Beckham, Keppinger to DL

[Marty34]

Come on Balta, you're better than this. This post is something I would expect from Marty.

 

I clearly explained where I was coming from and why.

 

For someone who throws names around (mine) you certainly have one thin skin.

[Eminor3rd]

[GreenSox]

They're not going to just dump or completely bench DeAza and Beckham.

 

Hahn will wait until/unless he can get a reasonable return, if possible.

As he should.

This idea of giving players away, which would require a rush-job with Semien to accomplish, is daft.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

Well, that's by your definition. If a player can come up and play ball better than a guy that's had five years to put it together but hasnt , that's not emotional at all. Its about a young guy getting a chance and ends up playing better ball than his predecessor so the team stays with the young guy.

 

Speaking of emotions. If Semien plays well, sticking with Beckham despite Semien playing well and despite Beckham having five seasons to prove himself is an emotional attachment to Beckham.

 

Now were both just full of "emotions" now aren't we...

This is a very tough call. On one hand Balta is right. What Semien did last year at the ML level screams for more AAA time. However what he did in spring training is screaming I'm ready now. Which situation do you think is more indicative of the truth ?

 

Marcus played at 3 levels last year , then the AZ. Fall League. If his AFL performance is any indication he was worn out by then. In ST he hit well and took his walks , easily leading the Sox with 9 when the next closest guy had only 5.

 

If you want to argue Beckham was rushed and somehow it hurt his development ,go for it ,but at some point the talent has to show. One case does not apply to another case.

 

I've argued in the past about maximaizing what you get in trades for guys like Beckham , Gillaspie, De Aza, Viciedo when rebuilding but sometimes you have to bite the bullet and get nothing close to what you had hoped to and just be happy you have someone who can step right in.

 

Finally depth at 2nd base with Carlos Sanchez and Micah Johnson means even if Marcus gets sent down where will all these guys play ? Who's the better SS Semien or Sanchez ? Does it make sense to get sent down and play out of position ?

 

Bottom line if Semien is ready then play him . At least 2nd base will be one position out of the way during the rebuild and Sanchez and Micah are good problems to have.

Edited March 30, 2014 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[Balta1701]

Finally depth at 2nd base with Carlos Sanchez and Micah Johnson means even if Marcus gets sent down where will all these guys play ? Who's the better SS Semien or Sanchez ? Does it make sense to get sent down and play out of position ?

Micah is starting at AA, he only spent a month or so there last year. Sanchez, Semien, and Davidson all have room to play in AAA for now, you could even add Leury in possibly as a utility guy as well.

[oldsox]

Surely, the Yanks and Hahn must have talked about Beckham. Wish I knew the details.

[ScottyDo]

This is a very tough call. On one hand Balta is right. What Semien did last year at the ML level screams for more AAA time. However what he did in spring training is screaming I'm ready now. Which situation do you think is more indicative of the truth ?

 

Marcus played at 3 levels last year , then the AZ. Fall League. If his AFL performance is any indication he was worn out by then. In ST he hit well and took his walks , easily leading the Sox with 9 when the next closest guy had only 5.

 

If you want to argue Beckham was rushed and somehow it hurt his development ,go for it ,but at some point the talent has to show. One case does not apply to another case.

 

I've argued in the past about maximaizing what you get in trades for guys like Beckham , Gillaspie, De Aza, Viciedo when rebuilding but sometimes you have to bite the bullet and get nothing close to what you had hoped to and just be happy you have someone who can step right in.

 

Finally depth at 2nd base with Carlos Sanchez and Micah Johnson means even if Marcus gets sent down where will all these guys play ? Who's the better SS Semien or Sanchez ? Does it make sense to get sent down and play out of position ?

 

Bottom line if Semien is ready then play him . At least 2nd base will be one position out of the way during the rebuild and Sanchez and Micah are good problems to have.

Never, ever put stock in ST numbers

[BlackSox13]

This is a very tough call. On one hand Balta is right. What Semien did last year at the ML level screams for more AAA time. However what he did in spring training is screaming I'm ready now. Which situation do you think is more indicative of the truth ?

 

Marcus played at 3 levels last year , then the AZ. Fall League. If his AFL performance is any indication he was worn out by then. In ST he hit well and took his walks , easily leading the Sox with 9 when the next closest guy had only 5.

 

If you want to argue Beckham was rushed and somehow it hurt his development ,go for it ,but at some point the talent has to show. One case does not apply to another case.

 

I've argued in the past about maximaizing what you get in trades for guys like Beckham , Gillaspie, De Aza, Viciedo when rebuilding but sometimes you have to bite the bullet and get nothing close to what you had hoped to and just be happy you have someone who can step right in.

 

Finally depth at 2nd base with Carlos Sanchez and Micah Johnson means even if Marcus gets sent down where will all these guys play ? Who's the better SS Semien or Sanchez ? Does it make sense to get sent down and play out of position ?

 

Bottom line if Semien is ready then play him . At least 2nd base will be one position out of the way during the rebuild and Sanchez and Micah are good problems to have.

It really is a tough call. I agree with Balta that it would be better for Semien to play ball down at Charlotte to work on the BB/K rate as Balta had pointed out. Balta and I really aren't that far off as far as I can tell.

 

My point of view is solely based on the big IF Semien does play well in Beckham's absence then stick with Semien and see how he handles the extended playing time. Worst case scenario, Semien shows signs that he's not quite ready yet and goes to Charlotte as is kind of expected anyway so its really not a bad scenario at all.

 

I think what will happen with depth is Semien would go to Charlotte to play second, Sanchez will play SS and for now Johnson will be at Birmingham. It was speculated that with Johnsons speed he could end up in the outfield. If true then Johnson could play for an outfield position at Charlotte after he shows what he can do at Birmingham. The speculation makes sense given his speed and the possibility of Semien and Sanchez eventually taking over 2B and SS in the future, whenever that is.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

Micah is starting at AA, he only spent a month or so there last year. Sanchez, Semien, and Davidson all have room to play in AAA for now, you could even add Leury in possibly as a utility guy as well.

But since Micah is in AA and Davidson entrenched at 3rd that leaves SS and 2nd base at AAA between Semien and Sanchez which is why I asked who's the better SS ? Which one would be playing out of position ? I don't think either one is a natural SS .

 

I guess best case scenario is both make it to The Show ,Semien as the starter at 2nd since he has more pop and Sanchez as the versatile backup since he's a singles hitter so you play Sanchez at SS in AAA. But there's only so long you can let the incumbents show their worth and if Beckham hasnt shown much in all this time chance are he isn't going to.

 

Other GM's know Hahn is rebuilding for a quick turnaround. He doesn't have time to always let guys like Beckham prove they're worth a decent prospect. Dunn and Konerko are gone next year if not sooner. Decisions have to be made fairly quickly on Beckham, De Aza, Gillaspie and Viciedo. Beckham has maybe to the trade deadline to show big improvement to net us anything of value. The next candidate needs time to show he can hack it at this level too. The more that happens the longer the rebuild takes.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

Never, ever put stock in ST numbers

That's what some people say but it is there for a reason. Boggs was cut because he sucked in the spring. Plenty of people think Jordan Danks has shown his worth because of his spring.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

Micah is starting at AA, he only spent a month or so there last year. Sanchez, Semien, and Davidson all have room to play in AAA for now, you could even add Leury in possibly as a utility guy as well.

Micah at AA for a month last year and the AA playoffs and gets named the MVP of the playoffs. Would be so cool if he was legit. I'm really excited about him.

[Balta1701]

But since Micah is in AA and Davidson entrenched at 3rd that leaves SS and 2nd base at AAA between Semien and Sanchez which is why I asked who's the better SS ? Which one would be playing out of position ? I don't think either one is a natural SS .

 

I guess best case scenario is both make it to The Show ,Semien as the starter at 2nd since he has more pop and Sanchez as the versatile backup since he's a singles hitter so you play Sanchez at SS in AAA. But there's only so long you can let the incumbents show their worth and if Beckham hasnt shown much in all this time chance are he isn't going to.

 

Other GM's know Hahn is rebuilding for a quick turnaround. He doesn't have time to always let guys like Beckham prove they're worth a decent prospect. Dunn and Konerko are gone next year if not sooner. Decisions have to be made fairly quickly on Beckham, De Aza, Gillaspie and Viciedo. Beckham has maybe to the trade deadline to show big improvement to net us anything of value. The next candidate needs time to show he can hack it at this level too. The more that happens the longer the rebuild takes.

They should alternate between 2b and SS, giving them both a chance to work at the various positions and potentially give us replacements who can cover the full middle infield. This isn't as hard of a problem as you're making it out to be. Worst case scenario they can't really cut it and occasionally back up Alexei there.

[caulfield12]

That's what some people say but it is there for a reason. Boggs was cut because he sucked in the spring. Plenty of people think Jordan Danks has shown his worth because of his spring.

 

That, and the fact they could put Boggs at Charlotte to fix to try to fix things at that level while still keeping Cleto.

 

Arguably, spring training did matter, in the sense that Cleto throwing so well (96-98 MPH already) opened a lot of eyes and they knew they couldn't pass him through waivers without losing him.

Edited March 31, 2014 by caulfield12

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

They should alternate between 2b and SS, giving them both a chance to work at the various positions and potentially give us replacements who can cover the full middle infield. This isn't as hard of a problem as you're making it out to be. Worst case scenario they can't really cut it and occasionally back up Alexei there.

Alexei is now one of the elder statesmen. How long do you think he'll be around ? Alexei is 10 yrs. older than some of these guys.

[caulfield12]

Alexei is now one of the elder statesmen. How long do you think he'll be around ? Alexei is 10 yrs. older than some of these guys.

 

Until the end of his contract if Semien can't play big league SS.

 

 

[BlackSox13]

Until the end of his contract if Semien can't play big league SS.

Or until Sanchez shows he's ready. Kid is still just 21 entering his second season at Charlotte. Hopefully a strong winter and spring training translate at Charlotte this year.

[Balta1701]

Alexei is now one of the elder statesmen. How long do you think he'll be around ? Alexei is 10 yrs. older than some of these guys.

Just my personal guess, I think they'll wait for someone to pay a really good price for Alexei in a trade. I think it will happen either this year or next year.

[ScottyDo]

That's what some people say but it is there for a reason. Boggs was cut because he sucked in the spring. Plenty of people think Jordan Danks has shown his worth because of his spring.

Well, I should modify my statement. You can show you completely suck in Spring Training, but you can't show you're awesome. Every professional player has a good couple of weeks. There's no way to know whether those couple of weeks are sustainable, though. Thus, Boggs can pitch his way out of a job, but Semien shouldn't be able to play his way onto the team unless he's completely proven his mettle in his development process. He hasn't yet. Soon.

[Eminor3rd]

Well, I should modify my statement. You can show you completely suck in Spring Training, but you can't show you're awesome. Every professional player has a good couple of weeks. There's no way to know whether those couple of weeks are sustainable, though. Thus, Boggs can pitch his way out of a job, but Semien shouldn't be able to play his way onto the team unless he's completely proven his mettle in his development process. He hasn't yet. Soon.

 

But Beckham is hurt, and so he IS playing in the Majors now. So how he performs during the season SHOULD count toward whether or not he stays.

 

I don't THINK he's ready either, but since we're going to find out now anyway, it would be senseless to jerk him around if he's raking. If he still looks rough around the edges, then sure, send him down. My point is just that there should be a scenario where he keeps the job, and that is that he looks ML ready when he's filling in.

[Balta1701]

But Beckham is hurt, and so he IS playing in the Majors now. So how he performs during the season SHOULD count toward whether or not he stays.

 

I don't THINK he's ready either, but since we're going to find out now anyway, it would be senseless to jerk him around if he's raking. If he still looks rough around the edges, then sure, send him down. My point is just that there should be a scenario where he keeps the job, and that is that he looks ML ready when he's filling in.

If Beckham is out for 6 weeks and Semien tears it up, fine, I'll count that, but we're still talking like a week of time at the most right? If he goes 15/20 on the week, is that a sign that he's ready? I can use the Josh Phegley example here, 10 for his first 36 with 3 HR, then 15 for his next 86 with a .386 OPS.

[Dick Allen]

If Beckham is out for 6 weeks and Semien tears it up, fine, I'll count that, but we're still talking like a week of time at the most right? If he goes 15/20 on the week, is that a sign that he's ready? I can use the Josh Phegley example here, 10 for his first 36 with 3 HR, then 15 for his next 86 with a .386 OPS.

I think Beckham is supposed to return Saturday or Sunday. If Semien is hot, I would have no problem keeping him around until he cools off, but the Sox aren't going to bench Beckham, and it makes little sense to have Semien riding pine when AAA experience is something he has very little. Maybe something else happens, but like you said you can't judge ready in 3 or 4 games. You can judge not ready in that time.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

Well, I should modify my statement. You can show you completely suck in Spring Training, but you can't show you're awesome. Every professional player has a good couple of weeks. There's no way to know whether those couple of weeks are sustainable, though. Thus, Boggs can pitch his way out of a job, but Semien shouldn't be able to play his way onto the team unless he's completely proven his mettle in his development process. He hasn't yet. Soon.

I think you can show you're awesome. Puig last year in ST was a monster and was sent down, Then when he was brought back up he was still a monster. I'm sure there are plenty of other examples of rookies kicking butt in spring going on to having good years and careers though I'm sure there are even more who kicked ass in ST and went on to have nothing careers.

[greg775]

This is Semien's chance to please many of us and make Beckham just a bad memory. Please, please Semien don't pull a Flowers/Phegley. Hit the ball and steal the job from Beckham so we can trade him upon his return from the DL. Cmon Semien it's your chance to be a big leaguer for the next 10 years. Just hit the fricking ball, find some holes in the defense, and draw a lot of walks, too.

[southsider2k5]

Daryl Van Schouwen ‏@CST_soxvan now

 

Ventura doesn't expect Gordon Beckham back on this road trip, which ends Wednesday. Playing it safe w oblique strain.

[Jose Abreu]

RV says Thurs at earliest for Beckham return