2014-2015 NBA thread

[Soxbadger]

You do realize every team will have misses? Bulls have consistently hit at a much higher percentage then the rest of the league. It isn't even close. Butler / Taj / Asik / Nik / Sefolosha / Deng / Gordon / Hinrich / Rose / Noah / etc

 

Note: Tyrus Thomas was the one massive debacle and really the only debacle under this admin. Jay Williams I won't blame anyone on since he would have been very good but I also don't remember if that was Paxson or not (think it was). Also, I am not writing Snell off yet.

 

Ive watched every NBA draft for the last 20 years, everyone has misses, which is exactly why when you have 2 first round picks in a deep draft, you take them both so that you have a better chance of hitting.

 

Maybe McDermott is the best thing ever, yesterday before the Bulls selected him I said that he could do well on the right team. I think that overall its a waste of picks, I think McDermott wasnt worth the price and I think the Bulls would have been better suited taking 2 players.

 

But that is always my belief. I dont like trading up unless its for a guy that just blows you away. McDermott doesnt blow me a way. Its not that I hate him as a player, I just hate the cost of getting him.

[Chisoxfn]

Ive watched every NBA draft for the last 20 years, everyone has misses, which is exactly why when you have 2 first round picks in a deep draft, you take them both so that you have a better chance of hitting.

 

Maybe McDermott is the best thing ever, yesterday before the Bulls selected him I said that he could do well on the right team. I think that overall its a waste of picks, I think McDermott wasnt worth the price and I think the Bulls would have been better suited taking 2 players.

 

But that is always my belief. I dont like trading up unless its for a guy that just blows you away. McDermott doesnt blow me a way. Its not that I hate him as a player, I just hate the cost of getting him.

I agree with everything you just said.

[Buehrle>Wood]

Espn insider grades

 

[Jake]

Paxson's first draft was 2003.

 

2003 - Hinrich. No good today, but he was a really nice player for a long time. There wasn't anybody obviously better that went later. Good pick.

 

2004 - Gordon at 3 and Deng at 7. The only player I could have really criticized them for passing up on by taking Gordon at 3 was Deng, who they got at 7. Duhon in 2nd round was a rare contributor from that part of the draft. Great job here, considering the only great player in the draft went 1 overall. These guys and Hinrich turned the franchise around.

 

2005 - No first rounder, traded this first rounder for Luol Deng. Brilliant deal as we were picking 21st in 2005.

 

2006 - The big whiff: Tyrus Thomas. Made worse by the fact that we got essentially nothing in return for moving down two slots because Viktor Khryapa never had any real semblance of value. This is a big, big mistake. Moved from 16 to 13 to grab Thabo Sefolosha, which was a good enough move. Nice player and later spun him off for another mid-first pick.

 

2007 - Joakim Noah at 9. Arguably the second best player from this draft, more conservatively 3rd (making Al Horford better). Both those players were selected earlier. We got this pick by trading Eddy Curry and Antonio Davis to NY, getting Mike Sweetney, Tim Thomas, Jermaine Jackson, the Thabo Sefolosha pick the year before, and an option to swap picks with NY (we did - moved from 23 to 9). Great deal, great pick.

 

2008 - Derrick Rose. If you complain about this one, you're just being a dick. The only other players you'd want from this draft are Westbrook, Love, and Brook Lopez. Westbrook would be the most defensible pick there in hindsight, but indefensible at the time and this is not to mention the time it took for Westbrook to remotely compare to Rose. We also took Omer Asik at 36, a pretty excellent 2nd round choice.

 

2009 - James Johnson at 16 and Taj Gibson at 26. Johnson qualifies as a miss, but the fact that we traded him for a first rounder is noteworthy. Jrue Holliday, Ty Lawson, Jeff Teague and Taj Gibson are the main players to fret about not getting at 16. Gibson is an awesome selection at 26. Not wanting a PG at 16 is rather forgivable as well.

 

2010 - No picks. Our 17th pick, which was used on a foreigner that hasn't come over, was traded for another foreigner that hasn't come over, and we traded that guy with Kirk Hinrich to Washington. These are the hazards of going for the big name players. With that said, there really isn't a player worth a s*** taken at or after 17. Lance Stephenson in the middle of the second is the next best guy after Paul George at 10.

 

2011 - Jimmy Butler at 30: great pick. We traded our 28th pick for Nikola Mirotic. Jury's out on him, but the very fact that Chad Ford says he'd be a top 6 pick in today's draft makes that sound like a pretty good deal and a wash at worst.

 

2012 - Marquis Teague at 29. I won't call it a "whiff" given the expectations for a 29th pick, but no positive points here. Best players we missed (that we know of so far) are Draymond Green at 35 and Khris Middleton at 44.

 

2013 - Tony Snell at 20. I don't want to make too many proclamations about this given how little sample we have for him or anyone else, but I don't yet feel too bad about anyone else that got by. To Tony's credit, he has at least not yet ruled out the possibility of him becoming a decent rotation player. He could go either way IMO.

 

It's a pretty good run IMO. Given the overall success rate of first round draft picks, we've done pretty damn well. One big miss, but several big hits and we didn't f*** up our biggest opportunity when we picked first overall. You can say what you want about it being obvious in 2008, but if you let 30 teams draft there you wouldn't have had 30 Derrick Roses. Countless examples of #1 overall picks being pretty much s***ty ballplayers or paling in comparison to players taken later.

 

 

[whitesoxfan99]

Paxson's first draft was 2003.

 

2003 - Hinrich. No good today, but he was a really nice player for a long time. There wasn't anybody obviously better that went later. Good pick.

 

2004 - Gordon at 3 and Deng at 7. The only player I could have really criticized them for passing up on by taking Gordon at 3 was Deng, who they got at 7. Duhon in 2nd round was a rare contributor from that part of the draft. Great job here, considering the only great player in the draft went 1 overall. These guys and Hinrich turned the franchise around.

 

2005 - No first rounder, traded this first rounder for Luol Deng. Brilliant deal as we were picking 21st in 2005.

 

2006 - The big whiff: Tyrus Thomas. Made worse by the fact that we got essentially nothing in return for moving down two slots because Viktor Khryapa never had any real semblance of value. This is a big, big mistake. Moved from 16 to 13 to grab Thabo Sefolosha, which was a good enough move. Nice player and later spun him off for another mid-first pick.

 

2007 - Joakim Noah at 9. Arguably the second best player from this draft, more conservatively 3rd (making Al Horford better). Both those players were selected earlier. We got this pick by trading Eddy Curry and Antonio Davis to NY, getting Mike Sweetney, Tim Thomas, Jermaine Jackson, the Thabo Sefolosha pick the year before, and an option to swap picks with NY (we did - moved from 23 to 9). Great deal, great pick.

 

2008 - Derrick Rose. If you complain about this one, you're just being a dick. The only other players you'd want from this draft are Westbrook, Love, and Brook Lopez. Westbrook would be the most defensible pick there in hindsight, but indefensible at the time and this is not to mention the time it took for Westbrook to remotely compare to Rose. We also took Omer Asik at 36, a pretty excellent 2nd round choice.

 

2009 - James Johnson at 16 and Taj Gibson at 26. Johnson qualifies as a miss, but the fact that we traded him for a first rounder is noteworthy. Jrue Holliday, Ty Lawson, Jeff Teague and Taj Gibson are the main players to fret about not getting at 16. Gibson is an awesome selection at 26. Not wanting a PG at 16 is rather forgivable as well.

 

2010 - No picks. Our 17th pick, which was used on a foreigner that hasn't come over, was traded for another foreigner that hasn't come over, and we traded that guy with Kirk Hinrich to Washington. These are the hazards of going for the big name players. With that said, there really isn't a player worth a s*** taken at or after 17. Lance Stephenson in the middle of the second is the next best guy after Paul George at 10.

 

2011 - Jimmy Butler at 30: great pick. We traded our 28th pick for Nikola Mirotic. Jury's out on him, but the very fact that Chad Ford says he'd be a top 6 pick in today's draft makes that sound like a pretty good deal and a wash at worst.

 

2012 - Marquis Teague at 29. I won't call it a "whiff" given the expectations for a 29th pick, but no positive points here. Best players we missed (that we know of so far) are Draymond Green at 35 and Khris Middleton at 44.

 

2013 - Tony Snell at 20. I don't want to make too many proclamations about this given how little sample we have for him or anyone else, but I don't yet feel too bad about anyone else that got by. To Tony's credit, he has at least not yet ruled out the possibility of him becoming a decent rotation player. He could go either way IMO.

 

It's a pretty good run IMO. Given the overall success rate of first round draft picks, we've done pretty damn well. One big miss, but several big hits and we didn't f*** up our biggest opportunity when we picked first overall. You can say what you want about it being obvious in 2008, but if you let 30 teams draft there you wouldn't have had 30 Derrick Roses. Countless examples of #1 overall picks being pretty much s***ty ballplayers or paling in comparison to players taken later.

 

I agree with a lot of this but Iguodala has been a clearly superior player to Deng and Gordon and he went after both.

[Jake]

I agree with a lot of this but Iguodala has been a clearly superior player to Deng and Gordon and he went after both.

 

You should really look at the numbers. Iguodala always seemed more promising talent-wise but he took a while to come around and even at his peak there's not an easy argument to be made that he was better than Deng. Iguodala hasn't averaged over 14 points since 2009 and I won't take easily to an argument that he's a superior defender to Deng (I could go with a wash, they are about as different as two different elite defenders at the same position could be).

 

He's had a bit more staying power than Gordon, who fell off pretty quickly after being one of the more explosive scorers around in a time where the league wasn't scoring much. Hard to argue that he's been better than Iguodala, but given that I'd prefer Deng at SF during that time period it's not such a bad thing that we went with a true guard there. There are shades of gray and context-dependent things so it's valid that you brought up Iggy

[Jake]

Jeff Goodman - Bulls are tonight's big winner

[farmteam]

Jeff Goodman - Bulls are tonight's big winner

Yeah he loved the pick. Guys on NBA TV loved McDermott, too.

[Dick Allen]

Yeah he loved the pick. Guys on NBA TV loved McDermott, too.

To me,especially in the NBA, whoever got the best player, wins the trade. I think McBuckets is a better player than Harris or Hood. The Bulls were higher on him than Stauskas allegedly.

 

I think his detractors have put him in a stereotype he doesn't belong.

 

The only problem is he is from Ames, IA, the same town that brought the Bulls in one way or another Tim Floyd, Marcus Fizer , and Gar Forman.

[RockRaines]

Jeff Goodman - Bulls are tonight's big winner

Once again solidifying that everyones opinion is just that. Nobody knows s*** when it comes to NBA draft choices.

[2nd_city_saint787]

I know it may be a little crazy to be craving UDFAs (I'm sure Rowand/Kyyle will bring up my love for the "independent worker") but there a few half way decent guys still out there. Patric Young was a guy I thought for sure would be drafted and he makes some sense. If not him then there's 2 other massive centers out there in Jordan Bachynski (7'2") and Sim Bhullar (7'5") that would be very interesting to see what Thibs can do with..

 

Also wouldn't mind seeing Deandre Kane picked up as the #3 PG behind Rose/?.

 

 

 

 

[DBAHO]

Affalo gets traded for a 3rd scoring guard off the bench, we pass on Exum to select a wannabee Blake Griffin, and then trade a future 1st to move up 2 spots.

 

Not a good day to be a Magic fan....

 

I thought Utah did very well getting Exum and Hood, and although Philly didn't get any immediate help, they keep stockpiling a lot of future assets.

[Chisoxfn]

Paxson's first draft was 2003.

 

2003 - Hinrich. No good today, but he was a really nice player for a long time. There wasn't anybody obviously better that went later. Good pick.

 

2004 - Gordon at 3 and Deng at 7. The only player I could have really criticized them for passing up on by taking Gordon at 3 was Deng, who they got at 7. Duhon in 2nd round was a rare contributor from that part of the draft. Great job here, considering the only great player in the draft went 1 overall. These guys and Hinrich turned the franchise around.

 

2005 - No first rounder, traded this first rounder for Luol Deng. Brilliant deal as we were picking 21st in 2005.

 

2006 - The big whiff: Tyrus Thomas. Made worse by the fact that we got essentially nothing in return for moving down two slots because Viktor Khryapa never had any real semblance of value. This is a big, big mistake. Moved from 16 to 13 to grab Thabo Sefolosha, which was a good enough move. Nice player and later spun him off for another mid-first pick.

 

2007 - Joakim Noah at 9. Arguably the second best player from this draft, more conservatively 3rd (making Al Horford better). Both those players were selected earlier. We got this pick by trading Eddy Curry and Antonio Davis to NY, getting Mike Sweetney, Tim Thomas, Jermaine Jackson, the Thabo Sefolosha pick the year before, and an option to swap picks with NY (we did - moved from 23 to 9). Great deal, great pick.

 

2008 - Derrick Rose. If you complain about this one, you're just being a dick. The only other players you'd want from this draft are Westbrook, Love, and Brook Lopez. Westbrook would be the most defensible pick there in hindsight, but indefensible at the time and this is not to mention the time it took for Westbrook to remotely compare to Rose. We also took Omer Asik at 36, a pretty excellent 2nd round choice.

 

2009 - James Johnson at 16 and Taj Gibson at 26. Johnson qualifies as a miss, but the fact that we traded him for a first rounder is noteworthy. Jrue Holliday, Ty Lawson, Jeff Teague and Taj Gibson are the main players to fret about not getting at 16. Gibson is an awesome selection at 26. Not wanting a PG at 16 is rather forgivable as well.

 

2010 - No picks. Our 17th pick, which was used on a foreigner that hasn't come over, was traded for another foreigner that hasn't come over, and we traded that guy with Kirk Hinrich to Washington. These are the hazards of going for the big name players. With that said, there really isn't a player worth a s*** taken at or after 17. Lance Stephenson in the middle of the second is the next best guy after Paul George at 10.

 

2011 - Jimmy Butler at 30: great pick. We traded our 28th pick for Nikola Mirotic. Jury's out on him, but the very fact that Chad Ford says he'd be a top 6 pick in today's draft makes that sound like a pretty good deal and a wash at worst.

 

2012 - Marquis Teague at 29. I won't call it a "whiff" given the expectations for a 29th pick, but no positive points here. Best players we missed (that we know of so far) are Draymond Green at 35 and Khris Middleton at 44.

 

2013 - Tony Snell at 20. I don't want to make too many proclamations about this given how little sample we have for him or anyone else, but I don't yet feel too bad about anyone else that got by. To Tony's credit, he has at least not yet ruled out the possibility of him becoming a decent rotation player. He could go either way IMO.

 

It's a pretty good run IMO. Given the overall success rate of first round draft picks, we've done pretty damn well. One big miss, but several big hits and we didn't f*** up our biggest opportunity when we picked first overall. You can say what you want about it being obvious in 2008, but if you let 30 teams draft there you wouldn't have had 30 Derrick Roses. Countless examples of #1 overall picks being pretty much s***ty ballplayers or paling in comparison to players taken later.

Excellent analysis Jake.

[RockRaines]

I know it may be a little crazy to be craving UDFAs (I'm sure Rowand/Kyyle will bring up my love for the "independent worker") but there a few half way decent guys still out there. Patric Young was a guy I thought for sure would be drafted and he makes some sense. If not him then there's 2 other massive centers out there in Jordan Bachynski (7'2") and Sim Bhullar (7'5") that would be very interesting to see what Thibs can do with..

 

Also wouldn't mind seeing Deandre Kane picked up as the #3 PG behind Rose/?.

Yeah there are lots out there.

[southsider2k5]

I know it may be a little crazy to be craving UDFAs (I'm sure Rowand/Kyyle will bring up my love for the "independent worker") but there a few half way decent guys still out there. Patric Young was a guy I thought for sure would be drafted and he makes some sense. If not him then there's 2 other massive centers out there in Jordan Bachynski (7'2") and Sim Bhullar (7'5") that would be very interesting to see what Thibs can do with..

 

Also wouldn't mind seeing Deandre Kane picked up as the #3 PG behind Rose/?.

 

If you are 7 feet tall, and can't get drafted at all, it is because you f***ing suck. Look what centers in the NBA get paid. If these guys were even decent, someone would have snapped them up.

[bmags]

I think the years of pent up anxiety and disappointment in the Bulls conservative roster management (including a collection of assets that win games, but are never as attractive as other teams assets that lose games) are creating a bizarre love affair for me with Doug McDermott. I don't claim to be a scout. I only watch mizzou college bball and then hate the rest of the sport.

 

But the fact that everyone was terrified the bulls would trade up to get this kid and then we did just that, makes me think that this has to work, right? I mean this is the most aggressive move I've ever seen the Bulls make. We have to hit 100%. We deserve it. And then next year Mcdermott is going to post up Anthony and do some weird ooopsy woopsy layup that goes in and I will go crazy. And then he'll get posterized by Lebron and we'll be talking about the 2018 plan to sign Jabari.

[Kyyle23]

I think the years of pent up anxiety and disappointment in the Bulls conservative roster management (including a collection of assets that win games, but are never as attractive as other teams assets that lose games) are creating a bizarre love affair for me with Doug McDermott. I don't claim to be a scout. I only watch mizzou college bball and then hate the rest of the sport.

 

But the fact that everyone was terrified the bulls would trade up to get this kid and then we did just that, makes me think that this has to work, right? I mean this is the most aggressive move I've ever seen the Bulls make. We have to hit 100%. We deserve it. And then next year Mcdermott is going to post up Anthony and do some weird ooopsy woopsy layup that goes in and I will go crazy. And then he'll get posterized by Lebron and we'll be talking about the 2018 plan to sign Jabari.

 

Come on now, Lebron would do that to McDermott, Harris, or Hood. It doesnt matter, Lebron is an equal opportunity posterizer.

 

 

McBuckets was brought in to shoot the ball, thats all. He should be fine in that role, and he should be good under Thibs. He is a coaches kid, he is a hard worker, knows the game, and has a very pretty shot

[RockRaines]

If you are 7 feet tall, and can't get drafted at all, it is because you f***ing suck. Look what centers in the NBA get paid. If these guys were even decent, someone would have snapped them up.

I like Young but I think you are kind of on point here. There is a lot of value in the UDFA's though.

 

However if Craft really does sign with the Pacers I will be forced to hate him. Just go to medical school young man.

[Y2Jimmy0]

I know it may be a little crazy to be craving UDFAs (I'm sure Rowand/Kyyle will bring up my love for the "independent worker") but there a few half way decent guys still out there. Patric Young was a guy I thought for sure would be drafted and he makes some sense. If not him then there's 2 other massive centers out there in Jordan Bachynski (7'2") and Sim Bhullar (7'5") that would be very interesting to see what Thibs can do with..

 

Also wouldn't mind seeing Deandre Kane picked up as the #3 PG behind Rose/?.

 

 

Kane will play for the Lakers Summer League Team. I'd love to add Patric Young.

[Jenksismyhero]

If you are 7 feet tall, and can't get drafted at all, it is because you f***ing suck. Look what centers in the NBA get paid. If these guys were even decent, someone would have snapped them up.

 

Yep, good point.

[RockRaines]

Kane will play for the Lakers Summer League Team. I'd love to add Patric Young.

Me too. Young was the heart and soul of that Florida team and is NBA ready physically.

[Kyyle23]

I like Young but I think you are kind of on point here. There is a lot of value in the UDFA's though.

However if Craft really does sign with the Pacers I will be forced to hate him. Just go to medical school young man.

 

I just dont agree with that in the NBA. UDFA's that succeed in the NBA are a big exception to the rule.

[southsider2k5]

And just for the record, I love the McDermott pick. If you had to draw up a Thibs player, this is it. He works hard, he hustles, he plays defense as hard as he can, and he can shoot. The guy is one of the best college shooters I can remember seeing. Even with entire defenses scheming around him, he can shoot. At the next level he will see better individual defenders, but not nearly the team defense he saw in college. He is going to get a lot of looks via Derrick Rose. And let's face it, the Bulls need SOMEONE who can score, and that is what this kid does. He scores. The Bulls didn't need another athlete who could jump through the ceiling, but had no skills. They didn't need another shutdown defender. They needed a scorer. They weren't going to get a top player in this draft because of where they were picking, but working up to get McDermott is a really nice get for them.

[southsider2k5]

I like Young but I think you are kind of on point here. There is a lot of value in the UDFA's though.

 

However if Craft really does sign with the Pacers I will be forced to hate him. Just go to medical school young man.

 

Bring them into camp, stash them on a D league team, whatever. But don't expect a thing from them because odds are near 100% you never hear from them again.

[Jenksismyhero]

And just for the record, I love the McDermott pick. If you had to draw up a Thibs player, this is it. He works hard, he hustles, he plays defense as hard as he can, and he can shoot. The guy is one of the best college shooters I can remember seeing. Even with entire defenses scheming around him, he can shoot. At the next level he will see better individual defenders, but not nearly the team defense he saw in college. He is going to get a lot of looks via Derrick Rose. And let's face it, the Bulls need SOMEONE who can score, and that is what this kid does. He scores. The Bulls didn't need another athlete who could jump through the ceiling, but had no skills. They didn't need another shutdown defender. They needed a scorer. They weren't going to get a top player in this draft because of where they were picking, but working up to get McDermott is a really nice get for them.

 

Yep, agree totally.