Tyler Flowers is your 2014 starting catcher

[Jake]

Flowers has struck out this spring more than Phegley and Nieto combined.

 

It is a good thing that it isn't a "who strikes out least" contest or else we would have picked the wrong guy

[winninguglyin83]

Sure sounds like the Sox believe that Flowers is considerably ahead of Phegley as a receiver, thrower and handler of pitchers because offensively both guys are meh.

 

so you go with the better defensive player and let the guy with options try to improve his issues in the minors because he has options.

 

it's an issue, but not surprising for a team with a ceiling of third place.

 

My guess is finding a catcher is on Line 1 or 2 of Hahn's Things To Do List.

[SoxAce]

Well.. at least he can take a walk.

[LittleHurt05]

Flowers has struck out this spring more than Phegley and Nieto combined.

 

6 Ks in 26 ABs as opposed to 5 Ks in 34 ABs. Might as well cut Flowers.

[ILMOU]

Tyler exuding huge confidence in his abilities by expressing surprise in being named starter.

 

http://www.csnchicago.com/white-sox/tyler-...tarting-catcher

 

"Don't they know I suck?"

[Buehrle>Wood]

6 Ks in 26 ABs as opposed to 5 Ks in 34 ABs. Might as well cut Flowers.

Can we please?

[Baron]

Tyler exuding huge confidence in his abilities by expressing surprise in being named starter.

 

http://www.csnchicago.com/white-sox/tyler-...tarting-catcher

 

"Don't they know I suck?"

 

Oh they do...unfortunately this is one problem they havent solved yet. They have to go with the tallest midget at this point.

Edited March 18, 2014 by Baron

[harfman77]

Least surprising reveal. Ever. Makes perfect sense as he is the guy that the pitchers feel most comfortable with and the strength of this team should be its pitching. No reason not to roll the dice on him and see if he can finally put it together, it give Phegley time in AAA to work through things and get ready to step back up, if he does put a good season together you have an answer at C, if not he can be DFA'ed whenever you have a better option available.

[bmags]

Tyler exuding huge confidence in his abilities by expressing surprise in being named starter.

 

http://www.csnchicago.com/white-sox/tyler-...tarting-catcher

 

"Don't they know I suck?"

Pitchers love throwing to Flowers.

 

In every scenario, yes they do

[SCCWS]

6 Ks in 26 ABs as opposed to 5 Ks in 34 ABs. Might as well cut Flowers.

 

 

I'll simplify it so you can understand. Flowers struck out more than any catcher in baseball last year based on number /AB. 6 out of 26 is a small sampling and it is only the mid-point of Spring training, but it is also against a range of ML to Class A pitchers. On a team that needs offense, he may be headed for a worst season this year.

[Princess Dye]

I'll simplify it so you can understand. Flowers struck out more than any catcher in baseball last year based on number /AB. 6 out of 26 is a small sampling and it is only the mid-point of Spring training, but it is also against a range of ML to Class A pitchers. On a team that needs offense, he may be headed for a worst season this year.

 

 

In the 315 PAs before last year he had a 700 OPS. So by your metric we're to only consider his 275 PAs last year? Is that fair to him? Take his successes and failures into account. Offensively he's subpar and defensively he's well-rounded enough. That doesnt equal league-worst anything.

 

If he takes his career 650 OPS up this year, by having say a 700 OPS again-- with a little more health now -- you can do a lot worse for what he makes. He makes peanuts.

 

My guess is this year we will have a guy who will be out a TON and also hit 15,17 bombs. And be just fine defensively, good not great. You get what you pay for and someone who does that stuff for less than $1M can be on my team. Catcher is wrongly looked at here as The Only Hole.

Edited March 18, 2014 by Jose Paniagua

[witesoxfan]

I'll simplify it so you can understand. Flowers struck out more than any catcher in baseball last year based on number /AB. 6 out of 26 is a small sampling and it is only the mid-point of Spring training, but it is also against a range of ML to Class A pitchers. On a team that needs offense, he may be headed for a worst season this year.

 

So you'd prefer they start either a guy who was even worse than him in the majors or a guy who has never played a game above A+?

 

It's not a good option, but Tyler Flowers is absolutely the Sox best option at this point. I wish it weren't so, but it is, so there's no time to dwell.

 

(I was wrong on this front too, but it is what it is)

[TaylorStSox]

I still think he has some upside with the bat and he calls a good game. This is the perfect opportunity to find out one way or the other.

[SCCWS]

So you'd prefer they start either a guy who was even worse than him in the majors or a guy who has never played a game above A+?

 

It's not a good option, but Tyler Flowers is absolutely the Sox best option at this point. I wish it weren't so, but it is, so there's no time to dwell.

 

(I was wrong on this front too, but it is what it is)

NO. Flowers may be the only viable option. My problem is with Robin 's quote that "he has done a good job and he is picking up offensively. " He strikes out more than any catcher in baseball based on at bats and he has done the same so far in spring training.

[SCCWS]

In the 315 PAs before last year he had a 700 OPS. So by your metric we're to only consider his 275 PAs last year? Is that fair to him?

 

You need to read what I said. He strikes out more than any catcher in baseball. Last year he struck out 37% of the times he came to bat. I gave him a break using last year. If you add inyour 315 PA before last year it jumps up to 39%. To put it in perspective, that is about 5% worse than Adam Dunn. Regardless of what he makes, he may actually strike out more than anyone in baseball

 

[harfman77]

You need to read what I said. He strikes out more than any catcher in baseball. Last year he struck out 37% of the times he came to bat. I gave him a break using last year. If you add inyour 315 PA before last year it jumps up to 39%. To put it in perspective, that is about 5% worse than Adam Dunn. Regardless of what he makes, he may actually strike out more than anyone in baseball

 

Thats the White Sox way. You can only acquire so many guys with contact issues before it bites you. The organizations obsession with RH power over all else is troubling, mainly because none of these athletic power types have hit enough to make the power play.

 

Tflow just needs to play his game, if it isn't enough than the org can move on knowing it exhausted his opportunities. Last year should have been that year, but the org appears to have given him a mulligan either because of his injuries, the lack of any other good options, or a combination of the two.

[witesoxfan]

NO. Flowers may be the only viable option. My problem is with Robin 's quote that "he has done a good job and he is picking up offensively. " He strikes out more than any catcher in baseball based on at bats and he has done the same so far in spring training.

 

Well, considering Ventura sees almost all of his sidework and doesn't base every judgment he makes based on game situations during Spring Training, while also likely seeking counsel from those who may know as much or more than him regarding the judgment of hitters, I'm going to take his word before yours.

 

Also, strike outs are still outs. So are ground outs, so are fly outs. Outs are outs. Get over it.

[Vigs0220]

T-Flow

 

More like T-Blow.

 

 

He will not be the starting catcher come May 1st.

[Princess Dye]

He will not be the starting catcher come May 1st.

What is the thing that will happen on May 1st.

[Jake]

He played so badly, but focusing on strikeouts is misguided. Just focus on all of the hits he didn't get and walks he didn't take

[Steve9347]

He will not be the starting catcher come May 1st.

I pray you are correct. I bet you are not.

[Dick Allen]

He played so badly, but focusing on strikeouts is misguided. Just focus on all of the hits he didn't get and walks he didn't take

There are no players with BABIP at .000, so excessive strikeouts do matter. An out isn't always just an out, and if Flowers or any other player made more contact, their other offensive numbers should improve.

[BlackSox13]

Personally, I like strikeouts. With a base runner at first, Tyler striking out means he didn't hit into a DP.

[Eminor3rd]

There are no players with BABIP at .000, so excessive strikeouts do matter. An out isn't always just an out, and if Flowers or any other player made more contact, their other offensive numbers should improve.

 

He didn't say they don't matter, he just said that focusing on them rather than his overall output is misguided. Strikeouts can be a factor to a low BA which is a factor to a low OBP, so as a diagnostic, they matter. I think Jake is just saying that, at the end of the day, if he would just get on base at a .330+ clip, we don't care if every out he made is a strikeout. Looking at the Ks can be missing the forest for the trees.

 

If you're drilling down to find out what is bad about a guy, strikeouts are important. But if you're deciding whether or not a guy is bad, they aren't. You wouldn't say "he sucks because he strikes out too much," rather, "he sucks because he doesn't get on base enough," and strike outs may or may not be a factor in that.

Edited March 20, 2014 by Eminor3rd

[Dick Allen]

He didn't say they don't matter, he just said that focusing on them rather than his overall output is misguided. Strikeouts can be a factor to a low BA which is a factor to a low OBP, so as a diagnostic, they matter. I think Jake is just saying that, at the end of the day, if he would just get on base at a .330+ clip, we don't care if every out he made is a strikeout. Looking at the Ks can be missing the forest for the trees.

 

If you're drilling down to find out what is bad about a guy, strikeouts are important. But if you're deciding whether or not a guy is bad, they aren't. You wouldn't say "he sucks because he strikes out too much," rather, "he sucks because he doesn't get on base enough," and strike outs may or may not be a factor in that.

You can put it any way you want to put it, but if a guy has trouble making contact and doesn't get on base very much, pretty much like little league, he sucks. Exceptions are the big power hitters who get on base a lot. There have been several guys you can look away at the k-rate because of the other numbers they put up. But as of now, Tyler Flowers isn't one of these guys and he sucks as a major league hitter and his strikeouts are a problem.