2014-2015 NBA thread

[ZoomSlowik]

picks in this draft is like getting 2 top 5 picks in normal drafts. That's huge.

 

I wouldn't go this far either. Is there anyone you REALLY like outside of the top-8? Admittedly I don't know much about Saric, but I wouldn't be thrilled taking Harris, Stauskas, McDermott et al in the top-5.

[Buehrle>Wood]

Come on now, Durant and Anthony were better prospects than either of these guys. Davis definitely goes ahead of either of them too, and possibly Griffin.

 

Now a healthy Embiid might have been a different story...

At the time of the draft? No way except for maybe Anthony, but that's why I said 11 years. Obviously these guys all ended up working out but hindsight is 20/20. They did not have the hype at the time of the draft that Parker and Wiggins do now. Honestly the right to Greg Oden is the best argument since 2003.

[Boogua]

At the time of the draft? No way except for maybe Anthony, but that's why I said 11 years. Obviously these guys all ended up working out but hindsight is 20/20. They did not have the hype at the time of the draft that Parker and Wiggins do now. Honestly the right to Greg Oden is the best argument since 2003.

You're overrating their hype. It was much more coming out of high school than it is now.

 

Durant dominated as a freshman in college. He was better than Parker. Parker can't play defense and doesn't have a true position. Wiggins has a ton of upside, but is pretty far behind in terms of offensive skills. I've read scouting reports that said he can't really pass or dribble right now. Anthony Davis may have been the most dominant college player I've ever seen. These two guys wouldn't have gone ahead of durant and Davis.

Edited June 26, 2014 by Boogua

[Buehrle>Wood]

You're overrating their hype. It was much more coming out of high school than it is now.

Not really. It's still widely seen as the top draft in 11 years that they are the definite top tier of.

[Boogua]

Not really. It's still widely seen as the top draft in 11 years that they are the definite top tier of.

The depth of this draft is why people are rating it that high.

[Buehrle>Wood]

The depth of this draft is why people are rating it that high.

And also because of the superstar talent at the top.

[ZoomSlowik]

At the time of the draft? No way except for maybe Anthony, but that's why I said 11 years. Obviously these guys all ended up working out but hindsight is 20/20. They did not have the hype at the time of the draft that Parker and Wiggins do now. Honestly the right to Greg Oden is the best argument since 2003.

 

Yes, at the time of the draft. Oden and Durant had significantly more hype at the time and were basically assumed All-Stars. Anthony was pretty close to that level and while people weren't QUITE as thrilled with Davis, there's no way anyone is passing on a big with his length/athleticism/upside.

 

Wiggins and Parker had a ton of hype before the season, but it's died down considerably because they didn't meet those absurd expectations. I find that there are signficantly more articles/discussions about things like Wiggins' lack of offensive polish/killer instinct and Parker's lack of defense/contributing in areas beyond scoring than there are hyping them up.

[Boogua]

And also because of the superstar talent at the top.

I don't know what you're reading or listening to, but everything I've heard is that there are no top 5 players in the nba type guys in this draft, but tons of all star level talents. There are some pretty big holes in the top two players games.

[Chisoxfn]

Yes, at the time of the draft. Oden and Durant had significantly more hype at the time and were basically assumed All-Stars. Anthony was pretty close to that level and while people weren't QUITE as thrilled with Davis, there's no way anyone is passing on a big with his length/athleticism/upside.

 

Wiggins and Parker had a ton of hype before the season, but it's died down considerably because they didn't meet those absurd expectations. I find that there are signficantly more articles/discussions about things like Wiggins' lack of offensive polish/killer instinct and Parker's lack of defense/contributing in areas beyond scoring than there are hyping them up.

Rose & Beasley were extremely hyped as well. More so coming into the draft then Wiggins / Parker.

[ZoomSlowik]

By the way, taking Exum at #1 would be the most Cavs thing ever. He's basically an Australian high schooler. While they're not exactly the second coming of Lebron and Anthony, it would be downright silly to pass on those guys for Exum.

[ZoomSlowik]

I don't know what you're reading or listening to, but everything I've heard is that there are no top 5 players in the nba type guys in this draft, but tons of all star level talents. There are some pretty big holes in the top two players games.

 

The way I see it, there are 8 guys that could be good-to-great, but it drops off after that. Pretty much everyone but Embiid has disappointed to at least some extent as well.

[ZoomSlowik]

Rose & Beasley were extremely hyped as well. More so coming into the draft then Wiggins / Parker.

 

I was debating whether to list those two or not. I feel like there's a lot of revisionist history with them. Rose had been kinda blah before the NCAA tournament while Beasley had dominated. I feel like 80% of people (including some dumbass named ZoomSlowik) thought Beasley was going to be a stud while Rose was more about upside and athleticism than production. Then Derrick just flipped a switch and starting dominating while Beasley got high and turned into Marvin Williams.

 

I would say before their respective freshmen seasons, this group had more hype than Beasley/Rose/Mayo/Love/Gordon. I feel like the latter group was a little more loved around draft time though.

[Buehrle>Wood]

Yes, at the time of the draft. Oden and Durant had significantly more hype at the time and were basically assumed All-Stars. Anthony was pretty close to that level and while people weren't QUITE as thrilled with Davis, there's no way anyone is passing on a big with his length/athleticism/upside.

 

Wiggins and Parker had a ton of hype before the season, but it's died down considerably because they didn't meet those absurd expectations. I find that there are signficantly more articles/discussions about things like Wiggins' lack of offensive polish/killer instinct and Parker's lack of defense/contributing in areas beyond scoring than there are hyping them up.

 

And Durant was wayyy too skinny and Anthony was never going to develop an offensive game. How laughable in retrospect but the very same articles were there. It's easy to forget when they become allstars. While Wiggins didn't live up to expectations I'd still say those same expectations are a big part of the hype he's getting. I'd argue Jabari lived up to the hype but that's me.

I don't know what you're reading or listening to, but everything I've heard is that there are no top 5 players in the nba type guys in this draft, but tons of all star level talents. There are some pretty big holes in the top two players games.

If you really believe that people think this is the best draft has little to do with the potential superstardom I don't know what to tell you.

Take Wiggins and Parker out and replace them with depth like two Aaron Gordon clones and you'd laugh at someone saying that.

Rose & Beasley were extremely hyped as well. More so coming into the draft then Wiggins / Parker.

Nooooo chance. Rose's stock rose way to say that.

 

 

Edit: I'd even give you Beasley maybe but honestly a lot of his hype was based on making strange parallels to Durant that weren't there. And I meant Anthony Davis above obviously, not Carmelo.

Edited June 26, 2014 by Buehrle>Wood

[Jenksismyhero]

I wouldn't go this far either. Is there anyone you REALLY like outside of the top-8? Admittedly I don't know much about Saric, but I wouldn't be thrilled taking Harris, Stauskas, McDermott et al in the top-5.

 

Coupled with one of Embiid or Exum, yes, absolutely. Keep in mind too the rumor, at least with Orlando, is Afflalo is included too. IMO that's an absolute no-brainer of a trade. You get a legit high level prospect, a good contributor prospect, and a veteran.

[Jenksismyhero]

And Durant was wayyy too skinny and Anthony was never going to develop an offensive game. How laughable in retrospect but the very same articles were there. It's easy to forget when they become allstars. While Wiggins didn't live up to expectations I'd still say those same expectations are a big part of the hype he's getting. I'd argue Jabari lived up to the hype but that's me.

 

If you really believe that people think this is the best draft has little to do with the potential superstardom I don't know what to tell you.

Take Wiggins and Parker out and replace them with depth like two Aaron Gordon clones and you'd laugh at someone saying that.

 

Nooooo chance. Rose's stock rose way to say that

 

I don't remember reading any articles that Melo was going to have troubles scoring the ball. He was all about offense, just like he was at Syracuse.

[Buehrle>Wood]

I don't remember reading any articles that Melo was going to have troubles scoring the ball. He was all about offense, just like he was at Syracuse.

Sorry read my edit.Melo was a better prospect than either of Parker or Wiggins IMO.

Edited June 26, 2014 by Buehrle>Wood

[Jenksismyhero]

By the way, taking Exum at #1 would be the most Cavs thing ever. He's basically an Australian high schooler. While they're not exactly the second coming of Lebron and Anthony, it would be downright silly to pass on those guys for Exum.

 

I agree, however, in terms of value that you get, he's still a really good get at 4, coupled with what you could get 6-8 picks later.

[Jenksismyhero]

Sorry read my edit.Melo was a better prospect than either of Parker or Wiggins IMO.

 

Gotcha.

[ZoomSlowik]

And Durant was wayyy too skinny and Anthony was never going to develop an offensive game. How laughable in retrospect but the very same articles were there. It's easy to forget when they become allstars. While Wiggins didn't live up to expectations I'd still say those same expectations are a big part of the hype he's getting. I'd argue Jabari lived up to the hype but that's me.

 

If you really believe that people think this is the best draft has little to do with the potential superstardom I don't know what to tell you.

Take Wiggins and Parker out and replace them with depth like two Aaron Gordon clones and you'd laugh at someone saying that.

 

Nooooo chance. Rose's stock rose way to say that.

 

 

Edit: I'd even give you Beasley maybe but honestly a lot of his hype was based on making strange parallels to Durant that weren't there. And I meant Anthony Davis above obviously, not Carmelo.

 

There are always SOME nitpicks. Even with Lebron and Duncan, some people were criticizing parts of their game. But the general narrative was still about them being future studs, which hasn't really been the case with these guys since about December.

 

I also haven't heard the talk about this being "the best draft since year X" too much lately. It's still a good draft, but I don't think there's anyone GM's would bet their life on to make an All-NBA team. You would have found quite a few people doing that with those other guys. Personally, the only guy I might have been sold on was a healthy Embiid, and part of that is because the C position sucks.

[Boogua]

And Durant was wayyy too skinny and Anthony was never going to develop an offensive game. How laughable in retrospect but the very same articles were there. It's easy to forget when they become allstars. While Wiggins didn't live up to expectations I'd still say those same expectations are a big part of the hype he's getting. I'd argue Jabari lived up to the hype but that's me.

 

If you really believe that people think this is the best draft has little to do with the potential superstardom I don't know what to tell you.

Take Wiggins and Parker out and replace them with depth like two Aaron Gordon clones and you'd laugh at someone saying that.

 

Nooooo chance. Rose's stock rose way to say that.

 

 

Edit: I'd even give you Beasley maybe but honestly a lot of his hype was based on making strange parallels to Durant that weren't there. And I meant Anthony Davis above obviously, not Carmelo.

Yes, but bodies can fill out. Durant averaged 26 and 11 as a true freshman, shot 40% from 3 on over 2 makes per game. He was absolutely dominant.

 

Anthony Davis was drawing Kevin Garnett type comparisons (combined with Marcus Camby). He was the best big guy prospect since oden. The guy averaged a double double with about 5 blocks per game as a freshman.

 

Wiggins and Parker are fine prospects, with obvious holes like I pointed out, but they wouldn't be taken over those two guys.

[ZoomSlowik]

I agree, however, in terms of value that you get, he's still a really good get at 4, coupled with what you could get 6-8 picks later.

 

I don't know, I feel like there's a reasonable chance that if you take something like Exum and McDermott you get a complete flop and a designated shooter off the bench that can't guard anyone.

 

I'd feel a little better about #4 if Randle didn't have foot issues as well. I feel like he'll be at least solid, but I'm getting more nervous about injuries in my old age, especially with big men.

[Buehrle>Wood]

This is a fun argument so I figure I'd post Chad Ford's GOAT prospect list since Lebron. There's of course no way to prove who is right and I obviously disagree with him too but here it is:

 

 

1. Oden

2. Durant

3. Davis

4. Embiid

5. Wiggins

6. Rose

7. Parker

 

No one else in this draft in the top 25 from 2000 on.

 

 

 

Of course if you looked at his big boards they tell a different story so me thinks Mr. Ford is also a victim of looking at things retroactively.

[ZoomSlowik]

This is a fun argument so I figure I'd post Chad Ford's GOAT prospect list since Lebron. There's of course no way to prove who is right and I obviously disagree with him too but here it is:

 

 

1. Oden

2. Durant

3. Davis

4. Embiid

5. Wiggins

6. Rose

7. Parker

 

No one else in this draft in the top 25 from 2000 on.

 

 

 

Of course if you looked at his big boards they tell a different story so me thinks Mr. Ford is also a victim of looking at things retroactively.

 

I was going to make a post wondering where you got that, but then I realized you filtered out guys like Darko, Anthony, Yao and J-Williams (remember that guy?). I remember being somewhat bewildered that Williams was above Rose.

 

Wiggins is really hard to place for me. He had an absurd amount of hype in 2013, but I feel like people have soured on him. His ceiling is so far from his current skill level right now. I wouldn't be surprised if he has some T-Mac like years, but he's got a wide range of outcomes.

[Y2Jimmy0]

Twitter rumors tonight are speculating that if Cleveland takes Parker he will traded and if they take Wiggins they will keep him.

[2nd_city_saint787]

Adrian Wojnarowski ‏@WojYahooNBA 37s

 

New Orleans will send a future first-round pick to Houston for Asik, league source tells Yahoo Sports. Deal will give Rockets cap space.

 

Clearing space for Melo/LBJ....Man, I think Harden/Howard is a little more appealing than Rose/Noah...Would make Parson available though.

Edited June 26, 2014 by scs787