Y2Jimmy0 Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 Haha this fangraphs article is dumb. Thought I'd post so everyone could see. http://www.fangraphs.com/community/why-the...hould-relocate/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 That's the worst FG Community article I've read Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheTruth05 Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 All i got from this was a few funny comments at the end of the article and the very clear fact the author is from Portland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daggins Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 For all the talk of Major League Baseball in Portland or Montreal, it doesn't seem like there is much incentive right now for expansion or relocation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 QUOTE (daggins @ Apr 7, 2014 -> 09:27 AM) For all the talk of Major League Baseball in Portland or Montreal, it doesn't seem like there is much incentive right now for expansion or relocation. Portland seems like a quality place for baseball but all of the leagues are in the "anti-expansion" mode right now after big expansions in the 90's, and the franchises that seem like the most obviously in need of relocation are locked into stadium agreements in Florida. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cabiness42 Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 Outside of calling Oakland --> San Jose relocation, there really isn't a viable relocation option out there for teams. The article also neglects to mention the massive cut in TV revenue a Chicago team would suffer moving to Portland. The supposed increase in attendance wouldn't even make a dent in that difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lasttriptotulsa Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 That was brutal to read. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 LOL. There was more holes in that than in a plot of a Disney channel tween show. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 Someone said OKC and Indianapolis were the two best markets in terms of local t.v. rights/shares. Always thought Charlotte would be viable. Louisville, Salt Lake City and Buffalo used to have the biggest AAA attendance once upon a time. Las Vegas, but they have the same issues with non-permanent residents/tourism as the Florida teams do. And just too hot in the middle of the summer, unless you build a domed stadium, and nobody really wants those anymore. That said, nothing can touch the Chicago media market in terms of competitive advantage, even for the second team in a city. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harfman77 Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 QUOTE (HickoryHuskers @ Apr 7, 2014 -> 08:34 AM) Outside of calling Oakland --> San Jose relocation, there really isn't a viable relocation option out there for teams. The article also neglects to mention the massive cut in TV revenue a Chicago team would suffer moving to Portland. The supposed increase in attendance wouldn't even make a dent in that difference. Actually, based on recent TV agreements, the Sox would get a significant bump in TV revenue. Using the Mariners as an example, their new TV deal provides them $2B over 17 years. Thats ~118M/year, almost $70M more per season than the current Sox deal. The deal also included a majority equity stake in the network. The Sox will re-negotiate their deal in 2018 as it expires in 2019, but their is a lot of speculation that the live sports "bubble" will pop in the near future. Re-location makes a ton of sense for the Sox financially, but there is too much history for that ever to be a reality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harfman77 Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Apr 7, 2014 -> 09:43 AM) Someone said OKC and Indianapolis were the two best markets in terms of local t.v. rights/shares. Always thought Charlotte would be viable. Louisville, Salt Lake City and Buffalo used to have the biggest AAA attendance once upon a time. Las Vegas, but they have the same issues with non-permanent residents/tourism as the Florida teams do. And just too hot in the middle of the summer, unless you build a domed stadium, and nobody really wants those anymore. That said, nothing can touch the Chicago media market in terms of competitive advantage, even for the second team in a city. That was based on the regional sports networks not currently having any summer sports inventory and having the financial track record of giving out big deals. SLC is an interesting place as one of the fastest growing markets, they share a regional sports network with Colorado so they have all the Rockies games currently, but if another group, like FS wanted to get into the region they would have a chance at getting a huge deal. Or they could start a network with the Jazz and pay themselves whatever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cabiness42 Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 Actually, based on recent TV agreements, the Sox would get a significant bump in TV revenue. Using the Mariners as an example, their new TV deal provides them $2B over 17 years. Thats ~118M/year, almost $70M more per season than the current Sox deal. The deal also included a majority equity stake in the network. The Sox will re-negotiate their deal in 2018 as it expires in 2019, but their is a lot of speculation that the live sports "bubble" will pop in the near future. Re-location makes a ton of sense for the Sox financially, but there is too much history for that ever to be a reality. That Mariners deal is also based on the fact that they are the primary team in Oregon, Idaho, and Northern California. That gets split in half if a team moves to Portland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2Jimmy0 Posted April 7, 2014 Author Share Posted April 7, 2014 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Apr 7, 2014 -> 09:43 AM) Someone said OKC and Indianapolis were the two best markets in terms of local t.v. rights/shares. Always thought Charlotte would be viable. Louisville, Salt Lake City and Buffalo used to have the biggest AAA attendance once upon a time. Las Vegas, but they have the same issues with non-permanent residents/tourism as the Florida teams do. And just too hot in the middle of the summer, unless you build a domed stadium, and nobody really wants those anymore. That said, nothing can touch the Chicago media market in terms of competitive advantage, even for the second team in a city. Las Vegas, Charlotte, and Indianapolis all have minor league teams that draw very well. I thought I heard about rumors of the Rays moving to Nashville? I think Nashville would be a great place for a pro baseball team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cabiness42 Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 Someone said OKC and Indianapolis were the two best markets in terms of local t.v. rights/shares. Always thought Charlotte would be viable. Louisville, Salt Lake City and Buffalo used to have the biggest AAA attendance once upon a time. Las Vegas, but they have the same issues with non-permanent residents/tourism as the Florida teams do. And just too hot in the middle of the summer, unless you build a domed stadium, and nobody really wants those anymore. That said, nothing can touch the Chicago media market in terms of competitive advantage, even for the second team in a city. Indy may have the market size to support a team, but I don't think it's realistic. Indiana just isn't a baseball state, and you have the Reds pretty close by with the Cubs/Sox also not too far away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 I do wonder if the Sox are safe from relocation. Just based on-- what happens after Reinsdorf dies? And isn't the stadium deal only through 2029? Will the Cell be obsolete in 15 years? Who would be the next owner/chairman? Hypothetical Question (obviously)-- If you were offered the option of the White Sox and Cubs being contracted (both franchises don't exist anymore), and the Rays relocated to Chicago and moved into a new retractable roof stadium that they paid for, and Chicago became a one baseball team city---would you take that offer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2Jimmy0 Posted April 7, 2014 Author Share Posted April 7, 2014 QUOTE (HickoryHuskers @ Apr 7, 2014 -> 09:55 AM) Indy may have the market size to support a team, but I don't think it's realistic. Indiana just isn't a baseball state, and you have the Reds pretty close by with the Cubs/Sox also not too far away. I think the Indians draw like 8,000-10,000 fans per night. Is that good for a minor league team? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 QUOTE (flavum @ Apr 7, 2014 -> 10:04 AM) I do wonder if the Sox are safe from relocation. Just based on-- what happens after Reinsdorf dies? And isn't the stadium deal only through 2029? Will the Cell be obsolete in 15 years? Who would be the next owner/chairman? Hypothetical Question (obviously)-- If you were offered the option of the White Sox and Cubs being contracted (both franchises don't exist anymore), and the Rays relocated to Chicago and moved into a new retractable roof stadium that they paid for, and Chicago became a one baseball team city---would you take that offer? Where is the stadium? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Apr 7, 2014 -> 10:08 AM) I think the Indians draw like 8,000-10,000 fans per night. Is that good for a minor league team? Cleveland, or Indianapolis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Apr 7, 2014 -> 10:10 AM) Where is the stadium? Let's just say it's in the city limits with beautiful skyline view when the roof is open. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 QUOTE (flavum @ Apr 7, 2014 -> 10:15 AM) Let's just say it's in the city limits with beautiful skyline view when the roof is open. Count me in Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harfman77 Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 QUOTE (HickoryHuskers @ Apr 7, 2014 -> 09:54 AM) That Mariners deal is also based on the fact that they are the primary team in Oregon, Idaho, and Northern California. That gets split in half if a team moves to Portland. The Mariners deal is also with DirecTV, so if FSN wants to get back in the region they will need a primary team to cover the same territory, and a team in Portland would be the primary team in the regions listed, so it may depreciate the value of the Mariners deal to DirecTV, it would not preclude a Portland team from getting a similar deal. Personally, I think Portland is a terrible re-location site, I am not sure the area has enough interest in baseball to warrant a team being placed there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldsox Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 QUOTE (flavum @ Apr 7, 2014 -> 09:04 AM) I do wonder if the Sox are safe from relocation. Just based on-- what happens after Reinsdorf dies? And isn't the stadium deal only through 2029? Will the Cell be obsolete in 15 years? Who would be the next owner/chairman? Hypothetical Question (obviously)-- If you were offered the option of the White Sox and Cubs being contracted (both franchises don't exist anymore), and the Rays relocated to Chicago and moved into a new retractable roof stadium that they paid for, and Chicago became a one baseball team city---would you take that offer? Contraction will never come close to being a reality as long as there is a player's union. Oakland to San Jose should have already happened. Tampa to just about anywhere would be an improvement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Apr 7, 2014 -> 08:18 AM) That's the worst FG Community article I've read So. much. statistical. analysis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cabiness42 Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 I think the Indians draw like 8,000-10,000 fans per night. Is that good for a minor league team? Yes, it is, but a AAA team being near the top of the league in attendance does not automatically mean the market is ripe for MLB. There is a big difference in ticket prices, etc. Families of four going to 6-10 AAA games per year are probably scaled back to 1-2 MLB games per year for the same money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 (edited) QUOTE (oldsox @ Apr 7, 2014 -> 10:59 AM) Contraction will never come close to being a reality as long as there is a player's union. Oakland to San Jose should have already happened. Tampa to just about anywhere would be an improvement. Just a hypothetical question. But if they turned Chicago into a one team city with the Rays moving, and then added two expansion teams- Portland, Charlotte, Montreal (somewhere), it would still be 30 teams. Same amount of teams. Edited April 7, 2014 by flavum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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