries as much truck traffic as 65 is already 3+ lanes in each direction, and when an interstate has 3+ lanes in each direction, semi trucks are not allowed in the left lane (at least that's the law in every state that I'm aware of). So it's more of a problem on 65 than anywhere else.

 

It happens on the I-90 tollway between Elgin and Rockford. They just finally got around to starting construction to add a 3rd lane last summer. They might finally finish it sometime next year.

 

When the weather was decent there were signs saying the trucks should drive in the left lane. Now since the construction is on hold for the winter the trucks just drive in both lanes for no reason at all.

 

 

[Balta1701]

This is a product of the last 10 years, which is nothing in terms of time for infrastructure planning.

It's approximately right at the bottom of infrastructure spending as share of GDP and right around at the time when everything was reaching obsolescence everywhere.

[RockRaines]

The thing you have to view it as is hitting areas that aren't well suited for either air travel or car travel. Denver to Chicago is probably best served by air travel, but Chicago to Detroit/Indy/Milwaukee/St. Louis, you spend 4x the time at airport security as you do in the air. Same thing on the U.S. East coast, where the population density is the highest in the country and you have large cities that would be ideally connected by HSR. San Francisco, Las Vegas, L.A., and San Diego makes sense as well.

TSA pre-check dude. I get to the airport, walk right to my gate, get on plane, 40 min later land in Minny. So fast.

[RockRaines]

It happens on the I-90 tollway between Elgin and Rockford. They just finally got around to starting construction to add a 3rd lane last summer. They might finally finish it sometime next year.

 

When the weather was decent there were signs saying the trucks should drive in the left lane. Now since the construction is on hold for the winter the trucks just drive in both lanes for no reason at all.

The 90 construction ends in 2016.

[Iwritecode]

The 90 construction ends in 2016.

 

[RockRaines]

Quite possibly the worst construction project ive ever seen, its right up there with Wacker Drive. The difference here is that its SOOOOO Long, its taking SOOOO Long and it always appears that they are doing no work.

[Iwritecode]

Quite possibly the worst construction project ive ever seen, its right up there with Wacker Drive. The difference here is that its SOOOOO Long, its taking SOOOO Long and it always appears that they are doing no work.

 

I think (hope) it will be worth it in the end. It’ll be nice having that extra lane the entire way.

 

Driving it everyday, I can tell that they’ve actually done quite a bit of work. There were a number of overpasses that they had to tear down and rebuild that they finished surprisingly quick.

 

[RockRaines]

I think (hope) it will be worth it in the end. It’ll be nice having that extra lane the entire way.

 

Driving it everyday, I can tell that they’ve actually done quite a bit of work. There were a number of overpasses that they had to tear down and rebuild that they finished surprisingly quick.

Admitedly I only drive it to Galena or Madison but why did they have to do the entire stretch at once?

[NorthSideSox72]

Admitedly I only drive it to Galena or Madison but why did they have to do the entire stretch at once?

It might be cheaper and ultimately faster (in terms of total time of work) to do it in one shot.

 

[StrangeSox]

The circle interchange rebuild is going to be a nightmare for years to come.

[southsider2k5]

The circle interchange rebuild is going to be a nightmare for years to come.

 

That is going to be a clusterf*** of epic proportions when it is done... But at the same time it needs to be done worse than any other traffic project in the metro area. It is just a disaster through there. There has got to be a better way to do that.

[mr_genius]

i wish the Kennedy expressway could be fixed. i hate the traffic on there so much.

[RockRaines]

That is going to be a clusterf*** of epic proportions when it is done... But at the same time it needs to be done worse than any other traffic project in the metro area. It is just a disaster through there. There has got to be a better way to do that.

I am not sure its going to improve much based on what I saw, the streets suspended over Greek Town will suck.