Chicago White Sox Posted December 14, 2014 Share Posted December 14, 2014 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 14, 2014 -> 04:39 PM) The level of seething, angry disrespect in this thread for anyone who has a negative reaction to signing this guy is really quite remarkable. We often don't even get this level for political discussions. How come Melky doesn't get a second chance? Why is using PEDs an unforgivable offense? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted December 14, 2014 Share Posted December 14, 2014 QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Dec 14, 2014 -> 05:55 PM) How come Melky doesn't get a second chance? Why is using PEDs an unforgivable offense? He's had plenty of second chances already and will continue to get them, that doesn't mean I can't have a viscerally negative reaction to him being on the team I root for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxfan243312 Posted December 14, 2014 Share Posted December 14, 2014 I'll have trouble, finding a good parking spot this summer!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted December 14, 2014 Share Posted December 14, 2014 QUOTE (mmmmmbeeer @ Dec 14, 2014 -> 11:54 PM) Agreed.... I think Melky is likely clean, now. The past is the past and I'm, personally, going to give him the benefit of the doubt. With me, if a player takes PEDs and goes on to just dominate, like a Bonds, Sosa, or Clemens, I'm more disgusted than I am when a guy like Cabrera, Ozuna, or a Jhonny Peralta gets caught....cheating is cheating but the PEDs didn't have a drastic impact on the game when looking at those lesser-known players, likely due to using PEDs for a different reason (faster recovery times vs. straight performance) I frankly just feel it's different now that a testing system is in place with punishments. Before, when those guys were destroying every record and winking at the camera they were the same as everyone else it sucked. I don't like them still. But after you have a system in place, the field is even. Some guys will use, some will get caught and they will be punished. But IMO he did it, lost half a years pay, fought his way back and whatever. I wish he hadn't roided. But it really is just not something I will hold against a player forever. Some will get caught actively trying to juice, others will probably get screwed by being lazy. But if they pay their time, whatever I'm fine with them being white sox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan49 Posted December 14, 2014 Share Posted December 14, 2014 QUOTE (Markbilliards @ Dec 14, 2014 -> 04:37 PM) Pablo Ozuna. But probably at least half that team used something at some point in their career that wasn't legal. And Rowand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted December 14, 2014 Share Posted December 14, 2014 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 14, 2014 -> 04:56 PM) He's had plenty of second chances already and will continue to get them, that doesn't mean I can't have a viscerally negative reaction to him being on the team I root for. Negative reaction is one thing, you said this signing would make it difficult to cheer for your favorite team. That implies you hate Melky so much that it would literally take all the joy out of rooting for the White Sox. I'm just shocked that PED use is the moral point of no return for you. That you're unable to give a guy a second chance because he was the dumbass who actually got caught using steriods. Oh well, I guess some people would prefer moral policing than cheering for their favorite team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaconOnAStick Posted December 14, 2014 Share Posted December 14, 2014 Look, if you guys want to clutch your pearls over the signing of Melky Cabrera that's fine, but don't do the same dance over the reaction you get from others. Nobody is saying you cannot say you don't like the Cabrera signing, they're just saying the issue you're taking with it is pretty lame and extrapolating your displeasure with the signing into struggling to support the whole team is ridiculous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted December 14, 2014 Share Posted December 14, 2014 QUOTE (Alexeihyeess @ Dec 14, 2014 -> 06:21 PM) Look, if you guys want to clutch your pearls over the signing of Melky Cabrera that's fine, but don't do the same dance over the reaction you get from others. Nobody is saying you cannot say you don't like the Cabrera signing, they're just saying the issue you're taking with it is pretty lame and extrapolating your displeasure with the signing into struggling to support the whole team is ridiculous. Exactly, because your side doesn't agree, it's "pretty lame" and worthy of having scorn heaped upon it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaconOnAStick Posted December 14, 2014 Share Posted December 14, 2014 Exactly, because your side doesn't agree, it's "pretty lame" and worthy of having scorn heaped upon it. Oh stop trying to victimize yourself. I haven't really heard any sound argument imploring me to "viscerally dislike" Melky Cabrera. Does this signing really make you want to see Adam Eaton and Avisail Garcia fail? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalSox Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 I think we can all agree that Melky makes this a better team. Maybe 2-3 games better? Can't think of how many times Tank & De Aza cost this team games last year with their fielding out there in left... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDWhiteSoxFan Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 I have absolutely no issues supporting this team. I want to be competitive, I've actually been following our off season more than I am following the NFL which is actively in session. Did Melky do anything else besides test positive for PEDs and serve his time that I am not aware of? I get why some may not cheer for him but to banish the entire team because of it just seems weird. At the time of his PED charge that is what the game was. Like others have said Flowers who isn't a favorite around these parts and Q tested positive. You still supported the team then, does 3 tip over the scale? The best thing I read was I support the name on the front of the jersey. I have favorite players guys I want to succeed more than others, some aren't even on the team anyone. I don't know you'll get over it, if not that sucks. And people with issues of YOUR opinion will get over that as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 QUOTE (MDWhiteSoxFan @ Dec 14, 2014 -> 07:13 PM) Did Melky do anything else besides test positive for PEDs and serve his time that I am not aware of? The whole "Spending $10k to create a fake supplement website so that he could say he bought them from the supplement website and it was a tainted supplement from that website and he was innocent because website" cover up is pretty rotten on top of it and that didn't get any extra punishment as far as I can tell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 (edited) QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 14, 2014 -> 06:37 PM) The whole "Spending $10k to create a fake supplement website so that he could say he bought them from the supplement website and it was a tainted supplement from that website and he was innocent because website" cover up is pretty rotten on top of it and that didn't get any extra punishment as far as I can tell. He didn't create it. His agent had someone do it. I believe said agent has been decertified. Edited December 15, 2014 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 I actually find Melky easier to root for than Colby Rasmus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 14, 2014 -> 07:41 PM) He didn't create it. His agent had someone do it. I believe said agent has been decertified. But he also willingly went along with the scheme, not only funding it but citing it while lying to investigators. Cabrera claimed (the test) was the result of his innocently ordering a topical cream he’d seen advertised on a website. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 14, 2014 -> 06:57 PM) But he also willingly went along with the scheme, not only funding it but citing it while lying to investigators. Do you really think that was his idea? These guys do what they are told. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 14, 2014 -> 08:00 PM) Do you really think that was his idea? These guys do what they are told. And that's your idea of an excuse? He was told to go along with a coverup and did so while lying to people and everything should be forgotten because he didn't know better than to lie to investigators? You're not helping me become more comfortable with this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 14, 2014 -> 07:04 PM) And that's your idea of an excuse? He was told to go along with a coverup and did so while lying to people and everything should be forgotten because he didn't know better than to lie to investigators? You're not helping me become more comfortable with this. Whatever. He did his time. These are uneducated guys in a foreign country. They tend to listen to their representation during moments their source of income is threatened.. I really don't care if you are comfortable with it or not, but I think you do know you have been fine with people who have done the same thing this guy did, the only difference was they were smart enough not to get caught. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 14, 2014 -> 08:10 PM) Whatever. He did his time. These are uneducated guys in a foreign country. They tend to listen to their representation during moments their source of income is threatened.. I really don't care if you are comfortable with it or not, but I think you do know you have been fine with people who have done the same thing this guy did, the only difference was they were smart enough not to get caught. Technically no, he did his time for the steroid usage, but he didn't do any time for the lying. Ryan Braun lied and got extra time. Cabrera lied and got no extra time. So "he did his time" also seems weak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 (edited) QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 14, 2014 -> 07:11 PM) Technically no, he did his time for the steroid usage, but he didn't do any time for the lying. Ryan Braun lied and got extra time. Cabrera lied and got no extra time. So "he did his time" also seems weak. LOL. Braun lied, got off, ruined an innocent person's reputation, and made MLB look foolish when his name re-appeared on a list. That is worth the extra 15 games. Edited December 15, 2014 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 14, 2014 -> 08:31 PM) LOL. Braun lied, got off, ruined an innocent person's reputation, and made MLB look foolish when his name re-appeared on a list. That is worth the extra 15 games. MLB investigators took a separate trip to the Dominican Republic to investigate based on Melky's lies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 (edited) QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 14, 2014 -> 07:43 PM) MLB investigators took a separate trip to the Dominican Republic to investigate based on Melky's lies. 1st offense=50 games. The extra 15 was for his character attack on an innocent person. They were also threatening him with a 100 game suspension for a secomd positve. Edited December 15, 2014 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 14, 2014 -> 08:54 PM) 1st offense=50 games. The extra 15 was for his character attack on an innocent person. They were also threatening him with a 100 game suspension for a secomd positve. So poor character deserves an additional suspension, yet Melky Cabrera's admitted poor character did not earn a second suspension. Ergo, the statement that he served his time is false by your admission because lying and fabricating, character moves, earned Braun a larger suspension. You've done a dynamite job convincing me that he never fully served his time. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
royoung Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 (edited) The fact that the San Francisco clubhouse and organization would want him back after his suspension tells me a lot. His suspension really hurt them and if anyone has a right to feel betrayed it would be them. EDIT: I am not justifying what he did or taking a moral stand one or the other. Just pointing out that the Giants, who were directly hurt by his action and lies, saw it as a non-issue now so much that they pursued a reunion. Edited December 15, 2014 by southside hitman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDWhiteSoxFan Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 Balta I am wondering how you feel about any of the off season moves? Just want to hear your view on how they did outside of this recent signing. I respect anyone's opinion to be sour on a signing, but I still personally have a hard time having trouble support the entire organization over 1 signing. But my guess since I am new you and others offended are of the Old School decent. Again I respect your opinion on that matter as well, just isn't me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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