Mark Buehrle

[Balta1701]

I went off of this from http://www.baseballprospectus.com/compensa...cago-white-sox/

 

https://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=tK7...amp;output=html

$46 million on the books plus a couple million in arb to retain Flowers, Jones, and Noesi, followed by an extra $8 million ish to fill out the roster is where I get to $60 mil. Add in Viciedo for another $5 million and that would bring to about $65 in total payroll if Viciedo is offered arbitration. (You get $500k back for every guy you sign because that takes a roster spot away from a minimum salary player, but the $8 million to fill out the roster has to be counted because it'll count at the end).

 

To do a go for broke, all in season might leave them >$50 million-ish to spend, by my estimate

[southsider2k5]

$46 million on the books plus a couple million in arb to retain Flowers, Jones, and Noesi, followed by an extra $8 million ish to fill out the roster is where I get to $60 mil. Add in Viciedo for another $5 million and that would bring to about $65 in total payroll if Viciedo is offered arbitration. (You get $500k back for every guy you sign because that takes a roster spot away from a minimum salary player, but the $8 million to fill out the roster has to be counted because it'll count at the end).

 

To do a go for broke, all in season might leave them >$50 million-ish to spend, by my estimate

 

This is how I got it.

 

$46mil

 

+ Arb guys = 9 million [(Viciedo 5, Flowers 2, Jones 1, Noesi 1)]

 

$55 million

 

Pre arb guys [Recounting the roster spots, I thought we had 13 accounted for, looking a little closer it is actually 10, because Belli, PK, and Paulino are all on there, but not coming back. That leaves 15 spots at $.5 million each] + 7.5 mil = 62.5 million.

 

So I had 60, revised to 62.5 million taken up for next year.

 

I like the number of $30 million able to be added to the payroll for next year, leaving us slightly above where we were in 2014.

[Chisoxfn]

This is how I got it.

 

$46mil

 

+ Arb guys = 9 million [(Viciedo 5, Flowers 2, Jones 1, Noesi 1)]

 

$55 million

 

Pre arb guys [Recounting the roster spots, I thought we had 13 accounted for, looking a little closer it is actually 10, because Belli, PK, and Paulino are all on there, but not coming back. That leaves 15 spots at $.5 million each] + 7.5 mil = 62.5 million.

 

So I had 60, revised to 62.5 million taken up for next year.

 

I like the number of $30 million able to be added to the payroll for next year, leaving us slightly above where we were in 2014.

I expect if the right moves come about, the number is closer to 40 to 45 but I also am presuming there is zero chance we give Viciedo $5M and I think if we wanted to, we could likely get out of $5M or so of Danks contract per year (again, not saying we will). More realistically I think we will come in under that number to start the season and then continue to potentially add payroll during season. This could include in-house extensions, etc. I also believe Hahn has been quoted as saying more money will be allocated to big league rosters this year vs. last year where they had higher allotments to international FA signings and draft. Hahn also seemed to indicate that total expenditures would remain consistent and that he didn't see a decrease expected.

 

All that said, just cause we have that, doesn't mean it makes sense to blow it all but it also creates value in 1 year deals too and using some of those resources for guys who might be fillers who if we contend, great, if we don't, you hope you can turn them for more parts without impacting longterm payroll flexibility.

[GreenSox]

What is your point?

 

Care to discuss the possibility of Buehrle by any chance?

Signing MB would be ridiculous. We don't need a lefty starter. that would be spending money to spend money.

 

I don't think we'll spend $50 million because there really isn't enough talent to spend it on. There are a few good players, likely gobbled up by the big-spenders, and that's that. We might sign a mid range outfielder, take care of a few guys in arbitration, plug as many holes as possible and see how things go.

[BlackSox13]

Signing MB would be ridiculous. We don't need a lefty starter. that would be spending money to spend money.

 

I don't think we'll spend $50 million because there really isn't enough talent to spend it on. There are a few good players, likely gobbled up by the big-spenders, and that's that. We might sign a mid range outfielder, take care of a few guys in arbitration, plug as many holes as possible and see how things go.

It would be ridiculous considering Buehrle is under contract through the 2015 season...

 

Might want to read the thread instead of just the last page because you've clearly missed a few things...

 

As for a lefty starter. I said it before and I'll say it again, I don't give a toss what hand Sox pitchers throw with as long as they know how to get batters out and Buehrle is an immediate upgrade over Danks, Noesi and Carroll.

[greg775]

Look, Paulie is gone; Mark is a White Sox true and true. Time to bring him back ... now!

In 2-3 years he'll be wearing another World Series ring. With his example, our staff will be rockin.

[Jerksticks]

Look, Paulie is gone; Mark is a White Sox true and true. Time to bring him back ... now!

In 2-3 years he'll be wearing another World Series ring. With his example, our staff will be rockin.

Haha f*** it man I'm in. But Danks has to go then.

 

Who's gonna have the better year next year, Danks or Buehrle?

[Balta1701]

Haha f*** it man I'm in. But Danks has to go then.

 

Who's gonna have the better year next year, Danks or Buehrle?

Let's just be honest. Mark.

[Y2Jimmy0]

Wasn't Buehrle pretty bad in the 2nd half?

[witesoxfan]

Wasn't Buehrle pretty bad in the 2nd half?

 

He put up worse numbers, but it basically works out to be a correction to his career splits.

 

We watched Mark Buehrle pitch for 10 years. He's the same pitcher now that he was then. He's going to have times when he pitches absolute gems and others when he gets hit around quite a bit.

[Y2Jimmy0]

He put up worse numbers, but it basically works out to be a correction to his career splits.

 

We watched Mark Buehrle pitch for 10 years. He's the same pitcher now that he was then. He's going to have times when he pitches absolute gems and others when he gets hit around quite a bit.

 

I think $15 million would be more wisely spent on something else. I loved Buehrle. I think that ship has sailed though.

[witesoxfan]

I think $15 million would be more wisely spent on something else. I loved Buehrle. I think that ship has sailed though.

 

I absolutely agree. I think he's someone you can possibly look into signing next season, but I think trading for him this year would be a mistake.

[southsider2k5]

I expect if the right moves come about, the number is closer to 40 to 45 but I also am presuming there is zero chance we give Viciedo $5M and I think if we wanted to, we could likely get out of $5M or so of Danks contract per year (again, not saying we will). More realistically I think we will come in under that number to start the season and then continue to potentially add payroll during season. This could include in-house extensions, etc. I also believe Hahn has been quoted as saying more money will be allocated to big league rosters this year vs. last year where they had higher allotments to international FA signings and draft. Hahn also seemed to indicate that total expenditures would remain consistent and that he didn't see a decrease expected.

 

All that said, just cause we have that, doesn't mean it makes sense to blow it all but it also creates value in 1 year deals too and using some of those resources for guys who might be fillers who if we contend, great, if we don't, you hope you can turn them for more parts without impacting longterm payroll flexibility.

 

Obviously that number will move. If they don't bring back Dayan, that is $5 million-ish saved right there. Once they start signing people, that number goes up again. That is just a baseline by which to judge what kind of space we have to spend with this winter.

 

[LDF]

 

I saw a reply of the salary and the old comment from Hahn saying that it est to be

at 90+ mill. if I remember correctly, I think I posted a article and a link of Hahn saying or

quoting that the actual number increased to something like 105+ million. something

like 15 mil more than originally thought. I can't remember the reason.

 

so in essence the sox have a little more to use and spend. either way, there are

many options that is available for the sox to take advantage of.

[Balta1701]

I saw a reply of the salary and the old comment from Hahn saying that it est to be

at 90+ mill. if I remember correctly, I think I posted a article and a link of Hahn saying or

quoting that the actual number increased to something like 105+ million. something

like 15 mil more than originally thought. I can't remember the reason.

 

so in essence the sox have a little more to use and spend. either way, there are

many options that is available for the sox to take advantage of.

The one thing Ricky also said is that he won't "Spend money just to spend money", which if true is exactly the way he should be thinking.

[Eminor3rd]

The one thing Ricky also said is that he won't "Spend money just to spend money", which if true is exactly the way he should be thinking.

 

Amen to that.

[southsider2k5]

I saw a reply of the salary and the old comment from Hahn saying that it est to be

at 90+ mill. if I remember correctly, I think I posted a article and a link of Hahn saying or

quoting that the actual number increased to something like 105+ million. something

like 15 mil more than originally thought. I can't remember the reason.

 

so in essence the sox have a little more to use and spend. either way, there are

many options that is available for the sox to take advantage of.

 

I've seen outside speculation about nine figure payrolls. The organization itself has expressly said it will NOT name a payroll number publicly because they do not want it out there. They don't want to have it affect negotiations or strategy in any form.

[witesoxfan]

I've seen outside speculation about nine figure payrolls. The organization itself has expressly said it will NOT name a payroll number publicly because they do not want it out there. They don't want to have it affect negotiations or strategy in any form.

 

It's also because they don't know it yet. If pieces fit just right, I could see them around $110 million. If they don't, I could just as easily see them around $75 million.

 

They'll spend some money but it's hard to know on just what exactly.

[greg775]

It's also because they don't know it yet. If pieces fit just right, I could see them around $110 million. If they don't, I could just as easily see them around $75 million.

 

They'll spend some money but it's hard to know on just what exactly.

 

If Hahn can win at 75 million bless him. I just want to win and win now. Frankly the Royals are gonna be difficult to knock off their pedastal for upcoming years as they become the Detroit of our division. If they make some smart moves by replacing Shields and Butler with capable players they only figure to get better. Watching the Royals defense and pitching makes me cringe about the Sox condition. Think of all the great plays they've made in the outfield that would fall in our left and rightfield corners.

GO SOX! Change the roster significantly Mr. Hahn! But I do think Mark B should be included in the retooling.

Edited October 29, 2014 by greg775

[witesoxfan]

If Hahn can win at 75 million bless him. I just want to win and win now. Frankly the Royals are gonna be difficult to knock off their pedastal for upcoming years as they become the Detroit of our division. If they make some smart moves by replacing Shields and Butler with capable players they only figure to get better. Watching the Royals defense and pitching makes me cringe about the Sox condition. Think of all the great plays they've made in the outfield that would fall in our left and rightfield corners.

GO SOX! Change the roster significantly Mr. Hahn! But I do think Mark B should be included in the retooling.

 

Hahn and company have a plan, but plans don't always work out as you hope they do. If they spend $75 million, they (likely) aren't going to win the division. Frankly, they're not likely to win the division anyways, but it will be substantially harder at $75 million. The idea, as mentioned above, is that they are not going to spend money just to spend money. They will spend money on players that fit.

 

To your second point, you are doing that for pure nostalgic reasons, which is OK, but it would not be an efficient use of resources. Perhaps it's something that's revisted at the trade deadline next year if/when the Sox need a starter and if/when Buehrle's (new) team is out of the playoff picture.

[bigruss]

Hahn and company have a plan, but plans don't always work out as you hope they do. If they spend $75 million, they (likely) aren't going to win the division. Frankly, they're not likely to win the division anyways, but it will be substantially harder at $75 million. The idea, as mentioned above, is that they are not going to spend money just to spend money. They will spend money on players that fit.

 

To your second point, you are doing that for pure nostalgic reasons, which is OK, but it would not be an efficient use of resources. Perhaps it's something that's revisted at the trade deadline next year if/when the Sox need a starter and if/when Buehrle's (new) team is out of the playoff picture.

Exactly, the last thing we want to do is spend money on players that don't fit into our 3-5 year plan, or wouldn't have value in a few years and could be traded off.

 

Spending money on players that fit what you are trying to do now and will be valuable internally/externally makes sense, giving someone a 3 year, 21 million dollar deal when you only have a need for them for 1 year doesn't make sense at this point for the Sox. Those deals are acceptable when it's the last or one of the last missing pieces on a playoff caliber team. We're not there yet.

[Eminor3rd]

If Hahn can win at 75 million bless him. I just want to win and win now. Frankly the Royals are gonna be difficult to knock off their pedastal for upcoming years as they become the Detroit of our division. If they make some smart moves by replacing Shields and Butler with capable players they only figure to get better. Watching the Royals defense and pitching makes me cringe about the Sox condition. Think of all the great plays they've made in the outfield that would fall in our left and rightfield corners.

GO SOX! Change the roster significantly Mr. Hahn! But I do think Mark B should be included in the retooling.

 

Couple issues I have with this post:

 

1. I don't see ANY evidence that the Royals will be anything like Detroit. The money they make from this run, if reinvested back in the team, could create a significant payroll bump, but that could be something like $10-15m per year. Nothing remotely close to what the Tigers are doing. And the effect of that will be seen immediately when Shields walks.

 

2. The Royals are an 88 win team right now, and are about to lose their #1 starter. They may replace him, but unless it comes via shrewd trade, it will be at a higher cost, thus digging into their surplus just to tread water. If it comes via shrewd trade, it will essentially be borrowing from resources from the future, which shortens the contention window, which also makes them less likely to be the Tigers.

 

3. You can make an argument that the Royals rotation is no better than ours, and if you assume that Shields is gone, worse than ours. The defense and bullpen are unquestionably better, but alone, that doesn't create some monolith at the top of the division for the next few years.

 

Honestly, unless you think that Hosmer/Moustakas had fluke down years, I think the Royals are going to struggle to be better than this year's team, and this year's team wouldn't have been in the playoffs if the Tigers didn't rollover, The A's offense didn't collapse, and maybe even if Derek Norris doesn't receive a fluke hand injury that allowed them to steal bases at will in the wildcard game. Not saying they didn't earn what they got (they unquestionably have), but this isn't some unstoppable force -- it's a slightly above average team that got some gifts and went on a tear at the best time possible.

[southsider2k5]

I've said it before, and will say it again, there will be a LOT of pressure for the Royals to re-sign Shields that would not have been there if they had flamed out early or missed the playoffs.

[Eminor3rd]

I've said it before, and will say it again, there will be a LOT of pressure for the Royals to re-sign Shields that would not have been there if they had flamed out early or missed the playoffs.

 

I honestly hope they do. He's a mid-rotation starter going forward, IMO.

[southsider2k5]

I honestly hope they do. He's a mid-rotation starter going forward, IMO.

 

Me too. And I hope it is a nine figure contract.