Avisail Garcia's Flaws

[Vance Law]

I still think Avi should be used as a trade chip if there is a team out there that projects him as a future star. I've watched all of his at bats closely this year, and it's amazing how much he struggles to square up any pitch over 90 mph. I'm not sure if it's due to the labrum injury, but he's going down the same path as other previous Sox youngsters like Josh Fields. I've been impressed by his ability to work the count, as he's not chasing a lot of pitches out of the zone.

 

To my eye, his approach and his ability to (intentionally) hit the ball the other way with authority distinguishes him from many typical White Sox busts.

 

My concerns with him are whether or not he can round himself into an average right fielder and keep up the patience/higher walk rate he's displayed in Sept.

[Eminor3rd]

Sorry, I meant the last few weeks it seems he's not chasing pitches as much. When he returned from the injury, his timing was so off he was swinging at everything. Are there stats to show his swing percentage by month?

 

Good question, I'm not aware of how to do it, but I'll dig around and try to find something.

[Bigsoxhurt35]

Avi is 22 not 28. He's going to struggle and develop.

[daggins]

He's 23

 

He did lose nearly a season of playing time and still has

 

I think he will be a good hitter

[chitownsportsfan]

He's 23

 

He did lose nearly a season of playing time and still has

 

I think he will be a good hitter

 

People talk about Jose having "slider bat speed" but that better describes Avi at this point. Avi will need to improve on fastballs to have a really great career but he could be a pretty good regular just hitting 280/330/450 is he can pick it up in RF a bit. I think he's got a pretty high floor he just needs more experience. I'm taking anything he does until the end as a bonus. He's held his own since coming back that's all I hoped to see. Next year will be the year to look for some progress, especially defensively.

[Soxfest]

I am not ready to give up on Avi everything since he has been back is all bonus for 2014. He will be getting nothing but better next year.

[Feeky Magee]

He has the arm and wheels to acquit himself nicely as a right fielder.

It's just strange to me that someone can say this when he's rated as just about the single worst defensive player in all of baseball in terms of defensive runs saved per inning. I know there's issues with sample size and reliability, but they're not missing him by so much so that he's anything close to decent, the eye test will tell you that too. I've had a look back and there's not really an example of anyone who has graded as poorly as Avi early in their career and gone on to be considered a decent defensive player. Yoenis Cespedes to an extent, and he still wasn't rated nearly as badly.

[Dick Allen]

He's no DeAza........

Speaking of De Aza, I saw Mike Trout De Aza a flyout to CF into a triple the other night.

[southsider2k5]

It's just strange to me that someone can say this when he's rated as just about the single worst defensive player in all of baseball in terms of defensive runs saved per inning. I know there's issues with sample size and reliability, but they're not missing him by so much so that he's anything close to decent, the eye test will tell you that too. I've had a look back and there's not really an example of anyone who has graded as poorly as Avi early in their career and gone on to be considered a decent defensive player. Yoenis Cespedes to an extent, and he still wasn't rated nearly as badly.

 

Jose Abreu...

[kitekrazy]

I am not ready to give up on Avi everything since he has been back is all bonus for 2014. He will be getting nothing but better next year.

 

Yet everyone tolerated Viciedo for 3 years. Besides who are you gonna replace him with? The farm?

 

[southsider2k5]

Yet everyone tolerated Viciedo for 3 years. Besides who are you gonna replace him with? The farm?

 

Not Soxfest. He pretty much hates everyone.

[winninguglyin83]

My concerns with Avi: range, especially on balls over his head. And he has a body of a guy who looks as he could have a weight problem. Dude carries a good bit of weight

[Soxfest]

Not Soxfest. He pretty much hates everyone.

What are talking about, I said I am NOT ready to give up on Avi WTH? Reading is a skill, your definition of hate is different than mine.

Edited September 22, 2014 by Soxfest

[Jake]

Avi's O-Swing% is at about 42% for Sept. and 44% for Aug. Still high. This month, he and Abreu have pretty much the same O-Swing%, though, and Avi is substantially better at making contact on those hacks

[thxfrthmmrs]

Sorry, I meant the last few weeks it seems he's not chasing pitches as much. When he returned from the injury, his timing was so off he was swinging at everything. Are there stats to show his swing percentage by month?

 

 

Good question, I'm not aware of how to do it, but I'll dig around and try to find something.

 

Swing rate in September

 

He tends to lay off pitches on the interior and is aggressive on anything that's down the middle and out.

 

Whiff rate in September

 

He gets the bat on the ball on most of his swings, but pitches low and outside seem to be his weakness.

[chitownsportsfan]

The 440 shot on the hanging curve was nice but turning on the decently located 92 mph fastball was more impressive imo. We all know Avi has massive natural power but a quick bat will determine how well it plays. Nice to see him get around on that one.

 

Avi's patience and approach isn't a problem imo, it's getting his bat around on more fastballs in the zone.

[caulfield12]

It's not about LOVING Viciedo or HATING Garcia.

 

The question is how much better Garcia will end up being than Viciedo as a corner outfielder with his defensive limitations, what his offensive upside is...and whether he'll be worth more in 2-3 seasons than he is now.

 

If he can't regularly drive fastballs out of the park, then he'll be a 1-2 WAR type of player, which is okay but not going to win us any pennants, either. We'll see next season, as there won't be the missed half season and rust to deal with, presumably.

 

Dayan's a possible non-tender candidate, so his value has been pretty much driven into the ground...although some team out there will give up a B or C prospect for 20-30 homer power, despite its inherent flaws (see Alvarez/Domonic Brown/Chris Carter, etc.).

Edited September 22, 2014 by caulfield12

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

Flaws ?? I don't see no stinkin' flaws !

[southsider2k5]

After yesterday, Garcia now has 168 PAs, the same amount of PAs he had last year with the Sox.

 

2013: .304/.327/.446/.775 - 5 HR 21 RBI - OPS+ 109 - 38/5 K/BB

2014: .267/.333/.460/.793 - 7 HR 27 RBI - OPS+ 122 - 40/14 K/BB

 

And the peak for a typical ballplayer comes in the 27/28/29 year old range statistically. We have a lot of time and room for Avi to grow.

[iamshack]

And the peak for a typical ballplayer comes in the 27/28/29 year old range statistically. We have a lot of time and room for Avi to grow.

I've always wondered whether this changes when a player is exposed to the major leagues at an extremely young age...

[almagest]

After yesterday, Garcia now has 168 PAs, the same amount of PAs he had last year with the Sox.

 

2013: .304/.327/.446/.775 - 5 HR 21 RBI - OPS+ 109 - 38/5 K/BB

2014: .267/.333/.460/.793 - 7 HR 27 RBI - OPS+ 122 - 40/14 K/BB

So 12 hr 48 rbi OPS+ ~ 115 over 1/2 a season essentially? I'll take that as our starting right fielder any day.

[southsider2k5]

http://www.csnchicago.com/white-sox/patien...arcia-white-sox

 

DETROIT — Some of his big league experience has begun to pay off in the form of bases on balls and Avisail Garcia takes the time to celebrate each one.

 

The young White Sox outfielder said Monday that knowing how pitchers will attack him and his own willingness to lay off bad pitches has led to an increase in free passes.

 

Heading into Monday night, Garcia has walked eight times in 74 September plate appearances after only doing so 17 times in his previous 401 career trips. The increased patience is part of Garcia’s work with hitting coach Todd Steverson to make fewer outs on bad pitches. So every time Garcia trots down to first, he makes sure to glance over to the dugout to find Steverson.

 

“The thought of (patience) is always there,” Steverson said. “I’ve never stopped telling him, it’s gotta be a part of his game. Every time he walks it’s a little celebration out there, blowing bubbles or whatever. ‘Hey, good job, way to go.’ He knows it.”

 

There has been plenty of applause for Garcia since he returned to the lineup 5 1/2 weeks ago.

 

Returning four months after his season was declared was over, Garcia has made the most of a span of games that general manager Rick Hahn has said is akin to found money. The White Sox biggest fear when they lost Garcia to a torn labrum in April was not that he wouldn’t heal but the critical development time lost to the injury. But Garcia has played catch up plenty, playing in 33 of 34 games since he returned, including Monday night against the Detroit Tigers.

 

Over that span, Garcia entered Monday hitting .267/.328/.458 with five homers and 23 RBIs. But Garcia has been even better in September, posting a .871 OPS and the walks have helped as he had six in his first 94 trips in 2014.

 

“He’s getting better,” White Sox manager Robin Ventura said. “That’s part of having him come back this year and get some valuable time up here to be able to continue to improve with plate discipline and things like that. It’s good. It’s a nice trend for a guy that as much power as he does, to be able to do that, knowing that last year he didn’t have too many walks.”

 

Before he headed to Triple-A Charlotte on a rehab assignment, Garcia spent five weeks watching baseball from the bench. He attributes the increase to work with Steverson and a better game plan.

 

“Watching the games helps you a lot and I know how they’re going to throw you,” Garcia said. “I’ve been swinging at better pitches so that’s why I’m not striking out. I’ve paying more attention at the plate and trying to swing at better pitches — that’s the key.

 

“When you get more experience you learn how to play the game more and the more you play, the more it’ll be easy.”

 

Not only will the game slow down for Garcia, but there promises to be more celebrations at first base, too.

 

For Steverson, however, it’s not so much the walks that are critical but the elimination of outs on bad pitches.

 

“He knows it (when he walks),” Steverson said. “But he also knows when he gets himself out on balls. That’s more of a learning thing for me for him than it is the fact that he walked when he doesn’t allow himself to (make an out).”

[Eminor3rd]

That's gold ^

[ottawa_sox]

It's just strange to me that someone can say this when he's rated as just about the single worst defensive player in all of baseball in terms of defensive runs saved per inning. I know there's issues with sample size and reliability, but they're not missing him by so much so that he's anything close to decent, the eye test will tell you that too. I've had a look back and there's not really an example of anyone who has graded as poorly as Avi early in their career and gone on to be considered a decent defensive player. Yoenis Cespedes to an extent, and he still wasn't rated nearly as badly.

 

He looks extremely tentative. Even balls hit right at him. Guaranteed he'll have a better first step and be more assertive with experience.