2014-2015 NFL Football thread

[Kyyle23]

So Jermon Bushrod was doing some sort of promotional appearance with the Score yesterday, and during the course of the interview he admitted that they(most of the team) found out about the QB change just like everyone else did, through social media, NOT FROM THE HEAD COACH.

 

 

[Y2Jimmy0]

So Jermon Bushrod was doing some sort of promotional appearance with the Score yesterday, and during the course of the interview he admitted that they(most of the team) found out about the QB change just like everyone else did, through social media, NOT FROM THE HEAD COACH.

 

 

Yep. Sounds like Trestman talked with the QB's on Tuesday. He was going to wait until Wednesday to tell the team and then the story was leaked Tuesday night (Probably from Cutler's camp). Only 10 days left of the Marc Trestman era.

[clyons]

Does Jim Harbaugh have what it takes to be Head Coach and GM? Does it make sense to offer him both positions with the Bears? Is that even the ideal arrangement? IIRC, only Pete Carroll has won a Super Bowl under it.

[witesoxfan]

Does Jim Harbaugh have what it takes to be Head Coach and GM? Does it make sense to offer him both positions with the Bears? Is that even the ideal arrangement? IIRC, only Pete Carroll has won a Super Bowl under it.

 

Carroll only gets final say on players. John Schneider is the GM there.

[Dick Allen]

In a way I can see this but in the Bears situation they are going to be hurt by the Cutler money for the next couple years no matter what happens. If Emery is the guy in charge still making decisions I have zero faith that he will have the homerun type drafts that this team will so desperately need in order to even compete in the near future. If Emery is fired that's a hell of a lot of pressure for the next guy (who will be brought in by Ted Phillips I might add ) to hit on nearly every draft pick and none of which will be a QB to set this team up in the future. There arent any Andrew Luck quality QB coming out of college next year.

Yes. I read the cash value of Cutler's contract is $3 million more than the contracts of Rodgers, Newton, Luck, Sanchez and Wilson combined. In a salary cap league, that's a bit of a problem.

[Chisoxfn]

Does Jim Harbaugh have what it takes to be Head Coach and GM? Does it make sense to offer him both positions with the Bears? Is that even the ideal arrangement? IIRC, only Pete Carroll has won a Super Bowl under it.

That pretty much never works. And Carroll is not the GM.

[Jenksismyhero]

Barnwell made a good point about this benching - doesn't it sort of suggest a deal is already in place to move him? Otherwise why give up your negotiating position so soon? If no deal is in place, the Bears have let it be known that they now HAVE to get rid of him. They've lost a lot of bargaining power.

Edited December 19, 2014 by Jenksismybitch

[bmags]

Barnwell made a good point about this benching - doesn't it sort of suggest a deal is already in place to move him? Otherwise why give up your negotiating position so soon? If no deal is in place, the Bears have let it be known that they now HAVE to get rid of him.

 

You are looking for rational thought.

[Jenksismyhero]

You are looking for rational thought.

 

True. But in terms of management of the personnel and making moves, I think Emery has done a good job. He's just missed (horribly) on which guys to get.

[Kyyle23]

True. But in terms of management of the personnel and making moves, I think Emery has done a good job. He's just missed (horribly) on which guys to get.

 

So you think he evaluates personnel and management well, but in the end he still makes the wrong decision? Yet, he has done a good job?

[Chisoxfn]

Barnwell made a good point about this benching - doesn't it sort of suggest a deal is already in place to move him? Otherwise why give up your negotiating position so soon? If no deal is in place, the Bears have let it be known that they now HAVE to get rid of him. They've lost a lot of bargaining power.

Not when it is done by the head coach and not the GM. This is not the tandem working in unison. I think to read into this like something is done or agreed to would be irrational.

[clyons]

That pretty much never works. And Carroll is not the GM.

 

Well, Carroll is Vice President of Football Operations. Pete hired John Schneider, who has the title of GM, but reports to him. So Pete's pretty much the man who runs the Seahawks.

 

[Chisoxfn]

So you think he evaluates personnel and management well, but in the end he still makes the wrong decision? Yet, he has done a good job?

Yeah, I'm not following the logic. I suppose you could say, he realized our oline stunk and our defense stunk and tried to make changes but you and I could have realized that too. Doesn't make us that good. Fact of the matter the moves that have been made, largely haven't panned out. I guess to really make a decision I'd need to know what has been going through Emery's mind during this season and be a fly into what he did, how he's responded, conversations he's had with the coaches, how involved he really was with the coaching staff, etc. And even than I still think the write answer is to start over because this has turned into such a historical failure. This is literally the worse Bears season of my life. And it isn't like they have been dominant for the majority of my life.

[2nd_city_saint787]

Yes. I read the cash value of Cutler's contract is $3 million more than the contracts of Rodgers, Newton, Luck, Sanchez and Wilson combined. In a salary cap league, that's a bit of a problem.

 

And yet they'll have the 10th most cap space next year and can get out of Jays contract for just a 3 mill cap hit the following year.

[Chisoxfn]

Well, Carroll is Vice President of Football Operations. Pete hired John Schneider, who has the title of GM, but reports to him. So Pete's pretty much the man who runs the Seahawks.

It is much different though in the sense that Schneider, by all accounts, is extremely involved and handles the vast majority of the personell moves, with Pete having contractual control but largely he relies on Schneider. Harbaugh has indicated he isn't all that interested in those aspects, would want some say, but mainly wants to be with an organization where he is appreciated, has people who support him and let him do his thing and allow him to get to his goal of winning a superbowl. I actually think for all of those reasons, Chicago is literally the perfect place for him because we tend to have an ownership group who is pretty patient with its people, etc. We just need to let the people our ownership group hands the reigns to be football people.

 

I think we need a good pro consultant though to help with this process (Wolf / Holmgren / Polian).

[Dick Allen]

And yet they'll have the 10th most cap space next year and can get out of Jays contract for just a 3 mill cap hit the following year.

Yes, but the holes are enormous.

[Chisoxfn]

And yet they'll have the 10th most cap space next year and can get out of Jays contract for just a 3 mill cap hit the following year.

In theory, even if we were going to draft a QB this year, it is highly unlikely that we would be able to get one of the two top QB's, which means we are looking in the 2nd / 3rd round for someone. Those guys aren't going to just get handed the job, so I don't necessarily think we are done with Cutler just yet. I think a lot of this will be determined when the season ends and we see what direction the team heads in. If somehow people stick around, I think Jay will be out, if it is new people, than I think there is less pressure on them to make a move and they could tell McCaskey's, we will find a QB we think is the right fit, but in the meantime build up the rest of this football roster and while doing that we could still potentially be competitive depending on what our new coach can get out of Jay with a plan of walking away in year 3 when it is cheaper.

 

And if I were the Bears, I certainly wouldn't just indicate we were done with Cutler. If you are going to have any hope of moving him and maybe even getting something of value, we'll at least want to put out the act that we still think he can do it. Heck, think of how Alex Smith was done in San Fran, Harbaugh comes in, and bam, Smith takes steps forward.

[Chisoxfn]

Yes, but the holes are enormous.

I don't think we are as bad of a team as we have looked. We have areas that need to be fixed, no doubt, but I think the right coach could put a lot of makeup on this mess. Part of that is because I do think Trestman is that bad...like one of the worst head coaches ever. I presume the stories that will come out will just be flabbergasting in regards to lack of leadership, tone at the top, etc.

[clyons]

It is much different though in the sense that Schneider, by all accounts, is extremely involved and handles the vast majority of the personell moves, with Pete having contractual control but largely he relies on Schneider. Harbaugh has indicated he isn't all that interested in those aspects, would want some say, but mainly wants to be with an organization where he is appreciated, has people who support him and let him do his thing and allow him to get to his goal of winning a superbowl. I actually think for all of those reasons, Chicago is literally the perfect place for him because we tend to have an ownership group who is pretty patient with its people, etc. We just need to let the people our ownership group hands the reigns to be football people.

 

I think we need a good pro consultant though to help with this process (Wolf / Holmgren / Polian).

 

Yeah, I get that Schneider is more of a partner than a puppet. Title semantics asides, I was trying to use Carroll as an example of a successful, former college coach who was lured to the NFL (ahead of the NCAA posse, I know) with more than your "average" head coach authority. I was not sure whether that would be needed to get Harbaugh, or if he was even interested in that.

 

By many accounts (I think it was mentioned earlier in the thread), the McCaskey's reportedly love him like a son, so I assume appreciation (the kind that isn't measure with $$$$) would not be a problem here.

[illinilaw08]

And yet they'll have the 10th most cap space next year and can get out of Jays contract for just a 3 mill cap hit the following year.

 

Four of those guys are in rookie deals, so it's not really an apt comparison either.

 

Barnwell had a good column yesterday that included a bunch of Cutler trade scenarios...

 

http://grantland.com/the-triangle/chicago-...tler-scapegoat/

[shipps]

And yet they'll have the 10th most cap space next year and can get out of Jays contract for just a 3 mill cap hit the following year.

 

Really? This is intriguing.

 

Also Hub Arkish apparently hinted at the idea of Holmgren possibly come into the position if Emery is to be fired. He has had a relationship with the McCaskeys. That could be thing.

[Chisoxfn]

Really? This is intriguing.

 

Also Hub Arkish apparently hinted at the idea of Holmgren possibly come into the position if Emery is to be fired. He has had a relationship with the McCaskeys. That could be thing.

I know he failed with the Browns but he was successful in Seattle and obviously in Green Bay. I guess the question with Holmgren is, does that mean we go cheaper on a coach, cause my #1 priority is Jim Harbaugh. I presume they could work together as long as their egos could fit into a room and Holmgren would probably hire a young personnel guy who could be groomed and do a lot of the heavy lifting and probably would be groomed into the role of GM. That would obviously be extremely expensive for the Bears though.

[Jenksismyhero]

So you think he evaluates personnel and management well, but in the end he still makes the wrong decision? Yet, he has done a good job?

 

I'm saying he has negotiated well and used his assets wisely (e.g., getting Marshall for a 3rd round pick, waiting on the Forte deal and getting a very reasonable deal for the best all around back in football, etc.). He plays the mechanics of the GM game well, which is why giving up so much negotiation leverage just to prove a point to a QB suggests a deal has already been made. It's possible he's making a stupid move, but I don't see the track record for that.

[shipps]

I know he failed with the Browns but he was successful in Seattle and obviously in Green Bay. I guess the question with Holmgren is, does that mean we go cheaper on a coach, cause my #1 priority is Jim Harbaugh. I presume they could work together as long as their egos could fit into a room and Holmgren would probably hire a young personnel guy who could be groomed and do a lot of the heavy lifting and probably would be groomed into the role of GM. That would obviously be extremely expensive for the Bears though.

 

I dont think there is any chance they will bring in both Holmgren AND Harbaugh. That would be outrageous money that the McCaskeys will not spend. And they will still be paying Phil and Trestman to not even be here.

[Jenksismyhero]

Let's bring this back to the NFL thread:

 

Yeah, I'm not following the logic. I suppose you could say, he realized our oline stunk and our defense stunk and tried to make changes but you and I could have realized that too. Doesn't make us that good. Fact of the matter the moves that have been made, largely haven't panned out. I guess to really make a decision I'd need to know what has been going through Emery's mind during this season and be a fly into what he did, how he's responded, conversations he's had with the coaches, how involved he really was with the coaching staff, etc. And even than I still think the write answer is to start over because this has turned into such a historical failure. This is literally the worse Bears season of my life. And it isn't like they have been dominant for the majority of my life.

 

This is sort of my issue - nearly every move was met with "yeah, I like it!" Some people criticized his out of the box hire with Trestman, but none of the REAL criticism showed up until about week 5 of this year. Last year he was a genius. No one criticized the move to get rid of Peppers and sign Allen. We all knew Allen wasn't going to lead the league in sacks, but his no-show is an abnormality. His pick of a CB over a safety is just preference, it's not some terrible decision.

 

Emery deserves to be fired because he's ultimately responsible for this team, a team that under performed, a team led by a guy that shouldn't be a coach in this league. I think the majority of his decisions were sound and made sense, they just didn't work out as planned.

 

edit: he should also be fired for not stepping in to control the situation as it spiraled out of control too. That's a huge failing on his part.

Edited December 19, 2014 by Jenksismybitch