Allen Craig

[caulfield12]

Is supposedly available from the Cardinals....his name is being mentioned in the Peavy talks.

 

Any interest? StL needs pitching help, and Beckham/Ramirez were rumored to the Cardinals last year, so not sure if there's a match.

 

Boston media currently doesn't think StL would accept that deal, Peavy for Craig, straight up.

 

 

 

http://espn.go.com/mlb/player/stats/_/id/30399/allen-craig

Only has a 659 OPS for the moment, and RH. But still at 810 for his career, and a consistent 2.2/2.2/2.3 WAR player. Will turn 30 in July, so maybe a bit beyond his prime.

Edited July 8, 2014 by caulfield12

[Andy the Clown]

Is supposedly available from the Cardinals....his name is being mentioned in the Peavy talks.

 

Any interest? StL needs pitching help, and Beckham/Ramirez were rumored to the Cardinals last year, so not sure if there's a match.

 

Boston media currently doesn't think StL would accept that deal, Peavy for Craig, straight up.

 

 

 

http://espn.go.com/mlb/player/stats/_/id/30399/allen-craig

Only has a 659 OPS for the moment, and RH. But still at 810 for his career, and a consistent 2.2/2.2/2.3 WAR player. Will turn 30 in July, so maybe a bit beyond his prime.

 

Decent player if he could still play 2B. Given his age, decline, and defensive limitations, he's probably not the kind of guy RH is interested in.

[caulfield12]

One thing he would bring is lots of experience around a winning/playoff team.

 

We need these types of veterans to mix in with our young core IMO.

[cabiness42]

Yeah, let's trade for a 30 year old outfielder with an OPS under 700, because one De Aza isn't enough.

[GGajewski18]

Yeah, let's trade for a 30 year old outfielder with an OPS under 700, because one De Aza isn't enough.

 

And he's right handed...

[Eminor3rd]

Who do you want to trade?

[caulfield12]

Yeah, let's trade for a 30 year old outfielder with an OPS under 700, because one De Aza isn't enough.

 

 

The problem is if you trade for guys like Seth Smith or Melky Cabrera, you're buying on the high.

 

That's never been the Sox way of going business....with the exception of Jeff Keppinger, and we all know how well that one worked out.

 

It's like the stock market. Is Allen Craig a sub 700 OPS guy or the one whose MLB average is 801 with 2.2/2.2/2.3 WAR seasons consecutively?

 

Which is the trend? Which is the outlier?

Edited July 9, 2014 by caulfield12

[GreenSox]

His numbers have declined for each of the last 3 seasons.

I trust we've left the approach of adding declining veterans in the rear view mirror.

 

And, indeed, we shouldn't buy high either. (Seth Smith is 32 and essentially a platoon player)

Find and sign players that we think will improve.

Edited July 9, 2014 by GreenSox

[caulfield12]

His numbers have declined for each of the last 3 seasons.

I trust we've left the approach of adding declining veterans in the rear view mirror.

 

 

You mean like Hermanson, Vizcaino, Pods, Dye, AJ and El Duque?

[caulfield12]

Who suggested trading for Seth Smith or Melky Cabrera?

 

The Padres just signed Smith to a two year deal and Cabrera is on a first place team...

 

 

That was kind of the point. All the outfielders (especially LH) we might want for next season (since Viciedo should be traded according to half the board) aren't available or are too pricey or are likely to come back down to earth and overachieving, etc.

 

There's not a single player we could propose other than Mike Trout we could trade for that wouldn't be criticized, and some would undoubtedly say Trout is striking out too much this year.

Edited July 9, 2014 by caulfield12

[GreenSox]

You mean like Hermanson, Vizcaino, Pods, Dye, AJ and El Duque?

Use Youkilis as your example - he who was declining, whom we got for cheap in terms of players but who had a high salary, but who ended up carrying us into contention in 2012.

Dye (good year before we signed him) and AJ (1 bad year) weren't declining like Craig and we got each absolutely dirt cheap. No 3/25 or 4/38. Pods was Pods. Bullpen can be 100 for all I care.

Edited July 9, 2014 by GreenSox

[caulfield12]

Use Youkilis as your example - he who was declining, whom we got for cheap in terms of players but who had a high salary, but who ended up carrying us into contention in 2012.

Dye (good year before we signed him) and AJ (1 bad year) weren't declining like Craig and we got each absolutely dirt cheap. No 3/25 or 4/38. Pods was Pods. Bullpen can be 100 for all I care.

 

 

Youkilis was already basically done because of the back problems...and we were fortunate that Middlebrooks was so promising then, or they wouldn't have parted with him so easily, just like the Thome/Ryan Howard situation in Philly.

 

Dye was coming off a broken leg.

 

The point is you do need SOME veterans in the mix for a playoff-contending team to be leaders.

 

The other point is that finding a "guaranteed" 800 OPS bat in the outfield isn't as easy as it seems. It's either going to cost money or talent. It's not like the situation with pitchers (Jenks, Santos, Humber, Quintana, Putnam, Noesi, Carroll, Guerra) where they just grow on trees and are magically reborn under Cooper.

 

In fact, the last everyday player we were able to pick up in that fashion was DeAza in 2010-11.

[witesoxfan]

He's 30 years old (in 9 days), he's not a strong defensive player, he has a history of injuries, he's not an athletic person (hinting towards quicker decline), he's owed $26 million guaranteed over the next 3 years, and he's not playing well this year.

 

In what world would that ever be a good addition to the Sox? You need to take chances on veterans now and then, but you don't have to commit $26 million to them over 3 years. Give them 1 or 2 year deals.

[cabiness42]

The problem is if you trade for guys like Seth Smith or Melky Cabrera, you're buying on the high.

 

That's never been the Sox way of going business....with the exception of Jeff Keppinger, and we all know how well that one worked out.

 

It's like the stock market. Is Allen Craig a sub 700 OPS guy or the one whose MLB average is 801 with 2.2/2.2/2.3 WAR seasons consecutively?

 

Which is the trend? Which is the outlier?

 

I wouldn't trade for Smith or Cabrera either. Sox need to be acquiring prospects, not established players.

 

[Kyyle23]

Allen Craig is a DH in the making. The guy is never healthy. He can hit, but I wouldnt count on putting him out on defense.

 

pass

[caulfield12]

And yet a lot of people wanted to acquire Kendrys Morales for $14.5 million, Victor Martinez for next year...or Colby Rasmus, for another example.

 

This 2015 White Sox can't be all players under 27 or 28. (Once you subtract Dunn/Ramirez/DeAza, that's exactly what we would have).

 

It sounds like we're trying to do a down-sized version of the Cubs' plan by acquiring all young position player prospects and hoping some of them turn out like Gillaspie. Meanwhile, we don't have any premium talent to give away to acquire aforementioned prospects, other than Alexei Ramirez.

Edited July 9, 2014 by caulfield12

[Balta1701]

Allen Craig is a DH in the making. The guy is never healthy. He can hit, but I wouldnt count on putting him out on defense.

 

pass

I'd be interested in him for that role if he were a lefty. Which he is not. Yet he's another guy who's been suggested like 3 years in a row.

[witesoxfan]

And yet a lot of people wanted to acquire sign Kendrys Morales for $14.5 million

 

For 1 or 2 years, without giving up a 1st round pick.

 

[sign] Victor Martinez for next year

 

For 1 or 2 years, without giving up a 1st round pick.

 

Colby Rasmus, for another example.

 

Colby Rasmus is going to be 28 next year, he plays CF, he will enter his prime next year, and he's an incredibly athletic player. He isn't similar to Allen Craig at all. He's also being considered because he'd be signed.

 

Those 3 would all be free to sign, while Craig costs players. He's also signed for 3 years while the others would be 1-2 (or Rasmus would be a long-term signing as a young player).

 

 

This 2015 White Sox can't be all players under 27 or 28. (Once you subtract Dunn/Ramirez/DeAza, that's exactly what we would have).

 

It sounds like we're trying to do a down-sized version of the Cubs' plan by acquiring all young position player prospects and hoping some of them turn out like Gillaspie. Meanwhile, we don't have any premium talent to give away to acquire aforementioned prospects, other than Alexei Ramirez.

 

Of course not, but that doesn't mean that you trade young players for old players who are signed for 3 years at $26 million who don't fill a position of need and who are playing poorly.

[cabiness42]

And yet a lot of people wanted to acquire Kendrys Morales for $14.5 million, Victor Martinez for next year...or Colby Rasmus, for another example.

 

This 2015 White Sox can't be all players under 27 or 28. (Once you subtract Dunn/Ramirez/DeAza, that's exactly what we would have).

 

It sounds like we're trying to do a down-sized version of the Cubs' plan by acquiring all young position player prospects and hoping some of them turn out like Gillaspie. Meanwhile, we don't have any premium talent to give away to acquire aforementioned prospects, other than Alexei Ramirez.

 

If an older guy can hit enough to stick at DH, then yes, he's worth spending money on, but Allen Craig does not fit that description. Also, I'm not in favor of subtracting Ramirez.

 

The way baseball's economic system works, it is very rarely worth the price, either in FA dollars or traded talent, to acquire a guy over 30. Maybe on a 1-year deal if you can get it.