Possible Suitors for Gordon Beckham

[Dick Allen]

He's got to have these numbers consistently for at least 250 at-bats before he has much of any value.

 

Unless another team's just completely desperate and overpays.

.310/.348/.429

 

That is his slash line after about 250 plate appearances last year and you didn't think he could hit better than .215 this year.

[DirtySox]

17,075 on Memorial Day?

 

REALLY?

 

Were all of those fans Yankees' fans the last two days?

 

DJ marketing the Chris Sale start hard, lol. Saying how he would buy a ticket if he wasn't already coming to the game.

 

 

Great defensive play by Conor, two nice swings by Viciedo and Gillaspie to tack on some more runs hopefully.

 

This thread is about Gordon Beckham.

[elrockinMT]

.310/.348/.429

 

That is his slash line after about 250 plate appearances last year and you didn't think he could hit better than .215 this year.

 

 

Dick Allen ... they will always find some reason to hate on Beckham. They never let the facts get in the way of that hate. Personally I hope our DP combo of Alexei and Gordon stay together for several more years

[Eminor3rd]

17,075 on Memorial Day?

 

REALLY?

 

Were all of those fans Yankees' fans the last two days?

 

DJ marketing the Chris Sale start hard, lol. Saying how he would buy a ticket if he wasn't already coming to the game.

 

 

Great defensive play by Conor, two nice swings by Viciedo and Gillaspie to tack on some more runs hopefully.

 

Let's make EVERY thread about attendance!

[LDF]

Dick Allen ... they will always find some reason to hate on Beckham. They never let the facts get in the way of that hate. Personally I hope our DP combo of Alexei and Gordon stay together for several more years

 

 

I don't know about anybody else, but my wanting to trade Gordon is not about hatred but getting needed players

in return. stl - Adams and Craig are available, tor - has a farm systems of good prospect, bal - is the same with

even better prospects. yanks - have some key prospects and catchers,

 

I like Gordon, but we need help. I wouldn't mind seeing De Aza, L. Garcia , Viciedo and even the Danks brothers traded

as well.

 

We need prospects and we need help.

[Eminor3rd]

Dick Allen ... they will always find some reason to hate on Beckham. They never let the facts get in the way of that hate. Personally I hope our DP combo of Alexei and Gordon stay together for several more years

 

This is the reason to hate Gordon Beckham: 2,604 PA of .251/.314/.382 (87 wRC+), good for about 1.3 fWAR per 150 games to give him credit for his defense. That is a below average player and that includes this season. Traditional statistics and sabermetrics agree -- bad batting average, bad on-base percentage, bad slugging percentage, and bad wRC+.

 

I'm glad he's playing better this year. I hope he continues, because I like when White Sox players play well. I hope it's some kind of late-start career revival and that he can really sustain a 104 wRC+ making him a slightly above average hitter. That would be great.

 

But let's stop pretending it's a mystery that people are tired of watching him play badly. He had a good rookie season and then four consecutive seasons of crap. I'm not sure what math makes that guy into a player that everyone should love playing for their favorite team.

[Rowand44]

This is the reason to hate Gordon Beckham: 2,604 PA of .251/.314/.382 (87 wRC+), good for about 1.3 fWAR per 150 games to give him credit for his defense. That is a below average player and that includes this season. Traditional statistics and sabermetrics agree -- bad batting average, bad on-base percentage, bad slugging percentage, and bad wRC+.

 

I'm glad he's playing better this year. I hope he continues, because I like when White Sox players play well. I hope it's some kind of late-start career revival and that he can really sustain a 104 wRC+ making him a slightly above average hitter. That would be great.

 

But let's stop pretending it's a mystery that people are tired of watching him play badly. He had a good rookie season and then four consecutive seasons of crap. I'm not sure what math makes that guy into a player that everyone should love playing for their favorite team.

Yup. All of this.

[GreenSox]

I don't know about anybody else, but my wanting to trade Gordon is not about hatred but getting needed players

in return. stl - Adams and Craig are available, tor - has a farm systems of good prospect, bal - is the same with

even better prospects. yanks - have some key prospects and catchers,

 

I like Gordon, but we need help. I wouldn't mind seeing De Aza, L. Garcia , Viciedo and even the Danks brothers traded

as well.

 

We need prospects and we need help.

I'll go with the prospects. We don't need Adams and Craig is overpaid.

We need to listen hard on Dunn too.

 

L Garcia nets nothing; If De Aza gets his average up he'd yield something, but it's selling low now. John Danks would be salary relief for the most part; Jordan Danks has no value.

Viciedo is driving the ball - he may be for real. Sometimes guys take a few years to pull things together...it's not that unusual. It applies to Beckham too.

Beckham, Dunn and maybe Belasario if they'd just let him pitch in the 7th and 8th look to me like the best trade pieces now.

Edited May 26, 2014 by GreenSox

[SCCWS]

*STAT OF THE DAY* Addison Reed so far has given up 6 home runs in 22 innings. So far Lindstrom/Belly/Downs/Petrika/Putnam/Webb have given up a combined 6 HRs in 140 innings.

 

No, stat of the day is that Reed has 14 saves and 2 BS. Your assorted group has 9 saves and 6 BS. A closer's main job is to save the game not blow the save. Your assorted group makes $11 Mil and Reed makes $538,000

 

 

[southsider2k5]

No, stat of the day is that Reed has 14 saves and 2 BS. Your assorted group has 9 saves and 6 BS. A closer's main job is to save the game not blow the save. Your assorted group makes $11 Mil and Reed makes $538,000

 

Ugh, the butchery represented in that post just hurts.

[caulfield12]

.310/.348/.429

 

That is his slash line after about 250 plate appearances last year and you didn't think he could hit better than .215 this year.

 

 

I remember saying .240.

[caulfield12]

Let's make EVERY thread about attendance!

 

 

Sorry, it's hard to keep track of everything when it's 5:00 a.m. in the morning, you're half asleep and going back and drifting back and forth between half sleeping and consciousness.

[Dick Allen]

I remember saying .240.

That was for your bet. Before that you said .210-.215. Even.240 is below his career numbers. What did you bet anyway?

[oldsox]

Ugh, the butchery represented in that post just hurts.

It was a valid post until the last sentence. Combining the salaries of a bunch of relievers makes little sense, combining saves and blown saves a bit more.

[caulfield12]

That was for your bet. Before that you said .210-.215. Even.240 is below his career numbers. What did you bet anyway?

 

 

That if he was hitting above .240 at the end of the season, I wouldn't mention Puig again.

 

As for you, if you were willing to accept (which I don't think you really did), if I won...you couldn't mention Don Cooper again.

 

I guess that's not entirely fair as Cooper constitutes approximately 30-40% of your offseason posts, whereas Puig's closer to 5-10% these days for me, at most.

 

Then again, your guy has that stratospheric batting average now, so the odds are in your favor for the moment.

[MEANS]

half asleep and going back and drifting back and forth between half sleeping and consciousness.

 

 

and now I understand your posts/tangents.....

[witesoxfan]

No, stat of the day is that Reed has 14 saves and 2 BS. Your assorted group has 9 saves and 6 BS. A closer's main job is to save the game not blow the save. Your assorted group makes $11 Mil and Reed makes $538,000

 

It's amazing that people make this kind of argument. He's got an ERA over 4 and doesn't throw any ground balls whatsoever. His K/9, BB/9, and K/BB are nice and indicate that he's gotten a little unlucky, but if you're throwing only 29% ground balls, you're going to give up the long ball especially when you're only topping out at 93. Meanwhile, people have asked Sox management for years to trade for players with Davidson's talent for years, and when he comes out and has a rough first two months, people immediately want him lynched.

 

Hypocrisy, thy name is White Sox fans.

[Dick Allen]

It's amazing that people make this kind of argument. He's got an ERA over 4 and doesn't throw any ground balls whatsoever. His K/9, BB/9, and K/BB are nice and indicate that he's gotten a little unlucky, but if you're throwing only 29% ground balls, you're going to give up the long ball especially when you're only topping out at 93. Meanwhile, people have asked Sox management for years to trade for players with Davidson's talent for years, and when he comes out and has a rough first two months, people immediately want him lynched.

 

Hypocrisy, thy name is White Sox fans.

The problem is the White Sox have had a long line of players with Davidson's "talents". Weak defensively, with a problem making contact.

[witesoxfan]

The problem is the White Sox have had a long line of players with Davidson's "talents". Weak defensively, with a problem making contact.

 

Sometimes it doesn't work out. Sometimes you get Carlos Quentin. Either way, it's hypocritical to lambast the Sox for not bringing in the high upside offensive players and to then criticize them when said players don't work out (again, for 2 months thus far, and Reed has not been that good either).

[Dick Allen]

Sometimes it doesn't work out. Sometimes you get Carlos Quentin. Either way, it's hypocritical to lambast the Sox for not bringing in the high upside offensive players and to then criticize them when said players don't work out (again, for 2 months thus far, and Reed has not been that good either).

Carlos Quentin was a top 20 prospect. Davidson nowhere near. The White Sox seem to blow off contact issues throughout the minors. Maybe they think it will improve. But so far, the guys they have touted in their system who had trouble making contact at each level, either never made it to the major leagues or made little or even negative impact. Striking out at these rates in the minor leagues for more than a season or sol IMO shows a lack of ability to make contact with professional-level pitching. When they get to the elite arms with more sophisticated scouting reports, to think it will get much better is a dream. Hopefully, it's some mechanical issue with Davidson.

 

There just aren't a lot of players who have been big contributors that fanned as much as White Sox prospects fan at the minor league levels.

 

If your BABIP is .300 but you fan 175 times, unless you are walking at Thomas, Thome or Dunn rates, your overall numbers are going to probably suck.

Edited May 27, 2014 by Dick Allen

[Jake]

There's nothing worse than to give up on a guy with as much talent and high level success as Davidson, especially when you're pining for a f***ing relief pitcher who will hardly be as valuable as a below average third baseman in a good year

[witesoxfan]

Carlos Quentin was a top 20 prospect. Davidson nowhere near. The White Sox seem to blow off contact issues throughout the minors. Maybe they think it will improve. But so far, the guys they have touted in their system who had trouble making contact at each level, either never made it to the major leagues or made little or even negative impact. Striking out at these rates in the minor leagues for more than a season or sol IMO shows a lack of ability to make contact with professional-level pitching. When they get to the elite arms with more sophisticated scouting reports, to think it will get much better is a dream. Hopefully, it's some mechanical issue with Davidson.

 

There just aren't a lot of players who have been big contributors that fanned as much as White Sox prospects fan at the minor league levels.

 

Matt Davidson has been a BA top 100 prospect 4 years in a row and was in every major publication's top 100.

 

Are denying that Matt Davidson is talented? Because then you're wrong. I don't care about anything else, I'm not making a big stand or anything else, but you are kind of proving my point here. Sox fans wanted Hahn to go out and get high upside talent. He did. It's not as if it's without risk. Yet here you are complaining about it because he's high upside, low contact kind of guy. Guess how many big-time power hitters in the majors feature those exact tools?

[southsider2k5]

It was a valid post until the last sentence. Combining the salaries of a bunch of relievers makes little sense, combining saves and blown saves a bit more.

 

No. Not at all. Never.

 

No one should ever use blown saves and/or lack of saves as a knock against middle relievers. It is a nonsensical and irrational usage of a stat.

 

It is baseball ignorant.

 

It needs to stop forever.

 

[Balta1701]

No. Not at all. Never.

 

No one should ever use blown saves and/or lack of saves as a knock against middle relievers. It is a nonsensical and irrational usage of a stat.

 

It is baseball ignorant.

 

It needs to stop forever.

The White Sox and the Diamondbacks have the same number of blown saves this season.

[Dick Allen]

Matt Davidson has been a BA top 100 prospect 4 years in a row and was in every major publication's top 100.

 

Are denying that Matt Davidson is talented? Because then you're wrong. I don't care about anything else, I'm not making a big stand or anything else, but you are kind of proving my point here. Sox fans wanted Hahn to go out and get high upside talent. He did. It's not as if it's without risk. Yet here you are complaining about it because he's high upside, low contact kind of guy. Guess how many big-time power hitters in the majors feature those exact tools?

Josh Fields was a top 100 prospect. So was Brent Morel. So was Joe Borchard. If you cannot make contact at the lower levels, you most likely will suck in the major leagues. Adam Dunn never struck out at those rates in the minors. Neither did Jim Thome or Reggie Jackson. 3 of the most prolific strike out machines at the major league level.

 

Bo Jackson did, but I think we would all agree he is a little different from anyone in the Sox system. Defend Davidson all you want, he's still young, he will probably get to Chicago, but chances are he isn't going to be this talent you think. He cannot hit the ball often enough.