2014-2015 NFL Football thread

[LittleHurt05]

LaCanfora reporting that Trestmans job security is tenuous, and players have tuned the coaching staff out, as well as a lot of in-fighting.

 

Well, 2014-2015 was fun like a root canal

 

With the Vikings win yesterday, the Bears now have sole possession of last place in the NFC Norris.

[RockRaines]

Throw some money at Harbaugh

[Kyyle23]

Throw some money at Harbaugh

 

I would like that, I just dont think Emery would be able to cede the control that Harbaugh would want.

 

you just dont want Harbaugh in Ann Arbor (should it be green? )

[Chisoxfn]

LaCanfora reporting that Trestmans job security is tenuous, and players have tuned the coaching staff out, as well as a lot of in-fighting.

 

Well, 2014-2015 was fun like a root canal

Remember the guy complaining about Trestman this preseason. Oh yeah, that was me.

[Chisoxfn]

I would like that, I just dont think Emery would be able to cede the control that Harbaugh would want.

 

you just dont want Harbaugh in Ann Arbor (should it be green? )

Emery should be fired then.

[iamshack]

Considering that we've heard SF has tuned Harbaugh out, why do we want to bring him here again?

[bmags]

Eh, philly tuned Reid out too. I'll take 3 years of greatness and then a bad year and fire him for a more cerebral guy the players like.

[Kyyle23]

Remember the guy complaining about Trestman this preseason. Oh yeah, that was me.

 

And i said I wanted to see this coaching staff take the next step. They havent. Bets are off

[GoSox05]

Harbaugh and Cutler together. Pure comedy.

[bmags]

The thing is, I'm kind of terrified the lesson the McCaskeys would have learned from the Emery experiment. I honestly have no idea what their takeaway would be.

[RockRaines]

Considering that we've heard SF has tuned Harbaugh out, why do we want to bring him here again?

What NFL team doesnt eventually tune out the head coach? A long term HC in the NFL is an outlier at this point.

[iamshack]

The thing is, I'm kind of terrified the lesson the McCaskeys would have learned from the Emery experiment. I honestly have no idea what their takeaway would be.

I hope it isn't "the Emery experiment," and more so "the Trestman experiment."

 

I think Emery tried to hire the next Belichick instead of the next John Harbaugh or Mike Tomlin or Mike McCarthy.

 

[iamshack]

What NFL team doesnt eventually tune out the head coach? A long term HC in the NFL is an outlier at this point.

Yeah, but that team is as big a mess as ours is at this point.

 

Just doesn't seem like a great solution to me. I could certainly be wrong.

[bmags]

I hope it isn't "the Emery experiment," and more so "the Trestman experiment."

 

I think Emery tried to hire the next Belichick instead of the next John Harbaugh or Mike Tomlin or Mike McCarthy.

 

I'm not sure a GM should get two cracks at an HC, especially when they fired a coach after a 10-6 campaign.

[RockRaines]

Yeah, but that team is as big a mess as ours is at this point.

 

Just doesn't seem like a great solution to me. I could certainly be wrong.

But they were VERY strong before they "tuned him out." I'll take his success compared to what we have been through.

[iamshack]

I'm not sure a GM should get two cracks at an HC, especially when they fired a coach after a 10-6 campaign.

I don't think there should be any arbitrary or inflexible rules, but what do I know.

 

I do like the offensive roster he has put together, despite his decision to extend Cutler. Rating his work on the defensive end of the ball is a bit more complex. The defense was going to need a bit of an overhaul regardless, and the jury is still out on his restructuring of that, IMHO.

[iamshack]

But they were VERY strong before they "tuned him out." I'll take his success compared to what we have been through.

Given the likely commitment that might require financially and in terms of authority, I'll pass.

 

But reasonable people can certainly disagree.

[Chisoxfn]

Considering that we've heard SF has tuned Harbaugh out, why do we want to bring him here again?

Easy. From whta I've heard, the front office doesn't like him. The players, while a few might not like him, seem to produce for him. Players don't like Belliceck a lot either but he wins and they put up with it. Harbaugh's biggest issue is the disconnect between him and the front office.

 

Harbaugh has an excellent track record in the pros and college. Trestman has the track record of a guy that could never be a head coach. Just saying what the rest of the league thought for 10+ years and one organization took a chance and it appears such decision was a bad one. I've said from the beginning my concerns with him were on leading the organization and the more and more that comes out here it appears that is absolutely the case. I hope we see them come out and smash the Packers but I have zero optimism right now (and I'm an optimist).

[Chisoxfn]

I hope it isn't "the Emery experiment," and more so "the Trestman experiment."

 

I think Emery tried to hire the next Belichick instead of the next John Harbaugh or Mike Tomlin or Mike McCarthy.

I don't really see how Emery was more so the next Belichick vs. the other guys you mentioned? Belicheck, prior to taking the Pats job, was extremely well thought of and had turned down previous coaching offers from what I recall. By the way, I wish we could have any of those coaches on that list you put out. I'd rank McCarthy last on that list of 3 guys though. You will point out the Steelers inconsistencies but in general, I like Tomlin as a leader and I like the physicality in which his teams play (and his record is still pretty good, including success in the postseason). He's also had to deal with the turning of the roster, etc, and it appears the players like playing for him, but at the same time, he doesn't put up with excuses, etc.

[Chisoxfn]

I'm not sure a GM should get two cracks at an HC, especially when they fired a coach after a 10-6 campaign.

And when your biggest move was giving a QB like Jay this much money. If Jay doesn't pan out and we stink, Emery has to go down with the ship as well. Fair or not, he has made some pretty big personell mistakes in his time.

[iamshack]

Easy. From whta I've heard, the front office doesn't like him. The players, while a few might not like him, seem to produce for him. Players don't like Belliceck a lot either but he wins and they put up with it. Harbaugh's biggest issue is the disconnect between him and the front office.

 

Harbaugh has an excellent track record in the pros and college. Trestman has the track record of a guy that could never be a head coach. Just saying what the rest of the league thought for 10+ years and one organization took a chance and it appears such decision was a bad one. I've said from the beginning my concerns with him were on leading the organization and the more and more that comes out here it appears that is absolutely the case. I hope we see them come out and smash the Packers but I have zero optimism right now (and I'm an optimist).

The Niners had put together an extremely talented roster and failed to get over the hump. They have lost some of that depth and are now 4-4. One game better than the Bears. They haven't played Seattle yet. Why are we pining for someone else's mediocrity over our own at this point?

 

I know we need to look deeper than just this year's team's current record. I realize a coach can have a bad year and still remain a good coach. Just look at what Andy Reid has done with KC after 2012 in Philadelphia. That being said, I don't view Harbaugh as any being an incredible organizational leader. As you admitted, he seems to have issues with his own front office. He has behaved questionably on the sidelines at times. He is allowing a player alleged to have beaten a female to continue to play. He made the decision to elevate Kaepernick over Alex Smith, despite the latter's success. The jury is still out on the results of that decision, but they certainly are in question at this point.

 

I confess I don't follow the Niners extremely closely, but I just don't see much there in terms of Harbaugh's leadership capabilities that would convince me to give up the necessary dollars and authority to bring him in right now.

[iamshack]

I don't really see how Emery was more so the next Belichick vs. the other guys you mentioned? Belicheck, prior to taking the Pats job, was extremely well thought of and had turned down previous coaching offers from what I recall. By the way, I wish we could have any of those coaches on that list you put out. I'd rank McCarthy last on that list of 3 guys though. You will point out the Steelers inconsistencies but in general, I like Tomlin as a leader and I like the physicality in which his teams play (and his record is still pretty good, including success in the postseason). He's also had to deal with the turning of the roster, etc, and it appears the players like playing for him, but at the same time, he doesn't put up with excuses, etc.

Belichick was a decent coach but certainly not viewed as the next big thing or anything. And that's fine...obviously he had some incredible capacity for innovation, which, when paired with a HoF quarterback, has resulted in some incredible results. It is that sort of innovative capacity which I think Emery was looking for when he hired Trestman.

[LittleHurt05]

The Niners had put together an extremely talented roster and failed to get over the hump. They have lost some of that depth and are now 4-4. One game better than the Bears. They haven't played Seattle yet. Why are we pining for someone else's mediocrity over our own at this point?

 

I know we need to look deeper than just this year's team's current record. I realize a coach can have a bad year and still remain a good coach. Just look at what Andy Reid has done with KC after 2012 in Philadelphia. That being said, I don't view Harbaugh as any being an incredible organizational leader. As you admitted, he seems to have issues with his own front office. He has behaved questionably on the sidelines at times. He is allowing a player alleged to have beaten a female to continue to play. He made the decision to elevate Kaepernick over Alex Smith, despite the latter's success. The jury is still out on the results of that decision, but they certainly are in question at this point.

 

I confess I don't follow the Niners extremely closely, but I just don't see much there in terms of Harbaugh's leadership capabilities that would convince me to give up the necessary dollars and authority to bring him in right now.

 

This is a very good post, I like your thinking here.

[iamshack]

And when your biggest move was giving a QB like Jay this much money. If Jay doesn't pan out and we stink, Emery has to go down with the ship as well. Fair or not, he has made some pretty big personell mistakes in his time.

It's easy to criticize this move today. However, this move was not particularly questioned when it was made. The alternative was to franchise him and shift towards developing the next quarterback, but given our relative success with that over the years (as well as the general difficulty that is thought to entail throughout the League), I'm not sure that move wouldn't have been met with far worse backlash (at the time, as well as today).

[Chisoxfn]

It's easy to criticize this move today. However, this move was not particularly questioned when it was made. The alternative was to franchise him and shift towards developing the next quarterback, but given our relative success with that over the years (as well as the general difficulty that is thought to entail throughout the League), I'm not sure that move wouldn't have been met with far worse backlash (at the time, as well as today).

I think a lot of the bigger media had questioned the move when it was made. The reality was an alternative option was there, which was to franchise the QB. In fact, a lot of people said why give Cutler that much money when you had McCown produce just as well and have you seen enough out of Jay to think that he is different than the pre-trestman Jay. I am not saying everyone thought that, but there were plenty that did. If I recall, the view of Cutler signing for so much money was not thought of as a good idea by all, not even a vast majority of national pundits.

 

In terms of Harbaugh, this Niners team has had injuries to a ton of stars and most everyone would have expected a slow start given. Harbaugh inherited an awful team and turned them almost immediately into a perennial super bowl contender. He has had success with two different QB's.

 

And when you refer to Reid, I believe I was adamant that he was option 1 through 10 for the Bears to hire. I wanted Reid more then anyone and was very clear about how great of a coach I thought he was. Was he ready to leave Philly, sure, but was he still elite, absolutely and while KC isn't great, he's done a heck of a lot for a team that isn't exactly loaded with talent and a lot of that has to do with strong coaching across the board.

 

I just have a very hard time defending what the Bears have done. I think a lot of the warnings signs were already there. Whether we chose to see them or not, it wasn't like warnings signs weren't there and stuff came totally unexpected. I am an optimist by nature and I have been more negative about certain instances of this football team in the last two years then in any year with Lovie Smith. And I'm not saying we would be better / worse with Lovie, etc. Not getting into that, just looking at the current facts and we went from a roster generally perceived as being one to contend (and viewed as the top destination) to potentially having a not so good roster, with a QB whose cap hit far exceeds his value.