Victor Martinez Re-signs with Tigers

[LDF]

I'd like to see your breakdown on who you think gets what with those 4. Anderson can't stay healthy,

Romo throws an 88 mph FB, LaRoche can't hit lefties and Rasmus defensive metrics are dropping,

his K rate is rising and he himself has questioned his love of the game.

 

On the plus side none of them had a career yr ( or even close to it ) so that is a sure signal to snatch

them up early because of all the teams who love to sign trending downward free agents for megabucks

 

but here is a problem with cherry picking a specific part of the advance stats.

LaRoche has an for an avg of hitting, 270 hitting avg, 20 hrs a yr, 500 + at bats.

 

remember I am not trying to compare his stats to anyone else, just responding

to your answer.

 

[LDF]

Let's say they added Rasmus, LaRoche, Brett Anderson and Romo...along with the idea of Rodon joining the team at mid-season.

 

Does anyone believe that's enough to put the White Sox in contention in 2015?

 

 

We have to face the fact that outside of signing Scherzer, Lester, Sandoval, V-Mart or Hanley Ramirez, there aren't many INDIVIDUAL players who will move the meter until the Sox start winning again.

 

The combination I listed above is going to cost around $37.5-45 million in added payroll, just a guess.

 

Anderson needs to be healthy to start the season. like this his presence will

help ease Rodon into the game.

[caulfield12]

Someone will give Rasmus $36 million for 3 years because of his youth, ability to play all three outfield spots and "potential."

 

Romo one year at $8-9 million. (If guys like Andrew Miller are getting $20 million plus based on one season...or Gregerson, that's not hard to imagine at all).

 

Anderson's hard to predict...he won't want to sign a long-term deal, so he's going to try to max out a one year deal or a single year with option/s attached. If Jake Peavy's going to get $10 million (plus), then I'll put Anderson at $8.5 million (roughly where Josh Johnson was).

 

That gets you to $29 million. Then LaRoche at $8.5 million for 2 years, for a total of $17 million. (Remember, Gold Glove caliber, etc., that comes with a price even if the White Sox want Abreu to play there the majority of the time).

 

There's $37.5 million.

Edited November 5, 2014 by caulfield12

[LDF]

Someone will give Rasmus $36 million for 3 years because of his youth, ability to play all three outfield spots and "potential."

 

Romo one year at $8-9 million. (If guys like Andrew Miller are getting $20 million plus based on one season...or Gregerson, that's not hard to imagine at all).

 

Anderson's hard to predict...he won't want to sign a long-term deal, so he's going to try to max out a one year deal or a single year with option/s attached. If Jake Peavy's going to get $10 million (plus), then I'll put Anderson at $8.5 million (roughly where Josh Johnson was).

 

That gets you to $29 million. Then LaRoche at $8.5 million for 2 years, for a total of $17 million. (Remember, Gold Glove caliber, etc., that comes with a price even if the White Sox want Abreu to play there the majority of the time).

 

There's $37.5 million.

 

for the most part I am with you on this. but this got my head scratching. LaRoche

will get his 15 mil.

[caulfield12]

for the most part I am with you on this. but this got my head scratching. LaRoche

will get his 15 mil.

 

 

At his age, and with his splits....he could get $10 million, perhaps, but I don't believe he's a $15 million a year player in his mid 30's. Not at 1B/DH.

[Eminor3rd]

I am coming very late to this party, so I will say this only Bravo. excellent

post.

 

on a side note dang, I wish I could write like this.

 

Thanks man!

Edited November 5, 2014 by Eminor3rd

[Balta1701]

At his age, and with his splits....he could get $10 million, perhaps, but I don't believe he's a $15 million a year player in his mid 30's. Not at 1B/DH.

I think you're way overguessing on Rasmus but I think you're accurate, maybe even a bit under, on Laroche.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

but here is a problem with cherry picking a specific part of the advance stats.

LaRoche has an for an avg of hitting, 270 hitting avg, 20 hrs a yr, 500 + at bats.

 

remember I am not trying to compare his stats to anyone else, just responding

to your answer.

Since he is 35 ( only 13 months younger than VMArt) I like to look for things that might indicate his career is trending down . The last 2 years he hasn't hit lefties well which to me is more important than than his career stats. VMart crushed all pitchers but if you can "cherry pick" me a clear signal that he is trending downward, be my guest.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

Someone will give Rasmus $36 million for 3 years because of his youth, ability to play all three outfield spots and "potential."

 

Romo one year at $8-9 million. (If guys like Andrew Miller are getting $20 million plus based on one season...or Gregerson, that's not hard to imagine at all).

 

Anderson's hard to predict...he won't want to sign a long-term deal, so he's going to try to max out a one year deal or a single year with option/s attached. If Jake Peavy's going to get $10 million (plus), then I'll put Anderson at $8.5 million (roughly where Josh Johnson was).

 

That gets you to $29 million. Then LaRoche at $8.5 million for 2 years, for a total of $17 million. (Remember, Gold Glove caliber, etc., that comes with a price even if the White Sox want Abreu to play there the majority of the time).

 

There's $37.5 million.

I think Anderson will be lucky to get $5M + incentives based on innings pitched . Rasmus way too much, Romo and LaRoche very speculative as I think both are NL players. But it is probable LaRoche gets $10M+.

[Dick Allen]

Brett Anderson hasn't pitched more than 83 innings in a season since 2010, and hasn't pitched more than 112 since 2009. Coming off back surgery, I don't know how anyone could project him to suddenly be a guy who can pitch the entire season.

 

Giving him $5 million is a waste of money. Sign players that will actually help you win, not guys who will spend most of the year on the DL.

Edited November 5, 2014 by Dick Allen

[Lillian]

If the Sox are going to compete, they must have one really potent, middle of the order, left handed bat. Hitting RH pitching is always of greater value than hitting lefties, simply because there are so many more of them. In the American League, and particularly in the Central Division, the Sox will arguably have most of the best lefties in Sale, Quintana and an emerging Rodon. It makes little sense to have a lineup full of right handed hitters, with most of the good southpaws in the League, on your staff.

 

Whether or not you agree is less important than the fact that R. Hahn has openly stated this need for a potent left handed bat. There is simply no better option available to fill that need than Victor Martinez. The arguments have already been eloquently made for signing him, including the payroll flexibility and draft protection that makes his acquisition feasible.

 

One of the arguments against signing him has been the need to fill other holes, and the inability of the Sox to contend without first doing so.

I agree in principle with the position that it only makes sense to acquire V Mart, if the Sox can contend. In fact, Martinez himself has indicated that he only wants to play for a contender.

 

The issue for me is whether or not the front office can fill the other holes this season. Many of you have expressed concerns about needing another outfielder. Filling that hole may not be that difficult. The Sox would not need a big offensive threat at that position. With Abreu and Martinez as the 3 and 4 hitters, Eaton leading off, the on base ability of C. Gillaspie, the solid offensive contributions of A. Garcia and Alexei, they could get by with a good defensive right fielder, with a good arm and decent on base skills. That would enable them to move Garcia to LF, where his raw defensive skills would not be a liability. Remember, Avi does at least possess good speed and a strong arm.

 

It appears that Hahn has had interest in Aoki for that role. I first thought that Shuck might be that kind of guy, but the more I read about him the less convinced I am. Aoki is intriguing because he profiles as a good 2 hole hitter as well. The problem is that he is not very good vs RH pitching. However, someone like him, with reverse splits, would be adequate, and not that expensive, or hard to find.

 

You would think that a team like Seattle, seeking a right handed power bat, might be willing to trade a good defensive right fielder, for Viciedo. I don't think that it matters from which side of the plate that outfielder bats. With Martinez in the middle of the lineup, the need for the left handed hitter would be filled. Someone suggested Saunders, and that would be fine, if Seattle were willing to make that trade.

Then there is always the international pool of talent. Again, the Sox do not need a big bat in the outfield.

 

The bullpen is a big concern, but with the additions of Bassitt, one good left hander, Montas and Cleto the pen could well become an asset, rather than the liability it was in 2014. After all, while they lost Lindstrom and Jones, the Sox did witness the emergence of Putnam and Petricka as solid set up guys. J. Guerra also looks like he's back, and can be counted upon. Of course, they will have to find a closer, but they do have candidates, including the aforementioned Montas and Cleto.

 

That brings up another issue. The Sox record was much worse than the teams overall effort, due to all of the games which the bullpen blew. How many times did Sale and Quintana give the Sox a great chance to win, only to see the pen implode? Fix the pen, and the won/loss column would look dramatically different.

 

So, in summary:

 

Sign V. Martinez?

Find a good defensive R.F. with the ability to get on base and provide a little speed.

Sign a #3 RH Starter

Sign one good LH reliever

 

That should be within the budget of the front office, and could very well put a contender on the field this coming season. Providing management could accomplish those other goals, I'd vote to try to sign Martinez. For me the question is; Would V Mart consider signing with the Sox, not should they offer him a lucrative contract. So, what would I offer him, if it were my decision (not necessarily my money)? I'd offer him what I speculated it would take to sign him; 4 years and $70 Million.

Edited November 5, 2014 by Lillian

[Kyyle23]

omg lillian

 

OH

MY

GAWD

[brian310]

If the Sox are going to compete, they must have one really potent, middle of the order, left handed bat. Hitting RH pitching is always of greater value than hitting lefties, simply because there are so many more of them. In the American League, and particularly in the Central Division, the Sox will arguably have most of the best lefties in Sale, Quintana and an emerging Rodon. It makes little sense to have a lineup full of right handed hitters, with most of the good southpaws in the League, on your staff.

 

Whether or not you agree is less important than the fact that R. Hahn has openly stated this need for a potent left handed bat. There is simply no better option available to fill that need than Victor Martinez. The arguments have already been eloquently made for signing him, including the payroll flexibility and draft protection that makes his acquisition feasible.

 

One of the arguments against signing him has been the need to fill other holes, and the inability of the Sox to contend without first doing so.

I agree in principle with the position that it only makes sense to acquire V Mart, if the Sox can contend. In fact, Martinez himself has indicated that he only wants to play for a contender.

 

The issue for me is whether or not the front office can fill the other holes this season. Many of you have expressed concerns about needing another outfielder. Filling that hole may not be that difficult. The Sox would not need a big offensive threat at that position. With Abreu and Martinez as the 3 and 4 hitters, Eaton leading off, the on base ability of C. Gillaspie, the solid offensive contributions of A. Garcia and Alexei, they could get by with a good defensive right fielder, with a good arm and decent on base skills. That would enable them to move Garcia to LF, where his raw defensive skills would not be a liability. Remember, Avi does at least possess good speed and a strong arm.

 

It appears that Hahn has had interest in Aoki for that role. I first thought that Shuck might be that kind of guy, but the more I read about him the less convinced I am. Aoki is intriguing because he profiles as a good 2 hole hitter as well. The problem is that he is not very good vs RH pitching. However, someone like him, with reverse splits, would be adequate, and not that expensive, or hard to find.

 

You would think that a team like Seattle, seeking a right handed power bat, might be willing to trade a good defensive right fielder, for Viciedo. I don't think that it matters from which side of the plate that outfielder bats. With Martinez in the middle of the lineup, the need for the left handed hitter would be filled. Someone suggested Saunders, and that would be fine, if Seattle were willing to make that trade.

Then there is always the international pool of talent. Again, the Sox do not need a big bat in the outfield.

 

The bullpen is a big concern, but with the additions of Babbit, one good left hander, Montas and Cleto the pen could well become an asset, rather than the liability it was in 2014. After all, while they lost Lindstrom and Jones, the Sox did witness the emergence of Putnam and Petricka as solid set up guys. J. Guerra also looks like he's back, and can be counted upon. Of course, they will have to find a closer, but they do have candidates, including the aforementioned Montas and Cleto.

 

That brings up another issue. The Sox record was much worse than the teams overall effort, due to all of the games which the bullpen blew. How many times did Sale and Quintana give the Sox a great chance to win, only to see the pen implode? Fix the pen, and the won/loss column would look dramatically different.

 

So, in summary:

 

Sign V. Martinez?

Find a good defensive R.F. with the ability to get on base and provide a little speed.

Sign a #3 RH Starter

Sign one good LH reliever

 

That should be within the budget of the front office, and could very well put a contender on the field this coming season. For me the question is; Would V Mart consider signing with the Sox, not should they offer him a lucrative contract.

 

I want the Sox to add a solid defensive right fielder as well moving Avi to left. Sign Martinez, McCarthy, Cotts and another lefty for the pen.

[caulfield12]

I think Anderson will be lucky to get $5M + incentives based on innings pitched . Rasmus way too much, Romo and LaRoche very speculative as I think both are NL players. But it is probable LaRoche gets $10M+.

 

 

The thing is, Rasmus remains the only young outfielder on the market who can be bought on a dip...but that doesn't mean he's going to be supercheap, because he had a very solid 2013.

 

His age, more than anything else, works in his favor. I can't believe Rasmus is going to sign for something like $24 million for 3 years when Andrew Freaking Miller is going to make more simply based on 2014. C'mon. A LH SET UP guy is going to go for the same price as Rasmus? I'm not buying it at all.

 

 

Let's say you're the Royals. Here are your choices for RF/DH: Nelson Cruz, Melky Cabrera, Torii Hunter, Michael Morse and Nick Markakis. Do you at least not seriously consider Rasmus, when all five of those players come with huge warts themselves? I'd have to imagine that signing those players for the White Sox would be even riskier than controlling an outfielder in the prime of his career for the next three seasons, two of them being years when the White Sox will desperately need LH bats and power.

 

http://www.kansascity.com/sports/spt-colum...cle3503545.html

By the way, the Royals are another good match for Brett Anderson and there's even a thought they would be willing to "sell high" on Greg Holland...along with the opposite thought, that they'll add Hochevar to the mix next year and try to make their bullpen even stronger for innings 6-9 so as not to overuse Herrera and Davis. At any rate, there seems to be a decent supply of those "mid tier" starters who would help the Royals bridge the gap to Finnegan/Manaea/Binford/Almonte.

 

 

 

 

[brian310]

The thing is, Rasmus remains the only young outfielder on the market who can be bought on a dip...but that doesn't mean he's going to be supercheap, because he had a very solid 2013.

 

His age, more than anything else, works in his favor. I can't believe Rasmus is going to sign for something like $24 million for 3 years when Andrew Freaking Miller is going to make more simply based on 2014. C'mon. A LH SET UP guy is going to go for the same price as Rasmus? I'm not buying it at all.

 

 

Let's say you're the Royals. Here are your choices for RF/DH: Nelson Cruz, Melky Cabrera, Torii Hunter, Michael Morse and Nick Markakis. Do you at least not seriously consider Rasmus, when all five of those players come with huge warts themselves? I'd have to imagine that signing those players for the White Sox would be even riskier than controlling an outfielder in the prime of his career for the next three seasons, two of them being years when the White Sox will desperately need LH bats and power.

 

http://www.kansascity.com/sports/spt-colum...cle3503545.html

By the way, the Royals are another good match for Brett Anderson and there's even a thought they would be willing to "sell high" on Greg Holland...along with the opposite thought, that they'll add Hochevar to the mix next year and try to make their bullpen even stronger for innings 6-9 so as not to overuse Herrera and Davis. At any rate, there seems to be a decent supply of those "mid tier" starters who would help the Royals bridge the gap to Finnegan/Manaea/Binford/Almonte.

 

Rasmus lost his starting spot last year. I think he may be open to taking a one year deal (plus incentives) to rebuild value to enter free agency next off-season still at a decently young age.

[caulfield12]

If the Sox are going to compete, they must have one really potent, middle of the order, left handed bat. Hitting RH pitching is always of greater value than hitting lefties, simply because there are so many more of them. In the American League, and particularly in the Central Division, the Sox will arguably have most of the best lefties in Sale, Quintana and an emerging Rodon. It makes little sense to have a lineup full of right handed hitters, with most of the good southpaws in the League, on your staff.

 

Whether or not you agree is less important than the fact that R. Hahn has openly stated this need for a potent left handed bat. There is simply no better option available to fill that need than Victor Martinez. The arguments have already been eloquently made for signing him, including the payroll flexibility and draft protection that makes his acquisition feasible.

 

One of the arguments against signing him has been the need to fill other holes, and the inability of the Sox to contend without first doing so.

I agree in principle with the position that it only makes sense to acquire V Mart, if the Sox can contend. In fact, Martinez himself has indicated that he only wants to play for a contender.

 

The issue for me is whether or not the front office can fill the other holes this season. Many of you have expressed concerns about needing another outfielder. Filling that hole may not be that difficult. The Sox would not need a big offensive threat at that position. With Abreu and Martinez as the 3 and 4 hitters, Eaton leading off, the on base ability of C. Gillaspie, the solid offensive contributions of A. Garcia and Alexei, they could get by with a good defensive right fielder, with a good arm and decent on base skills. That would enable them to move Garcia to LF, where his raw defensive skills would not be a liability. Remember, Avi does at least possess good speed and a strong arm.

 

It appears that Hahn has had interest in Aoki for that role. I first thought that Shuck might be that kind of guy, but the more I read about him the less convinced I am. Aoki is intriguing because he profiles as a good 2 hole hitter as well. The problem is that he is not very good vs RH pitching. However, someone like him, with reverse splits, would be adequate, and not that expensive, or hard to find.

 

You would think that a team like Seattle, seeking a right handed power bat, might be willing to trade a good defensive right fielder, for Viciedo. I don't think that it matters from which side of the plate that outfielder bats. With Martinez in the middle of the lineup, the need for the left handed hitter would be filled. Someone suggested Saunders, and that would be fine, if Seattle were willing to make that trade.

Then there is always the international pool of talent. Again, the Sox do not need a big bat in the outfield.

 

The bullpen is a big concern, but with the additions of Babbit, one good left hander, Montas and Cleto the pen could well become an asset, rather than the liability it was in 2014. After all, while they lost Lindstrom and Jones, the Sox did witness the emergence of Putnam and Petricka as solid set up guys. J. Guerra also looks like he's back, and can be counted upon. Of course, they will have to find a closer, but they do have candidates, including the aforementioned Montas and Cleto.

 

That brings up another issue. The Sox record was much worse than the teams overall effort, due to all of the games which the bullpen blew. How many times did Sale and Quintana give the Sox a great chance to win, only to see the pen implode? Fix the pen, and the won/loss column would look dramatically different.

 

So, in summary:

 

Sign V. Martinez?

Find a good defensive R.F. with the ability to get on base and provide a little speed.

Sign a #3 RH Starter

Sign one good LH reliever

 

That should be within the budget of the front office, and could very well put a contender on the field this coming season. Providing management could accomplish those other goals, I'd vote to try to sign Martinez. For me the question is; Would V Mart consider signing with the Sox, not should they offer him a lucrative contract. So, what would I offer him, if it were my decision (not necessarily my money)? I'd offer him what I speculated it would take to sign him; 4 years and $70 Million.

 

 

It would be shocking for the White Sox to sign Martinez.

 

And without Martinez, you can't have Aoki in the outfield. You're just giving up way too much power to acquire a platoon hitter who's a below average defender.

 

The fact of the matter is the Royals have six Gold Glove caliber players in Moustakas, Hosmer, Perez, Cain, Escobar and Dyson. We can't afford to add position players who aren't going to be both above-average offensively and defensively, unless they're close to Gold Glove/Silver Slugger caliber.

[caulfield12]

Rasmus lost his starting spot last year. I think he may be open to taking a one year deal (plus incentives) to rebuild value to enter free agency next off-season still at a decently young age.

 

The only way Rasmus is going to pay off is if we AT LEAST control him into the 2016 season.

 

Otherwise, we're just another version of the Cubs for the last 3-4 years, and acquiring assets to turn around and sell them to the highest bidder.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

If the Sox are going to compete, they must have one really potent, middle of the order, left handed bat. Hitting RH pitching is always of greater value than hitting lefties, simply because there are so many more of them. In the American League, and particularly in the Central Division, the Sox will arguably have most of the best lefties in Sale, Quintana and an emerging Rodon. It makes little sense to have a lineup full of right handed hitters, with most of the good southpaws in the League, on your staff.

 

Whether or not you agree is less important than the fact that R. Hahn has openly stated this need for a potent left handed bat. There is simply no better option available to fill that need than Victor Martinez. The arguments have already been eloquently made for signing him, including the payroll flexibility and draft protection that makes his acquisition feasible.

 

One of the arguments against signing him has been the need to fill other holes, and the inability of the Sox to contend without first doing so.

I agree in principle with the position that it only makes sense to acquire V Mart, if the Sox can contend. In fact, Martinez himself has indicated that he only wants to play for a contender.

 

The issue for me is whether or not the front office can fill the other holes this season. Many of you have expressed concerns about needing another outfielder. Filling that hole may not be that difficult. The Sox would not need a big offensive threat at that position. With Abreu and Martinez as the 3 and 4 hitters, Eaton leading off, the on base ability of C. Gillaspie, the solid offensive contributions of A. Garcia and Alexei, they could get by with a good defensive right fielder, with a good arm and decent on base skills. That would enable them to move Garcia to LF, where his raw defensive skills would not be a liability. Remember, Avi does at least possess good speed and a strong arm.

 

It appears that Hahn has had interest in Aoki for that role. I first thought that Shuck might be that kind of guy, but the more I read about him the less convinced I am. Aoki is intriguing because he profiles as a good 2 hole hitter as well. The problem is that he is not very good vs RH pitching. However, someone like him, with reverse splits, would be adequate, and not that expensive, or hard to find.

 

You would think that a team like Seattle, seeking a right handed power bat, might be willing to trade a good defensive right fielder, for Viciedo. I don't think that it matters from which side of the plate that outfielder bats. With Martinez in the middle of the lineup, the need for the left handed hitter would be filled. Someone suggested Saunders, and that would be fine, if Seattle were willing to make that trade.

Then there is always the international pool of talent. Again, the Sox do not need a big bat in the outfield.

 

The bullpen is a big concern, but with the additions of Babbit, one good left hander, Montas and Cleto the pen could well become an asset, rather than the liability it was in 2014. After all, while they lost Lindstrom and Jones, the Sox did witness the emergence of Putnam and Petricka as solid set up guys. J. Guerra also looks like he's back, and can be counted upon. Of course, they will have to find a closer, but they do have candidates, including the aforementioned Montas and Cleto.

 

That brings up another issue. The Sox record was much worse than the teams overall effort, due to all of the games which the bullpen blew. How many times did Sale and Quintana give the Sox a great chance to win, only to see the pen implode? Fix the pen, and the won/loss column would look dramatically different.

 

So, in summary:

 

Sign V. Martinez?

Find a good defensive R.F. with the ability to get on base and provide a little speed.

Sign a #3 RH Starter

Sign one good LH reliever

 

That should be within the budget of the front office, and could very well put a contender on the field this coming season. Providing management could accomplish those other goals, I'd vote to try to sign Martinez. For me the question is; Would V Mart consider signing with the Sox, not should they offer him a lucrative contract. So, what would I offer him, if it were my decision (not necessarily my money)? I'd offer him what I speculated it would take to sign him; 4 years and $70 Million.

Very good summary though your solutions for the pen are a bit farfetched. No idea who Babbit is and Montas will be given every chance to stick as a starter and Cleto can't throw strikes. I was the one who suggested Saunders so if he could be traded for then there's no need to sign a FA OF and the remaining money after signing VMart could be used on the pen and/or innings eater SP . I don't like Aoki , his defense just isn't up to snuff for a slap hitter type.

[caulfield12]

Brett Anderson hasn't pitched more than 83 innings in a season since 2010, and hasn't pitched more than 112 since 2009. Coming off back surgery, I don't know how anyone could project him to suddenly be a guy who can pitch the entire season.

 

Giving him $5 million is a waste of money. Sign players that will actually help you win, not guys who will spend most of the year on the DL.

 

 

Just like $60 million will be a HUGE waste of money for Martinez.

 

I'll take 5-10 Anderson's and win that bet every time. The problem is that Hahn has to make much better assessments in that salary range than Keppinger, Belisario, Downs and Paulino (to a lesser extent).

 

Besides, we wasted a lot more than that on Beckham and DeAza with little payoff as well.

 

 

[Dick Allen]

Just like $60 million will be a HUGE waste of money for Martinez.

 

I'll take 5-10 Anderson's and win that bet every time. The problem is that Hahn has to make much better assessments in that salary range than Keppinger, Belisario, Downs and Paulino (to a lesser extent).

 

Besides, we wasted a lot more than that on Beckham and DeAza with little payoff as well.

Yeah, spread it around. $4.25 million for Keppinger, $3 million for Belisario, $2 million for Paulino, $4 million for Downs, how did that work out? All the proverbial low risk, high reward BS that so many like better than actually watching a team win games.You are going to need a lot more than 5 or 10 Andersons to make it through the season. You do not "win bets", let alone win bets everytime loading your roster with players that cannot play even half a season.

Edited November 5, 2014 by Dick Allen

[caulfield12]

Very good summary though your solutions for the pen are a bit farfetched. No idea who Babbit is and Montas will be given every chance to stick as a starter and Cleto can't throw strikes. I was the one who suggested Saunders so if he could be traded for then there's no need to sign a FA OF and the remaining money after signing VMart could be used on the pen and/or innings eater SP . I don't like Aoki , his defense just isn't up to snuff for a slap hitter type.

 

Bassitt, not Bruce or the novel name

 

Saunders will now cost more than just Viciedo, if they actually intend to keep Dayan on the roster through the offseason.

 

Like Aoki, Saunders is fine if you add a BIG bat in the middle of the line-up to go with Abreu and hopefully Avisail. He's going to give you marginal improvement, but he's the definition of a complementary player on a really good team. Now I would rather have him than Nick Markakis, but that's simply cost-benefit analysis, not who's the better player.

Edited November 5, 2014 by caulfield12

[Eminor3rd]

I think I agree with caulfield.

 

The problem is this: posters have taken dozens of well-thought-out stabs at what going "all in" would look like this year. Some seem insane, some seem conservative, etc.

 

And to me, ALL of them leave us with what looks like a very mediocre team.

[AlSoxfan]

If the Sox are going to compete, they must have one really potent, middle of the order, left handed bat. Hitting RH pitching is always of greater value than hitting lefties, simply because there are so many more of them. In the American League, and particularly in the Central Division, the Sox will arguably have most of the best lefties in Sale, Quintana and an emerging Rodon. It makes little sense to have a lineup full of right handed hitters, with most of the good southpaws in the League, on your staff.

 

Whether or not you agree is less important than the fact that R. Hahn has openly stated this need for a potent left handed bat. There is simply no better option available to fill that need than Victor Martinez. The arguments have already been eloquently made for signing him, including the payroll flexibility and draft protection that makes his acquisition feasible.

 

One of the arguments against signing him has been the need to fill other holes, and the inability of the Sox to contend without first doing so.

I agree in principle with the position that it only makes sense to acquire V Mart, if the Sox can contend. In fact, Martinez himself has indicated that he only wants to play for a contender.

 

The issue for me is whether or not the front office can fill the other holes this season. Many of you have expressed concerns about needing another outfielder. Filling that hole may not be that difficult. The Sox would not need a big offensive threat at that position. With Abreu and Martinez as the 3 and 4 hitters, Eaton leading off, the on base ability of C. Gillaspie, the solid offensive contributions of A. Garcia and Alexei, they could get by with a good defensive right fielder, with a good arm and decent on base skills. That would enable them to move Garcia to LF, where his raw defensive skills would not be a liability. Remember, Avi does at least possess good speed and a strong arm.

 

It appears that Hahn has had interest in Aoki for that role. I first thought that Shuck might be that kind of guy, but the more I read about him the less convinced I am. Aoki is intriguing because he profiles as a good 2 hole hitter as well. The problem is that he is not very good vs RH pitching. However, someone like him, with reverse splits, would be adequate, and not that expensive, or hard to find.

 

You would think that a team like Seattle, seeking a right handed power bat, might be willing to trade a good defensive right fielder, for Viciedo. I don't think that it matters from which side of the plate that outfielder bats. With Martinez in the middle of the lineup, the need for the left handed hitter would be filled. Someone suggested Saunders, and that would be fine, if Seattle were willing to make that trade.

Then there is always the international pool of talent. Again, the Sox do not need a big bat in the outfield.

 

The bullpen is a big concern, but with the additions of Babbit, one good left hander, Montas and Cleto the pen could well become an asset, rather than the liability it was in 2014. After all, while they lost Lindstrom and Jones, the Sox did witness the emergence of Putnam and Petricka as solid set up guys. J. Guerra also looks like he's back, and can be counted upon. Of course, they will have to find a closer, but they do have candidates, including the aforementioned Montas and Cleto.

 

That brings up another issue. The Sox record was much worse than the teams overall effort, due to all of the games which the bullpen blew. How many times did Sale and Quintana give the Sox a great chance to win, only to see the pen implode? Fix the pen, and the won/loss column would look dramatically different.

 

So, in summary:

 

Sign V. Martinez?

Find a good defensive R.F. with the ability to get on base and provide a little speed.

Sign a #3 RH Starter

Sign one good LH reliever

 

That should be within the budget of the front office, and could very well put a contender on the field this coming season. Providing management could accomplish those other goals, I'd vote to try to sign Martinez. For me the question is; Would V Mart consider signing with the Sox, not should they offer him a lucrative contract. So, what would I offer him, if it were my decision (not necessarily my money)? I'd offer him what I speculated it would take to sign him; 4 years and $70 Million.

Good post an I agree though I might add another bullpen arm

[caulfield12]

Yeah, spread it around. $4.25 million for Keppinger, $3 million for Belisario, $2 million for Paulino, $4 million for Downs, how did that work out? You are going to need a lot more than 5 or 10 Andersons to make it through the season. You do not "win bets", let alone win bets everytime loading your roster with players that cannot play even half a season.

 

 

The same way Iguchi, Everett, Contreras, Pods, Vizcaino, Politte, Hermanson, Dye, AJ and El Duque worked for the White Sox...or the veteran additions the Red Sox made heading into the 2013 season.

 

Remember Napoli, Victorino, Uehara, Gomes and David Ross??? None of those guys were "headliners" like Victor Martinez when they were acquired.

 

Same thing with all the players the White Sox brought in (with the exception of F. Garcia)....Everett and El Duque were among the most expensive additions.

 

Or the success the A's had for most of the season with Jessie Chavez and Scott Kazmir, along with their numerous "who the hell is that guy?" platoons?

Edited November 5, 2014 by caulfield12

[harfman77]

I think I agree with caulfield.

 

The problem is this: posters have taken dozens of well-thought-out stabs at what going "all in" would look like this year. Some seem insane, some seem conservative, etc.

 

And to me, ALL of them leave us with what looks like a very mediocre team.

 

To be fair, two teams that look very mediocre just played in the World Series.