Asking Prices Beginning to Fall

[Dick Allen]

#1) If those guys were 4/$40, they wouldn't be on the free agent market. They MAY take that over 3 years.

#2) $40 over 3 years is just under $14 mill a year. Guess what Dunn's annual average salary was?

#3) Since when in is $40 million *cheap*?

Well you sure have changed. When you wanted Salty for $44 million, you said that wasn't a lot of money in today's game.

[Marty34]

Are you one of these people that go to the store and buy something you don't need just because it was on sale?

 

Yes. I can afford to.

[witesoxfan]

No. The Sox had an old core in 2011.

 

One that was coming off an 88 win season where the lack of a productive DH was by far the biggest thing holding them back.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

I genuinely don't think you understand the definition of the word cheap. If Adam Dunn is not cheap, then neither Ervin Santana nor Ubaldo Jimenez are cheap. They will be making the same amount of money, roughly.

I think cheap for Jimenez and Santana would fall in the 2 yr. under 9M a yr. or less category. Garza got 4yrs. AAV $13M .

[witesoxfan]

I think cheap for Jimenez and Santana would fall in the 2 yr. under 9M a yr. or less category. Garza got 4yrs. AAV $13M .

 

I think that's pretty spot on.

[caulfield12]

Well you sure have changed. When you wanted Salty for $44 million, you said that wasn't a lot of money in today's game.

 

 

It isn't a huge amount of money if you get a franchise catcher who's in his prime.

 

Salty isn't quite that player, though, just like a #3/4 starter isn't their biggest need AT THE CURRENT MOMENT.

 

Cheap is relative. We were willing to pay Tanaka over $125 million, probably a bigger gamble than Abreu's deal, which was already the biggest free agent signing in White Sox history.

 

The Abreu deal could be the biggest bargain this side of Sale/Quintana, or it could end up being the first noose tied around Hahn's neck.

 

 

 

 

[Marty34]

One that was coming off an 88 win season where the lack of a productive DH was by far the biggest thing holding them back.

 

Yes and that's a case against the prevailing thought of spending money when "we're ready to win."

[caulfield12]

Dunn was supposed to be the final piece in that moment, just like Javy in 2006 or Cabrera/Swisher pre-2008.

 

Logical enough moves at the time...although obviously none of them worked out.

 

 

We're a catcher, legit closer, DH/LH power bat and probably one more starting pitcher away from being competitive. Completely different situations.

 

There's a very good possibility we'll change our LF, SS and 2B in the next 12-16 months as well.

[witesoxfan]

Yes and that's a case against the prevailing thought of spending money when "we're ready to win."

 

What? Because the White Sox signed a guy who'd put up an OPS of .850 or .900 or more for like 8 straight seasons and then he has one of the worst, most disappointing seasons of all time, THAT'S a reason to not spend money until you're ready to win.

 

This isn't about your opinion. You are wrong, and I have no problem saying that, because what you are suggesting is completely irrational and so far the opposite as to what teams would normally do that you are doing nothing but trolling at this point.

 

Here is EXACTLY what you have suggested thus far:

 

-Sign a starting pitcher in his early 30s for a rebuilding club while giving up a draft pick when the team already has 7 starting pitchers it can use.

-Do not sign a player when the team is ready to win and they have a hole to fill because that is not the time to spend money.

 

Got it.

[Y2Jimmy0]

I think that's pretty spot on.

 

 

Nobody is ever going to give up a draft pick for a 2 year deal though. Both of these guys should have accepted the QO immediately.

[ILMOU]

With the price these guys are going to sign for, there's no upside to waiting for next year.

 

You obviously missed the part about getting a player you want, the six man rotation, the part about being forced to play a guy whether he sucks or not (like Adam Dunn, for instance), the part about the advantage of going for two QO FA's, which we're obviously not going to do now, basically all of it. If you're not even going to read the posts, but merely chime back with the same pat answers...well, good luck.

 

[Marty34]

You obviously missed the part about getting a player you want, the six man rotation, the part about being forced to play a guy whether he sucks or not (like Adam Dunn, for instance), the part about the advantage of going for two QO FA's, which we're obviously not going to do now, basically all of it. If you're not even going to read the posts, but merely chime back with the same pat answers...well, good luck.

 

I think those things are all outweighed by the price these guys are going for right now.

 

 

[witesoxfan]

I want to reiterate two things very quickly.

 

#1

Rick Hahn has said the White Sox are not interested in anything that involves the White Sox giving up a draft pick, and you aren't bringing in Bronson Arroyo to trade him considering he turns 37 in 20 days, so that should summarily end this thread before it begins.

 

It did not, so I'm reposting in hopes it does.

 

#2

I think those things are all outweighed by the price these guys are going for right now.

I disagree with what you say but will defend to the death your right to say it.

[BlackSox13]

Anyone care to guess how long before this thread is closed, like the other two?

[Kyyle23]

Anyone care to guess how long before this thread is closed, like the other two?

 

if people actually care to debate points that havent been beaten to death, it will remain open

[southsider2k5]

if people actually care to debate points that havent been beaten to death, it will remain open

 

Translation: Odds are pretty high it will be closed after about 40 pages of pointless tangents and arguments.

[BlackSox13]

if people actually care to debate points that havent been beaten to death, it will remain open

This is why I remain silent on the issue, just don't know what else to say that hasn't been said already in the other two threads. Not trying to troll, just having a little fun since the Sox rumor mill so incredibly boring right now.

[Joxer_Daly]

I disagree with what you say but will defend to the death your right to say it.

 

 

This line works on so many levels. I tip my hat to you, Sir.

[SCCWS]

Not necessarily.

 

A lot depends on where Bogaerts ends up.

 

They already have Nava, Gomes, Victorino and Jackie Bradley.

 

For the moment, he's the starting SS and could be moved to 3B, but he could also end up in LF (let's say they brought Drew back at mid-season, for example).

 

Obviously, they have a big hole to fill in CF, but Bradley has a ton of ability and they'll give him half the season to prove himself (see Brian Anderson in 2006).

 

They also have Grady Sizemore for what that means. Bradley has some injury concerns, Sizemore has many more and Victorino is a wall-crash away from another one. So local media thinks they still could add another CF type.

Edited February 4, 2014 by SCCWS

[Jose Abreu]

They also have Grady Sizemore for what that means. Bradley has some injury concerns, Sizemore has many more and Victorino is a wall-crash away from another one. So local media thinks they still could add another CF type.

Sorry but what does this have to do with asking prices of staring pitchers beginning to fall?

[witesoxfan]

Sorry but what does this have to do with asking prices of staring pitchers beginning to fall?

 

Threads are dynamic and tend to change topics. He was responding to someone asking him why he thought the Red Sox would need De Aza. It's perfectly fine.

[Jose Abreu]

Threads are dynamic and tend to change topics. He was responding to someone asking him why he thought the Red Sox would need De Aza. It's perfectly fine.

Wasn't really referring to him but more to the Red Sox posters in general. Used his quote because it was most recent

[ILMOU]

if people actually care to debate points that havent been beaten to death, it will remain open

 

Do you think the market might drive players back to their current teams for something similar to their QO?

 

Kendrys, for instance, would look good for us NEXT year if Tank doesn't improve at the plate.

[SCCWS]

Sorry but what does this have to do with asking prices of staring pitchers beginning to fall?

 

 

If the asking prices of FA starting pitching falls, most likely the asking price for trading extra starting pitching will fall also. Boston has 6+ starters and may be looking for outfield help.

[caulfield12]

Do you think the market might drive players back to their current teams for something similar to their QO?

 

Kendrys, for instance, would look good for us NEXT year if Tank doesn't improve at the plate.

 

 

Maybe...but then you're talking about adding some 30+ (and injury-prone in this case) players to the core, it's going to have to be the perfect situation in terms of years and numbers to make it work. One of those situations like a Jermaine Dye where the player's coming off an injury or not at the peak of their value (and opposite of the Dunn contract, in other words).

 

Victor Martinez was also mentioned as a possibility.