Eminor3rd Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 05:20 PM) You can lose that way, or you can lose rebuilding, but some how losing and rebuilding (not spending money) is a victory to some. Marty. Seriously. Don't pretend like you think rebuilding is about the present and not the future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 07:16 PM) His .350 OBP is closer to his true talent than his .312. That is NOT what I asked. I asked what he would do if called up right now. You can't even answer the question spelled out 100% clearly because then you can't b**** about Dunn. And if his long-term ability is .350 OBP in the big leagues I'll acutally be seriously impressed. Because his OBP in A and AA ball is .349 and .353 overall; keeping up your A ball numbers is usually a big jump. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 (edited) QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 06:25 PM) Right. Because Jose Abreu is 27 and they're paying him $10m/yr, which is very much not 32+ and $15-25m like I just said. Yes, but you still said even if he couldn't play, blowing $60 million wasn't a big deal.if Hamilton lives up to half his contract, if you are consistent, it won't be that big of a deal,and worth the gamble signing him. Edited March 23, 2014 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 (edited) QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 06:26 PM) Marty. Seriously. Don't pretend like you think rebuilding is about the present and not the future. You prefer losing and not spending money to losing and spending money. I don't see the difference. Edited March 23, 2014 by Marty34 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 06:31 PM) That is NOT what I asked. I asked what he would do if called up right now. You can't even answer the question spelled out 100% clearly because then you can't b**** about Dunn. And if his long-term ability is .350 OBP in the big leagues I'll acutally be seriously impressed. Because his OBP in A and AA ball is .349 and .353 overall; keeping up your A ball numbers is usually a big jump. .330 obp, right now today if he gets 300 AB's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 07:33 PM) .330 obp, right now today if he gets 300 AB's. You will come out and actually predict that a guy who put up a .312 OBP in AAA will improve significantly by coming up to the big leagues. Sigh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 06:25 PM) Right. Because Jose Abreu is 27 and they're paying him $10m/yr, which is very much not 32+ and $15-25m like I just said. What is the difference? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 05:31 PM) You prefer losing and not spending money to losing and spending money. I don't see the difference. Becuase one leads to years of continued losing, the other leads to improving and eventually winning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILMOU Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 05:34 PM) What is the difference? You don't seem to grasp the basic concept that the money available for payroll is not endless. Yes, Reinsdorf is rich, but he didn't get that way by signing huge checks for bad investments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 05:31 PM) Yes, but you still said even if he couldn't play, blowing $60 million wasn't a big deal. Yes, $10m per year wasted is 33% less painful than $15m, and 60% less painful than $25m. And, given his youth, a busted Abreu is likely to be less useless than a busted Santana (who would ruin entire games by himself) or busted Hamilton (who would likely not even play because he'd be injured). Not sure why you think there's no difference. I would rather pay a bust like a league average player than I would pay him like a superstar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 05:34 PM) What is the difference? Are you joking? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 06:37 PM) Becuase one leads to years of continued losing, the other leads to improving and eventually winning. Not really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 05:44 PM) Not really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2nd_city_saint787 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 The way I'm understanding him is it's either go for younger prospects and trade Sale or go for ML ready spects and drop big money. It's not a dreadful view on his part IMO, but the fact of the matter is they DID try to spend big on Tanaka and McCann, and they did spend big on Abreu...After missing out on those guys you can make the argument that the other guys were just not worth it. So now, I don't see any problem in waiting till next year, when they'll have even more money, to spend on actual impact players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 QUOTE (Stan Bahnsen @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 06:40 PM) You don't seem to grasp the basic concept that the money available for payroll is not endless. Yes, Reinsdorf is rich, but he didn't get that way by signing huge checks for bad investments. One World Series title in 30 years, 15 postseason wins. By all accounts a great guy to work for though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 06:20 PM) You can lose that way, or you can lose rebuilding, but some how losing and rebuilding (not spending money) is a victory to some. Said only Marty, ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 QUOTE (scs787 @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 06:48 PM) The way I'm understanding him is it's either go for younger prospects and trade Sale or go for ML ready spects and drop big money. It's not a dreadful view on his part IMO, but the fact of the matter is they DID try to spend big on Tanaka and McCann, and they did spend big on Abreu...After missing out on those guys you can make the argument that the other guys were just not worth it. So now, I don't see any problem in waiting till next year, when they'll have even more money, to spend on actual impact players. This ownership has publicly tried for 30 years now, but they always come back to taking half-measures for the problems they have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted March 24, 2014 Share Posted March 24, 2014 QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 06:42 PM) Not sure why you think there's no difference. I would rather pay a bust like a league average player than I would pay him like a superstar. So would I, but he is still a bust. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2nd_city_saint787 Posted March 24, 2014 Share Posted March 24, 2014 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 06:54 PM) This ownership has publicly tried for 30 years now, but they always come back to taking half-measures for the problems they have. Wouldn't signing Santana after missing out on Tanaka be taking half-measures? I know you'll say he's better than Paulino, but he does offer an intriguing upside if Coop can get him to harness his stuff. It's entirely possibly that Coop thinks Paulino could be better than Santana. If that's the case it makes sense to see what you have in him while also seeing how guys like Beck and Bassit develop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted March 24, 2014 Share Posted March 24, 2014 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 06:14 PM) So would I, but he is still a bust. What's your point? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted March 24, 2014 Share Posted March 24, 2014 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 02:34 PM) I don't know that Garcia can be a franchise-changing player. Best speed/power position player prospect since Ray Durham. Mike Cameron? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted March 24, 2014 Share Posted March 24, 2014 QUOTE (scs787 @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 07:16 PM) Wouldn't signing Santana after missing out on Tanaka be taking half-measures? I know you'll say he's better than Paulino, but he does offer an intriguing upside if Coop can get him to harness his stuff. It's entirely possibly that Coop thinks Paulino could be better than Santana. If that's the case it makes sense to see what you have in him while also seeing how guys like Beck and Bassit develop. It is signing Carlos Boozer after missing out on Lebron. Not only is it a half measure, it is a half measure that could cripple what the franchise wants to do in the future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted March 24, 2014 Share Posted March 24, 2014 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 07:39 PM) It is signing Carlos Boozer after missing out on Lebron. Not only is it a half measure, it is a half measure that could cripple what the franchise wants to do in the future. There's no salary cap in MLB, but other than that small fact you are all over it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty34 Posted March 24, 2014 Share Posted March 24, 2014 QUOTE (ptatc @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 07:32 PM) Mike Cameron? Forgot about him, good comparison in power/speed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILMOU Posted March 24, 2014 Share Posted March 24, 2014 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Mar 23, 2014 -> 06:41 PM) There's no salary cap in MLB, but other than that small fact you are all over it. You seem to believe we can sustain a $220M payroll with our current revenue streams. Just admit this and we can all save a lot of time here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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