LDF Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 QUOTE (IowaSoxFan @ Nov 13, 2014 -> 12:53 AM) Too much money for a bullpen arm. Rather sign three LHRP's for that money and see what you can get to stick. I really think the Sox are just checking in on every quality free agent to gauge interest and price. bingo..... but I think 2 arms for that price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 A 4 year contract to a to-be 30 year old who was predominantly a LOOGY before this year? Count me out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFutureIsNear Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 No idea why people are making posts as if Miller wouldn't be our immediate closer if he was singed. He's got some of the best stuff for 1 inning of any pitcher in the league. If he's around the plate like he was last year he's dominant. Obviously some advanced scouting would need to be done to see if the scouts trust his improved control or not, but $8-10 million for a good closer isn't overpaying at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 QUOTE (TheFutureIsNear @ Nov 12, 2014 -> 06:42 PM) No idea why people are making posts as if Miller wouldn't be our immediate closer if he was singed. He's got some of the best stuff for 1 inning of any pitcher in the league. If he's around the plate like he was last year he's dominant. Obviously some advanced scouting would need to be done to see if the scouts trust his improved control or not, but $8-10 million for a good closer isn't overpaying at all. He's never pitched in that role before. I don't want another Matt Thornton situation on our hands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFutureIsNear Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 QUOTE (chw42 @ Nov 12, 2014 -> 07:43 PM) He's never pitched in that role before. I don't want another Matt Thornton situation on our hands. Great logic. Andrew Miller is left handed and so was Matt Thornton. Matt Thornton wasn't a good closer so therefore Miller won't be. Is that how it works? I can most likely name a failed white sox player for every scenario you could possibly think of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 QUOTE (TheFutureIsNear @ Nov 12, 2014 -> 06:49 PM) Great logic. Andrew Miller is left handed and so was Matt Thornton. Matt Thornton wasn't a good closer so therefore Miller won't be. Is that how it works? I can most likely name a failed white sox player for every scenario you could possibly think of. Matt Thornton was one of the best relievers (left handed or right handed) in baseball before we tried to turn him into a closer in 2011. I'm just saying: just because a guy can pitch in innings 7 or 8 doesn't mean they can do it in the 9th. I'm fine with doing that experiment on our pitchers, but paying a guy closer money to do something he's never done before is risky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFutureIsNear Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 QUOTE (chw42 @ Nov 12, 2014 -> 07:51 PM) Matt Thornton was one of the best relievers (left handed or right handed) in baseball before we tried to turn him into a closer in 2011. I'm just saying: just because a guy can pitch in innings 7 or 8 doesn't mean they can do it in the 9th. I'm fine with doing that experiment on our pitchers, but paying a guy closer money to do something he's never done before is risky. Signing ANY reliever is risky. Its just the nature of the business. Personally, I trust my eyes and my eyes tell me that Miller has some of the best stuff in the league. And is 4/32M really that bad? A good set-up guy like Gregerson would probably cost 3/18 at best for us. If we hope to compete anytime soon the bullpen has to be vastly upgraded one way or another. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 QUOTE (TheFutureIsNear @ Nov 13, 2014 -> 01:42 AM) No idea why people are making posts as if Miller wouldn't be our immediate closer if he was singed. He's got some of the best stuff for 1 inning of any pitcher in the league. If he's around the plate like he was last year he's dominant. Obviously some advanced scouting would need to be done to see if the scouts trust his improved control or not, but $8-10 million for a good closer isn't overpaying at all. here is a question I been meaning to ask. why do we need a closer. the sox have another yr of grooming in Jake Petricka - Zach Putnam. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFutureIsNear Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 QUOTE (LDF @ Nov 12, 2014 -> 08:12 PM) here is a question I been meaning to ask. why do we need a closer. the sox have another yr of grooming in Jake Petricka - Zach Putnam. Putnam isn't a future closer in my eyes..good but not great stuff. Petricka? Ehh, i don't know honestly. Maybe. Having Petricka and Miller at the back of the bullpen would be pretty damn good though. That I do know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 QUOTE (TheFutureIsNear @ Nov 12, 2014 -> 07:05 PM) Signing ANY reliever is risky. Its just the nature of the business. Personally, I trust my eyes and my eyes tell me that Miller has some of the best stuff in the league. And is 4/32M really that bad? A good set-up guy like Gregerson would probably cost 3/18 at best for us. If we hope to compete anytime soon the bullpen has to be vastly upgraded one way or another. You're assuming we can get him for $8 million a year. I think he might get more. That's just what the market dictates right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Or you can easily see Montas getting pushed late in the season (ala Jenks in 2005) if the White Sox are within 5 games of first place around the All-Star break. Who nows, maybe Sanburn or Webb will figure things out in the meantime. There's also Guerra, who would have to be considered a better bet at closer than Putnam, who has 7th-8th inning set-up guy written all over him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 QUOTE (TheFutureIsNear @ Nov 13, 2014 -> 02:26 AM) Putnam isn't a future closer in my eyes..good but not great stuff. Petricka? Ehh, i don't know honestly. Maybe. Having Petricka and Miller at the back of the bullpen would be pretty damn good though. That I do know. for s***e and grins, I looked up the sox 2005 roster. sox had 3 closer on that team. so that is why I am saying a couple of good pickups may do the job. if the sox do not want to go for the closer route. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melissa1334 Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 QUOTE (chw42 @ Nov 12, 2014 -> 07:28 PM) You're assuming we can get him for $8 million a year. I think he might get more. That's just what the market dictates right now. Wasn't Sorias option worth 8mil? If so I can't believe the Tigers picked it up with so many good options available. Maybe they liked that it was a one year gamble or that it was a fluke how awful he was for them, who's knows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Nov 13, 2014 -> 02:29 AM) Or you can easily see Montas getting pushed late in the season (ala Jenks in 2005) if the White Sox are within 5 games of first place around the All-Star break. Who nows, maybe Sanburn or Webb will figure things out in the meantime. There's also Guerra, who would have to be considered a better bet at closer than Putnam, who has 7th-8th inning set-up guy written all over him. I totally forgot about Sanburn. ref Montas, I would really like him to continue his development. if the sox make the playoff, and the roster expand, then hell yes, bring him up for that possibility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 If not Miller, what about a combination of Sergio Romo, Gregerson, K-Rod.I think Frankie might be the better value buy as he's a little older and given some of his clubhouse issues you might be able to pick him up for a 1-2 year deal at 7 or 8 per season. Not bad and not something that totally impacts you. Romo/Gregerson are also pretty attractive with very good WHIP's. If I could get any two of them for a combined 30M over 2 years, I'd think long and hard about it. Romo as the set-up guy and Krod in the closer role. Trickle down effect puts everyone else in our current pen in much better situations. Also have Rafael Soriano out there. It would seem to me that the Sox would benefit from signing one of Krod / Romo / Soriano to stablize the closer role. All should be able to be had without going long-term. Would also be interested in Jansen from Toronto...nice arm..and again a guy you could probably get to bite on a short term deal (maybe even like a 1yr 4 to 5 M deal). All of these guys would be significant upgrades over what we had by and large, imo. Also, all of them possess pretty darn good stuff as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Nov 12, 2014 -> 08:00 PM) If not Miller, what about a combination of Sergio Romo, Gregerson, K-Rod.I think Frankie might be the better value buy as he's a little older and given some of his clubhouse issues you might be able to pick him up for a 1-2 year deal at 7 or 8 per season. Not bad and not something that totally impacts you. Romo/Gregerson are also pretty attractive with very good WHIP's. If I could get any two of them for a combined 30M over 2 years, I'd think long and hard about it. Romo as the set-up guy and Krod in the closer role. Trickle down effect puts everyone else in our current pen in much better situations. Also have Rafael Soriano out there. It would seem to me that the Sox would benefit from signing one of Krod / Romo / Soriano to stablize the closer role. All should be able to be had without going long-term. Would also be interested in Jansen from Toronto...nice arm..and again a guy you could probably get to bite on a short term deal (maybe even like a 1yr 4 to 5 M deal). All of these guys would be significant upgrades over what we had by and large, imo. Also, all of them possess pretty darn good stuff as well. I'm all about getting K-Rod. Gregerson worries me since he has always thrown in pitchers parks. Romo had some arm issues last year, but if the physicals look good, he could be a good signing too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 (edited) Soriano really tailed off last season....same with Janssen, if I remember correctly. That said, there's always a risk with closers. One year, Fernando Rodney's dominant and the next he couldn't close out an American Legion team without walking the bases loaded and throwing a wild pitch or hitting a batter. Brandon Morrow's another name to keep an eye on. Uehara, but he's probably passed his expiration date. Edited November 13, 2014 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Nov 12, 2014 -> 06:15 PM) Soriano really tailed off last season....same with Janssen, if I remember correctly. That said, there's always a risk with closers. One year, Fernando Rodney's dominant and the next he couldn't close out an American Legion team without walking the bases loaded and throwing a wild pitch or hitting a batter. Brandon Morrow's another name to keep an eye on. Uehara, but he's probably passed his expiration date. I look at Soriano and Janssen as being guys you might get on a 1 year deal at a nice value in a set-up role. I think Krod is who I would go harder for. Soriano did tail off but stuff was still supposedly there. He's had a long track record of success and if you are talking 5-6M for him (who knows, might get 7 or 8), that isn't bad short-term. Bottom line, I would not be happy if we didn't kick the tires on some of these guys and think a good strategy might be 2 of the guys as I think they have the stuff to succeed and we aren't talking long term big money. I also don't think we have a closer in-house. I would like two above average relievers brought in, which pushes everyone else in the current pen down, while also allowing guys like Bassit / others to potentially step into new roles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 So to summarize....Soriano/Romo/Janssen depending on price, but better bets than investing a lot into a middle reliever like Gregerson whose numbers were put up halfway due to magical park effects in the NL, etc. (Maybe that's another reason to shy away from Romo as well.) Then you have the big debate about Miller, and whether he can morph into a LHP closer or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 I want a whole new bullpen next season. Miller sounds great. I will say this. Please please Mr. Hahn, before you make any offseason moves (and I hope you make TONS) please get your scouts together (without Buddy Bell) and discuss these guys (like Miller) and how you project them to play next season and seasons to come. Surely these scouts have opinions on CURRENT players as well as draft prospects. I mean I do blame the Sox for acquiring/signing stiffs like Keppinger and that starting pitcher whose name escapes me for last season (the guy who was a KC Royal) and Teahen and all the hacks who have sucked. If Andrew Miller projects to remain good, then sign him. If not, pass. Same with the other free agents. Don't just sign guys without PROJECTING. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 QUOTE (greg775 @ Nov 12, 2014 -> 09:11 PM) I want a whole new bullpen next season. Miller sounds great. I will say this. Please please Mr. Hahn, before you make any offseason moves (and I hope you make TONS) please get your scouts together (without Buddy Bell) and discuss these guys (like Miller) and how you project them to play next season and seasons to come. Surely these scouts have opinions on CURRENT players as well as draft prospects. I mean I do blame the Sox for acquiring/signing stiffs like Keppinger and that starting pitcher whose name escapes me for last season (the guy who was a KC Royal) and Teahen and all the hacks who have sucked. If Andrew Miller projects to remain good, then sign him. If not, pass. Same with the other free agents. Don't just sign guys without PROJECTING. Paulino. By the way, Barry Zito's on the comeback trail. FIVE LEFTIES OR DEATH! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 QUOTE (raBBit @ Nov 12, 2014 -> 10:00 PM) Gregorson built his track record in pitching parks and will be paid a premium. Soriano's FB% will put him out of Hahn's consideration. Romo has arm issues and lost velocity. I'd be interested im Jansen/K-Rod if the price is right. Hoachevar is the guy I want. Hochevar will be around $5 million, maybe two years $8.5-9 million. Or one of those options for 2016 based on appearances, like $5 million, then $7 million in 2016 with 65-70+ appearances, something attainable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 QUOTE (LDF @ Nov 13, 2014 -> 01:12 AM) here is a question I been meaning to ask. why do we need a closer. the sox have another yr of grooming in Jake Petricka - Zach Putnam. In answer to your question ... cause those two guys are not good enough. You can try both of them again next year; hopefully they are the answer but I would doubt it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Nov 13, 2014 -> 05:14 AM) Hochevar will be around $5 million, maybe two years $8.5-9 million. Or one of those options for 2016 based on appearances, like $5 million, then $7 million in 2016 with 65-70+ appearances, something attainable. perfect idea Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehrle>Wood Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 30 plus million on a guy who has never closed and only had 1 great season. Oh jeez. Please no. He's last on my list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.