Dodgers aggressively pursuing Alexei

[Balta1701]

If Zach Duke is fixed by throwing side arm and changing his pitches, why can't Danks do the same?

I suggested earlier this year that he's a reasonable bullpen option even though that'd make him overpaid for the role.

[cabiness42]

I suggested earlier this year that he's a reasonable bullpen option even though that'd make him overpaid for the role.

 

Right, but the money is already spent. If the Sox can field five better starting pitchers, then they should do so regardless of what Danks is making.

[Chicago White Sox]

If Zach Duke is fixed by throwing side arm and changing his pitches, why can't Danks do the same?

While I agree with you that some people may be writing off Danks a bit prematurely, the statement above is just completely ridiculous. Zach Duke has nothing to do with John Danks.

Edited November 19, 2014 by Chicago White Sox

[TheFutureIsNear]

Alexei for Schebler and Ethier's contract?

 

That's a horrible deal for us. No one is taking Ethier unless the Dodgers eat some serious money. That's just a bad use of our most valuable, tradable asset.

 

I think a more realistic trade would be something like Either + about $18M or so in cash, Schebler, and Jose Dominguez (24 year old bull pen arm that can reach 100) for Alexei and Danks....maybe we can get 1 more prospect, not sure, but I can definitely see a deal like that getting done.

[Balta1701]

I think a more realistic trade would be something like Either + about $18M or so in cash, Schebler, and Jose Dominguez (24 year old bull pen arm that can reach 100) for Alexei and Danks....maybe we can get 1 more prospect, not sure, but I can definitely see a deal like that getting done.

Ewwwww. A completely lateral move, no salary savings at all, and Alexei sent out for a bullpen arm.

 

This isn't Jed Hoyer trading with the Cubs right before being hired by them.

[caulfield12]

Because while it might work for a relief pitcher, changing your mechanics or throwing motion can just as easily lead to an injury.

 

There's a difference between "tweaking," like they did with Jose Contreras, and changing Brandon McCarthy or Daniel Hudson into Chad Bradford clones or vice-versa.

 

It seems simple to say "stop throwing four-seam fastballs" (like the Pirates instituted in 2013) but if you go with more sinkers, you have to have a very strong infield defensively, too.

 

Some pitchers have long arm throwing motions and show the ball more, while others short arm the ball and it gets on the batters' hands a notch or two faster than they're expecting, even at 88-90 MPH...especially when they can throw off-speed pitches 50% of the time AND GET AHEAD IN THE COUNT, which Danks also has struggled with, not having the stuff to put away batters when ahead or falling behind and being forced to throw BP fastballs and cutters out over the plate.

 

PLUS, that kind of sidearm or 3/4's throwing motion also works a lot better with slider/curve/slurves/frisbees than someone who typically throws more fastballs/changes/cutters.

Edited November 19, 2014 by caulfield12

[spiderman]

If Zach Duke is fixed by throwing side arm and changing his pitches, why can't Danks do the same?

 

I'm guessing that not every pitcher is as easily fixed as Duke was. Old habits are hard to break.

 

To be honest, if Danks can pitch close to 200 IP again, as a #5 starter, how does he rank compared to others around the AL? Granted, he was signed to be a #2 or #3 starter, but this is what we have.

[Balta1701]

I'm guessing that not every pitcher is as easily fixed as Duke was. Old habits are hard to break.

 

To be honest, if Danks can pitch close to 200 IP again, as a #5 starter, how does he rank compared to others around the AL? Granted, he was signed to be a #2 or #3 starter, but this is what we have.

He'd be about an average #5 starter paid to be a #3 starter if he kept repeating last year's performance.Maybe slightly above average as a #5, but below average as a #4.

[Eminor3rd]

If Zach Duke is fixed by throwing side arm and changing his pitches, why can't Danks do the same?

 

I'd like to see him try, to be honest. But not every guy is willing to accept that they belong in the bullpen after they were treated as high-end starters for so long.

[Dick Allen]

My point is , while Danks is now overpaid, and won't be sought by other teams, he does provide something to the White Sox. He isn't totally useless. I know quality starts are laughable for some here, but he had almost as many as Max Scherzer, and he pitched nearly 200 innings. He has always been, even pre-surgery, a guy who when he was hit around, he was really hit around. There are a few more games of that right now, but if it is conceivable that Zach Duke can turn his career around and be "fixed" at 31, Danks can learn to pitch with stuff that is shorter than what he had.

 

If it were me, I'd dump the contract if I could, but it wouldn't be a top priority, and I wouldn't dump it in lieu of receiving talent.

[Balta1701]

My point is , while Danks is now overpaid, and won't be sought by other teams, he does provide something to the White Sox. He isn't totally useless. I know quality starts are laughable for some here, but he had almost as many as Max Scherzer, and he pitched nearly 200 innings. He has always been, even pre-surgery, a guy who when he was hit around, he was really hit around. There are a few more games of that right now, but if it is conceivable that Zach Duke can turn his career around and be "fixed" at 31, Danks can learn to pitch with stuff that is shorter than what he had.

 

If it were me, I'd dump the contract if I could, but it wouldn't be a top priority, and I wouldn't dump it in lieu of receiving talent.

For once, I actually agree with DA.

[LDF]

I'm guessing that not every pitcher is as easily fixed as Duke was. Old habits are hard to break.

 

To be honest, if Danks can pitch close to 200 IP again, as a #5 starter, how does he rank compared to others around the AL? Granted, he was signed to be a #2 or #3 starter, but this is what we have.

 

first has to come from the coaches who saw that it can be done or that there was a problem

that needed to be fix.

 

second is to convince the pitcher.

 

now for the sox, can coop see that this might help????

 

[Balta1701]

first has to come from the coaches who saw that it can be done or that there was a problem

that needed to be fix.

 

second is to convince the pitcher.

 

now for the sox, can coop see that this might help????

Coop has already talked about making Danks into the next Buehrle, a successful pitcher based on control and movement, this offseason. He must have some ideas for him.

 

Worth thinking about whether a guy coming back from a shoulder injury is a good candidate for an overhaul in arm position, but that's outside my expertise.

[Dick Allen]

This may seem a little silly, but it wouldn't surprise me if the Sox made a major move today or tomorrow, as tomorrow the first installment of season ticketholder money is due.

[shysocks]

My point is , while Danks is now overpaid, and won't be sought by other teams, he does provide something to the White Sox. He isn't totally useless. I know quality starts are laughable for some here, but he had almost as many as Max Scherzer, and he pitched nearly 200 innings. He has always been, even pre-surgery, a guy who when he was hit around, he was really hit around. There are a few more games of that right now, but if it is conceivable that Zach Duke can turn his career around and be "fixed" at 31, Danks can learn to pitch with stuff that is shorter than what he had.

 

If it were me, I'd dump the contract if I could, but it wouldn't be a top priority, and I wouldn't dump it in lieu of receiving talent.

Awesome post, and the bolded aligns completely with my thoughts. If Danks is packaged in any Alexei deal (and I don't think he will be, and I very much doubt there will even be any Alexei deal) it would be a mistake.

[GGajewski18]

This may seem a little silly, but it wouldn't surprise me if the Sox made a major move today or tomorrow, as tomorrow the first installment of season ticketholder money is due.

 

Plus the 40 man roster is due tomorrow to protect from rule 5.

[southsider2k5]

Mets called to did a deal get done no unless RH is blow away no deal will be done.

 

What have the Mets got to do with who the Dodgers think is their future SS?

[southsider2k5]

The Dodgers will just sign SS or trade MATT KEMP FOR ELVIS andrus

 

If the Dodgers thought that Seager was ready to be their SS, they wouldn't be "aggressively pursuing" Alexei.

[Whisox05]

My 2 cents on danks. The difference with duke vs danks is that duke is a failed starter and danks is not. You guys are complaining about paying 10 million AAV for miller but would be fine with danks and 14 plus million in the pen. If danks is on the team is most value to the team is starting pitcher. Again he made 32 starts tied with quintana on the team and had 193 innings second most behind quintana. A 5th starter to make 32 starts, 193 innings and sub 5 era isn't nothing to sneeze at. Yes he's being paid way more then a 5th starter. I want to bring up brandon Mccarthy. His last deal signed was for 2yrs/18 million for 2013-14 seasons. His 2012 numbers was a 3.24 era with only 18 starts made and 111 innings. Those stats got him 9 million AAV. Jason Hammel signed a 1 yr 6 million contract for 2014 season. His stats in 2013 was a 4.97 era, 23 starts and 139 innings. Both are possibly going to be at 10 million or more a year for just about having career years for them in parts of 2014 season.

Edited November 19, 2014 by WhiteSoxLifer

[southsider2k5]

I DON'T wanna trade Alexei and Seager probably be at third base.

 

Was Seager just the reason the Dodgers didn't need Alexei at SS?

[TheFutureIsNear]

Ewwwww. A completely lateral move, no salary savings at all, and Alexei sent out for a bullpen arm.

 

This isn't Jed Hoyer trading with the Cubs right before being hired by them.

 

Lol hate to break the news to you, but you're expectations are really far removed from reality. You should just prepare yourself to be disappointed already.

 

[southsider2k5]

Here's another way to look at it...

 

Noah Snydergaard, ranked #10 over all by MLB.

 

Corey Seager, ranked #13 over all by MLB.

 

Julio Urias, ranked #14 over all by MLB.

 

Jock Pederson, ranked #15 over all by MLB.

 

Carlos Rodon, ranked #19 over all by MLB.

 

Would anyone on this board be willing to trade Carlos Rodon for Alexei Ramirez? I know i sure as f*** would not so what makes people think Alexei should bring back a player ranked even higher? Its a ridiculous notion! Alexei does not have the perceived valued most think he has. Sorry, that's just the way it is.

 

The Sox are by no means desperate to trade Alexei but if he's ever to be traded, now is the time. Going by the rumors the sox dont have to shop Alexei so as long as a team offers value ( not percieved fan value) then take it and move on as long as the return can at least help the 2016 team if not the 2015 team.With as many holes there are to fill I don't buy into the Sox contending in 2015 bs either. 2015 will be a year of making more progress and exposing what holes are left before the 2016 team emerges ready to contend. 2015 would be a great year to get Rodon and Bassitt acclimated to the MLB as well as increasing their IP so that hopefully in 2016 they can give the Sox 180+ IP. If indeed they have a future in the rotation.

 

The White Sox have no reason to have to trade Alexei Ramirez.

 

-They have publicly stated they are now looking to win this year (even if you don't believe it, which I don't think it is realistic).

-Ramirez is under team control for up to two years at a HUGE bargain to what he would pull on the free agent market right now. My guess is he would be in the neighborhood of a 5/75 type deal if he were currently a FA.

-The Sox have no payroll squeeze where they need to move the salary off of the books.

 

If we don't get a big offer, there is literally no good reason to move Alexei.

 

[southsider2k5]

Then there is no reason whatsoever to trade him.

 

[like]

[cabiness42]

The White Sox have no reason to have to trade Alexei Ramirez.

 

-They have publicly stated they are now looking to win this year (even if you don't believe it, which I don't think it is realistic).

-Ramirez is under team control for up to two years at a HUGE bargain to what he would pull on the free agent market right now. My guess is he would be in the neighborhood of a 5/75 type deal if he were currently a FA.

-The Sox have no payroll squeeze where they need to move the salary off of the books.

 

If we don't get a big offer, there is literally no good reason to move Alexei.

 

All of that is true, yet if somebody is desperate enough to massively overpay for Alexei, the Sox need to at least listen.

[Balta1701]

Lol hate to break the news to you, but you're expectations are really far removed from reality. You should just prepare yourself to be disappointed already.

I'm not going to be disappointed when Alexei isn't traded.