2014-2015 NBA thread

[Kyyle23]

Hard to enjoy this postseason when star players are goin' down every 35 seconds.

 

Blame thibs

[Jake]

Did anyone read Woj's article?

 

All I want to see is some coherent explanation for this riff. All we get is "Thibs is a great coach and the crazy front office hates him." We saw what happened with Ron Adams, but that was never well explained. It was either that Adams was insubordinate or Adams was fired just to spite Thibs. Otherwise, most of what we hear is that there is an irreparable problem and nobody mentions anything that Thibs has done wrong. Maybe this is mainly the fault of the FO, but I'd like to get an explanation better than "Gar doesn't get along with Thibs." That doesn't sound right to me.

 

Describe "run into the ground". Do you mean, Noah was hurt, had surgery, didn't have a full off-season and as a result has not been the same (cause he certainly hadn't played a lot of minutes this year). And with Taj, do you mean, his ankles, which are a consistent problem, are hurt and he even said himself won't get better this year. Minutes haven't been an issue for the team this year and people still make this comment. If anything, us not playing minutes has been an issue, lol.

 

PS: Taj has been pretty good this post-season, imo.

 

That wasn't supposed to be a Thibs criticism, just that the years have clearly taken their toll on those guys. They've been handled really carefully this season and for good reason. They both just have flawed bodies at this point and I'm not super optimistic for their long term future because of it.

 

Pau's rebounding in the playoffs has been very good, imo. He's brought his energy up a notch. Loved Pau's performance yesterday (especially in that dominant 3rd). When the Cavs were making their run, I was busy yelling, get Pau the darn ball. He is a huge x-factor in this series and will need to be because LBJ > Butler and Kyrie > Rose.

 

He has definitely had much less of the lackadaisical play that he sometimes had in the regular season. It's nice to see he has it in him.

 

By the way....f*** yeah D Rose! Loved how you have responded and how you have grown this post-season. Keep it up my good man. I know this feels good, but this is just the start!!!

 

I don't know if he reads Soxtalk.

 

This actually worries me

 

There's no amount of jumpshots Derrick can make that will make me feel like it's a good thing that he hits them. I mean, yes I want him to make all his shots, but I feel like for every deep two or three he hits now, there are some terrible ones put in a trust fund for a future date.

 

 

 

[southsider2k5]

I don't know if he reads Soxtalk.

 

When it comes to Derrick Rose, I don't know if he reads...

[Y2Jimmy0]

All I want to see is some coherent explanation for this riff. All we get is "Thibs is a great coach and the crazy front office hates him." We saw what happened with Ron Adams, but that was never well explained. It was either that Adams was insubordinate or Adams was fired just to spite Thibs. Otherwise, most of what we hear is that there is an irreparable problem and nobody mentions anything that Thibs has done wrong. Maybe this is mainly the fault of the FO, but I'd like to get an explanation better than "Gar doesn't get along with Thibs." That doesn't sound right to me.

 

 

 

That wasn't supposed to be a Thibs criticism, just that the years have clearly taken their toll on those guys. They've been handled really carefully this season and for good reason. They both just have flawed bodies at this point and I'm not super optimistic for their long term future because of it.

 

 

 

He has definitely had much less of the lackadaisical play that he sometimes had in the regular season. It's nice to see he has it in him.

 

 

 

I don't know if he reads Soxtalk.

 

 

 

There's no amount of jumpshots Derrick can make that will make me feel like it's a good thing that he hits them. I mean, yes I want him to make all his shots, but I feel like for every deep two or three he hits now, there are some terrible ones put in a trust fund for a future date.

 

Dan Bernstein and Joe Cowley have both explained this a ton. Most don't listen to them though because they are smug assholes. They will end up being correct in this case though.

[Jenksismyhero]

Dan Bernstein and Joe Cowley have both explained this a ton. Most don't listen to them though because they are smug assholes who are continually wrong on nearly everything they say. They will end up being correct in this case though.

 

Fixed.

Edited May 6, 2015 by Jenksismybitch

[Y2Jimmy0]

Fixed.

 

 

Thibodeau and Forman don't get along. It's to the point where they really don't even talk that often. They differ philosophically which is the biggest reason why there will be a split in my opinion. Management wants to win every regular season game. Thibs HAS to win every regular season game. Management wants less practices and more shootarounds. Management doesn't want starters playing in blowout regular season wins. Management wants young players to get a crack at the rotation for a reason other than an injury to a player. Regardless of what we think, management does think that Thibs has something to do with the injuries over the last 4 seasons. Management didn't trade 2 first round picks to move up for a player that would sit the entire season. Tom only cares about basketball and nothing else and isn't a good working relationship. Are Gar and Paxson stubborn and ridiculous? Yes probably so. Thibodeau is too though. The Bulls may regret the day that they let Tom Thibodeau leave. Fred Hoiberg could end up being the right guy at this time though. We don't know. I am pretty confident that we are going to find out though.

[Brian]

I'll just say that you should believe whatever KC Johnson writes on the subject.

[RockRaines]

Fixed.

Both have completely lost access to any insider information on every team in Chicago. They literally write whatever they feel will generate clicks based on their opinion.

[Y2Jimmy0]

I'll just say that you should believe whatever KC Johnson writes on the subject.

 

 

Absolutely. He's basically the mouthpiece of the team. That can be bad at times though because there are some things he doesn't report.

[Jenksismyhero]

Thibodeau and Forman don't get along. It's to the point where they really don't even talk that often. They differ philosophically which is the biggest reason why there will be a split in my opinion. Management wants to win every regular season game. Thibs HAS to win every regular season game. Management wants less practices and more shootarounds. Management doesn't want starters playing in blowout regular season wins. Management wants young players to get a crack at the rotation for a reason other than an injury to a player. Regardless of what we think, management does think that Thibs has something to do with the injuries over the last 4 seasons. Management didn't trade 2 first round picks to move up for a player that would sit the entire season. Tom only cares about basketball and nothing else and isn't a good working relationship. Are Gar and Paxson stubborn and ridiculous? Yes probably so. Thibodeau is too though. The Bulls may regret the day that they let Tom Thibodeau leave. Fred Hoiberg could end up being the right guy at this time though. We don't know. I am pretty confident that we are going to find out though.

 

With respect, this is all a bunch of media-driven bulls*** and/or unsupported theories.

 

We know for a fact that Thibs is unhappy with some things, and that GarPax are unhappy about somethings. We've seen those types of comments in press conferences to the public. That's something we can say for sure. Getting rid of Ron Adams pissed Thibs off. That we know for sure. Anything beyond that is 100% speculation. We don't know how severe the rift is, if there is one to begin with that's any worse than other front office/coaching rifts that exist in the league.

 

What's the source for saying that management wants less practices, guys to rest, etc. For all we know, Thibs and GarPax felt the same up until this year when things were done a little differently.

 

What's the source for saying that they expected McDermott to get big minutes (especially after his injury and the emergence of Snell as a legit back-up?)

Edited May 6, 2015 by Jenksismybitch

[Buehrle>Wood]

Woj, probably the most respected beat writer in any sport today, says Thibs is done with the Bulls come season's end.

 

 

I think that's a great indication that the rift is massive.

[Y2Jimmy0]

With respect, this is all a bunch of media-driven bulls*** and/or unsupported theories.

 

We know for a fact that Thibs is unhappy with some things, and that GarPax are unhappy about somethings. We've seen those types of comments in press conferences to the public. That's something we can say for sure. Getting rid of Ron Adams pissed Thibs off. That we know for sure. Anything beyond that is 100% speculation. We don't know how severe the rift is, if there is one to begin with that's any worse than other front office/coaching rifts that exist in the league.

 

What's the source for saying that management wants less practices, guys to rest, etc. For all we know, Thibs and GarPax felt the same up until this year when things were done a little differently.

 

What's the source for saying that they expected McDermott to get big minutes (especially after his injury and the emergence of Snell as a legit back-up?)

 

 

The source is whoever Joe Cowley, Dan Bernstein, Terry Boers, Nick Friedell, Chris Sheridan, Woj, etc have talked to. This info is everywhere. It's just not being reported by beat guys. Hasn't K.C. even said that it's over after the season?

[Kyyle23]

The source is whoever Joe Cowley, Dan Bernstein, Terry Boers, Nick Friedell, Chris Sheridan, Woj, etc have talked to. This info is everywhere. It's just not being reported by beat guys. Hasn't K.C. even said that it's over after the season?

 

KCs only caveat is if they win it all, but even then he says he is not sure

[RockRaines]

The source is whoever Joe Cowley, Dan Bernstein, Terry Boers, Nick Friedell, Chris Sheridan, Woj, etc have talked to. This info is everywhere. It's just not being reported by beat guys. Hasn't K.C. even said that it's over after the season?

For them its zero actual sources.

[Kyyle23]

Cowley has a source, the problem is that Cowley has decided which side he is on and his opinion is extremely biased because of it. But he has a source.

[soxsoxsoxsox]

I'll just say that you should believe whatever KC Johnson writes on the subject.

 

Both sides have managed tension and conflict all season. This doesn’t negatively affect the daily workings of the Bulls, as their current third seed and optimism heading into the playoffs attests. Thibodeau and Gar Forman talk if not daily, darn near close to it. They even -- gasp! -- laugh together sometimes.

 

It’s beyond repair in the sense that both sides are tired of the struggle. Too much distrust has built up over time and too much philosophical conflict has worn down long-term harmony that it won’t be a Jerry Sloan-type situation with the Jazz. This is why talk of Thibodeau definitely being gone after this season is premature. Nothing has been definitively determined. If you’re asking me to guess, I still guess he is coaching elsewhere next season. And this is another moment to stress that the relationship has broken down in both directions, meaning Thibodeau has entertained leaving too.

 

But the reason why the situation is fluid is inherent in your question: At the end of the day, does management fire a very successful coach with two years left on his deal? Does Thibodeau leave a city he loves living in and a roster he knows is very strong? A short playoff run or spectacular flameout would certainly flare the negativity anew. But a long, successful playoff run could lead to both sides taking pause and salvaging another season or two. That’s why, as they say, you play the games.

 

-KC Johnson

 

 

[Jenksismyhero]

Woj, probably the most respected beat writer in any sport today, says Thibs is done with the Bulls come season's end.

 

 

I think that's a great indication that the rift is massive.

 

Sure he is, but he's also a guy known to go after certain players, execs and agents when he doesn't get the access that he wants.

 

I'm not ignoring the obvious that there's some serious disagreement between Thibs and the front office, or even a "rift." But Woj basically said he's gone, no matter what. Other than reporters citing unnamed sources (in Woj's article the best inside access he got was a conversation about a conversation), there's been really no actual hint that they can't get along and work through things. I think they did a pretty good job through FA and the draft. Do people really believe that Thibs had zero involvement there? Perhaps he did not, but I have a really hard time believing that.

[Jenksismyhero]

Both sides have managed tension and conflict all season. This doesn’t negatively affect the daily workings of the Bulls, as their current third seed and optimism heading into the playoffs attests. Thibodeau and Gar Forman talk if not daily, darn near close to it. They even -- gasp! -- laugh together sometimes.

 

It’s beyond repair in the sense that both sides are tired of the struggle. Too much distrust has built up over time and too much philosophical conflict has worn down long-term harmony that it won’t be a Jerry Sloan-type situation with the Jazz. This is why talk of Thibodeau definitely being gone after this season is premature. Nothing has been definitively determined. If you’re asking me to guess, I still guess he is coaching elsewhere next season. And this is another moment to stress that the relationship has broken down in both directions, meaning Thibodeau has entertained leaving too.

 

But the reason why the situation is fluid is inherent in your question: At the end of the day, does management fire a very successful coach with two years left on his deal? Does Thibodeau leave a city he loves living in and a roster he knows is very strong? A short playoff run or spectacular flameout would certainly flare the negativity anew. But a long, successful playoff run could lead to both sides taking pause and salvaging another season or two. That’s why, as they say, you play the games.

 

-KC Johnson

 

Also, Rose LOVES Thibs. The players on the roster LOVE Thibs. That's something they have to consider, regardless of what they would prefer/want.

 

 

[Chisoxfn]

Also, Rose LOVES Thibs. The players on the roster LOVE Thibs. That's something they have to consider, regardless of what they would prefer/want.

That has always been the biggest factor as to why Thibs stays, imo. Not just Rose, literally almost the entire roster LOVES Thibs!

[Chisoxfn]

That's not entirely true.

Okay...you must be referring to McBuckets. I suppose maybe Snell but Snell should also be grateful because he's taken major strides forward. Thibs is a developmental kind of guy and that is evidenced by the significant number of players who have improved while working with him (young or old).

 

You could also say Hamilton or others but basically if you don't get on the Thibs wagon you are going to be gone and to be frank, I can commend that given the success and fact that the bulk of players like working / playing for him.

[Chisoxfn]

As I said yesterday, the biggest issue I see right now is Thibs bringing back up the issue at the worst possible time. They won the biggest game for the franchise in the last 4 years, momentum looks great right now, and Thibs sits down with Woj and produces this interview that brings everything up to the forefront. If I'm a player, or obviously a front office staff member, I'd be PISSED, and they have a right to be.

 

Again, I'm not saying both sides aren't at fault, but Thibs needs to STFU right now and focus on coaching, not talking to his boy and playing the PR game.

I completely agree with you. He should be 100% focused on the task at hand.

[Y2Jimmy0]

Okay...you must be referring to McBuckets. I suppose maybe Snell but Snell should also be grateful because he's taken major strides forward. Thibs is a developmental kind of guy and that is evidenced by the significant number of players who have improved while working with him (young or old).

 

You could also say Hamilton or others but basically if you don't get on the Thibs wagon you are going to be gone and to be frank, I can commend that given the success and fact that the bulk of players like working / playing for him.

 

 

I would argue that Pau doesn't love Thibodeau. Probably likes playing here but love is a little strong. Pau has been on championship teams in which every regular season game wasn't taken as seriously as it is here. I don't doubt for one second that there have been times throughout the season in which Gasol disagrees with the way certain things take place.

[southsider2k5]

I would argue that Pau doesn't love Thibodeau. Probably likes playing here but love is a little strong. Pau has been on championship teams in which every regular season game wasn't taken as seriously as it is here. I don't doubt for one second that there have been times throughout the season in which Gasol disagrees with the way certain things take place.

 

I am curious what the basis is for that?

[Chisoxfn]

I would argue that Pau doesn't love Thibodeau. Probably likes playing here but love is a little strong. Pau has been on championship teams in which every regular season game wasn't taken as seriously as it is here. I don't doubt for one second that there have been times throughout the season in which Gasol disagrees with the way certain things take place.

Pau in one year isn't going to love Thibs. Doesn't mean he dislikes him either and it is very clear that Thibs thinks extremely highly of Pau and respects his opinion. Thibs has made changes to practice schedules based upon feedback Pau has provided. Pau has been an extremely calming force on the locker but you can't discredit the fact that Taj / Noah / Butler / Hinrich (and if you believe Woj...Rose as well) would go to war for Thibs.

[Y2Jimmy0]

I am curious what the basis is for that?

 

 

Sheridan Hoops mentioned it earlier this season.