Ferguson Riots

[southsider2k5]

Well, unfortunately, police brutality in communities has real world consequences, and those consequences were not reaped from those asking to end it. It's from those who perform it, and from those who do not punish it.

 

Most politicians are not corrupt, but it doesn't mean that a minority of them engaging in corruption is not an issue. It is, and it erodes public trust. That isn't the media/or watchdogs fault. It is the fault of the politicians if they do not try to self regulate.

 

So does preaching hate for the police. You are pretty well seeing the results of it.

[bmags]

So does preaching hate for the police. You are pretty well seeing the results of it.

 

Yes, people were outraged, not because in the middle of the day people saw a police officer shoot a kid dead with his hands raised, it was because of people "preaching police hate" for no reason!

[southsider2k5]

Yes, people were outraged, not because in the middle of the day people saw a police officer shoot a kid dead with his hands raised, it was because of people "preaching police hate" for no reason!

 

What are the chances that the reason the kid was running/fighting the police was because of a lifetime of conditioning about how evil police are? There is a pretty good chance that if the kid hadn't been brainwashed, he would still be alive.

[StrangeSox]

Yes, sure, he was "brainwashed" and it's all the community's fault that the cop shot an unarmed teenager in the back and then several times in the front as he stood with his hands in the air.

[StrangeSox]

the way to stop police brutality is for communities who are routinely brutalized by the police to pretend that nothing's wrong

[mr_genius]

Well it turns out that the story I originally read in the news was incorrect. The story I heard was this young man was quietly studying in the local library, preparing for his first semester at Harvard, when the police swooped in and shot him for absolutely no reason other than they didn't like black people in the library.

 

Turns out he was robbing stores, attacked a police office, tried to grab his gun, and ended up getting shot.

[StrangeSox]

Turns out he was robbing stores, attacked a police office, tried to grab his gun, [turned and ran, was shot in the back, turned and put his hands in the air] and ended up getting shot [several more times].

 

There's this pretty important middle part you left out for some weird/dumb reason.

 

I honestly don't know where you're at right now, your normal trolling posting or something more serious, but the argument you're presenting there is a pretty common one in similar cases. It's awful because it doesn't matter one bit what was going on before Brown turned around and ran away. You can't shoot a fleeing suspect in the back, and you sure as s*** can't shoot a surrendering suspect in the front multiple times.

Edited August 15, 2014 by StrangeSox

[southsider2k5]

the way to stop police brutality is for communities who are routinely brutalized by the police to pretend that nothing's wrong

 

Which is exactly what we are being asked to do for part of the story. Ironic isn't it?

 

[StrangeSox]

Which is exactly what we are being asked to do for part of the story. Ironic isn't it?

 

I have no idea what that's in reference to.

[cabiness42]

There's this pretty important middle part you left out for some weird/dumb reason.

 

I honestly don't know where you're at right now, your normal trolling posting or something more serious, but the argument you're presenting there is a pretty common one in similar cases. It's awful because it doesn't matter one bit what was going on before Brown turned around and ran away. You can't shoot a fleeing suspect in the back, and you sure as s*** can't shoot a surrendering suspect in the front multiple times.

 

The middle part is still awaiting forensic verification. If I were forced to take a side right now, I would say that I believe the kid really was shot in the back, but if forensics come back that he wasn't, then pretty much all of the eyewitness accounts are worthless.

[StrangeSox]

The middle part is still awaiting forensic verification. If I were forced to take a side right now, I would say that I believe the kid really was shot in the back, but if forensics come back that he wasn't, then pretty much all of the eyewitness accounts are worthless.

 

I don't know that there's any question that Brown was shot 20-30 feet from the police car. If there had been a single, fatal shot and it happened when the two were allegedly struggling for a gun, that would be different. But this was multiple shots when Brown was away from the vehicle and couldn't pose a threat justifying deadly force to the officer or public safety.

[mr_genius]

There's this pretty important middle part you left out for some weird/dumb reason.

 

probably the same part you keep leaving out

 

[cabiness42]

I don't know that there's any question that Brown was shot 20-30 feet from the police car. If there had been a single, fatal shot and it happened when the two were allegedly struggling for a gun, that would be different. But this was multiple shots when Brown was away from the vehicle and couldn't pose a threat justifying deadly force to the officer or public safety.

 

I agree that is likely the case, but I will wait for the forensics to confirm before declaring that I believe charges should be filed.

[mr_genius]

you sure as s*** can't shoot a surrendering suspect in the front multiple times.

 

which is it? he was shot in the back running or shot in the chest while his hands were in the air surrendering?

 

 

here's my problem with people like you. every time a story like this comes out you are in the front leading the charge with an angry mob, even though you don't know what really happened. if it turns out you were wrong and "got" an innocent person, no apologies you simply move on with your angry mob for your next target and recklessly try to ruin them.

Edited August 15, 2014 by mr_genius

[StrangeSox]

which is it? he was shot in the back running or shot in the chest while his hands were in the air surrendering?

 

If you have been paying the least bit of attention to this story or just read the quotes from the witnesses posted a page back, you'd know the answer to your question is "both."

[Jenksismyhero]

the way to stop police brutality is for communities who are routinely brutalized by the police to pretend that nothing's wrong

 

Riots and looting is the answer! That'll change their minds.

[bmags]

which is it? he was shot in the back running or shot in the chest while his hands were in the air surrendering?

 

According to witnesses, both. He was shot running, and turned around with his hands up. He was shot multiple times.

[bmags]

I agree that is likely the case, but I will wait for the forensics to confirm before declaring that I believe charges should be filed.

 

Police said on Sunday they wouldn't release autopsy info (except they might release toxicology reports, surprise), so I'm not sure we'll know this answer unless charges are filed against policeman.

[StrangeSox]

Speaking of getting the wrong person and still blindly charging ahead anyway, here's a lovely story of the Ferguson police charging a man with destruction of property for bleeding on their uniforms while they beat him.

 

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014...bloody-lie.html

 

But hey, it's the community's fault for having a poor view of the police.

[Jenksismyhero]

If you have been paying the least bit of attention to this story or just read the quotes from the witnesses posted a page back, you'd know the answer to your question is "both."

 

And we're 100% sure these witnesses are credible?

 

Also, I don't think you are surrendering when you're running away.

 

This cop might have murdered the kid, but I'd like to hear the results of the investigation before condemning him.

[bmags]

Which is exactly what we are being asked to do for part of the story. Ironic isn't it?

 

As has been stated multiple times in this thread, it is almost certain this kid was resisting arrest, which is obviously wrong, but the penalty is not death. And as we saw in Times Square shooting by policeman, the standards for shooting after a fleeing, unarmed suspect should be very high.

 

Two things that can be true:

- Mike Brown should have been arrested that day

- Mike Brown should not have been shot dead by an arresting officer

 

 

[StrangeSox]

And we're 100% sure these witnesses are credible?

 

We have no reason to doubt multiple independent witnesses at this point. So far, there's nothing that has directly contradicted what they are saying. Even the official police statements thus far have skirted around what exactly happened after the struggle in or through the car window. In other words, all known evidence to this point supports their story, nothing contradicts it and there's no reason to believe these people would lie or that they could have some how corroborated the same story.

 

Also, I don't think you are surrendering when you're running away.

 

According to witnesses, he was shot as he was running away. He then turned around and put his hands in the air before being shot several more times.

[bmags]

Also, I don't think you are surrendering when you're running away.

 

Good God. Please read anything in this same thread that clarifies the very simple points being made. This does not require repeating over and over.

[Jenksismyhero]

Speaking of getting the wrong person and still blindly charging ahead anyway, here's a lovely story of the Ferguson police charging a man with destruction of property for bleeding on their uniforms while they beat him.

 

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014...bloody-lie.html

 

But hey, it's the community's fault for having a poor view of the police.

 

That's terrible if true. But I have a difficult time believing cops would just randomly start beating someone. I'd be willing to bet he resisted, hence the need for more than one officer.

 

I wish some of you guys interned or job shadowed at a criminal courthouse. You're all wide-eyed optimists, and the degree to which people lie is astounding and would shock you. I'm not at all saying that's what happened in this case or the Brown case, but you all seem to discount the possibility.

[bmags]

According to witnesses, he was shot as he was running away. He then turned around and put his hands in the air before being shot several more times.

 

This should not have had to have been repeated so many times.