2015 Cubs Catch-All thread

[caulfield12]

What I find impressive is that they went all out on acquiring blue chip hitters, yet managed to find a #1 and #3 pitcher basically off the scrap heap. (Yes, I realize they are taking advantage of the NL, but my point still stands)

 

Here's where we bring up Quintana.

 

However, there's no doubt Arrieta's pitching like an ace and Hammel surprisingly effective once again.

 

 

[Panerista]

Is there a difference? Last I checked pretty much all of the players you just listed are prospects, and here you are acting like they are all proven major leaguers.

 

And i love how you are acting like the Sox are "shutout from 1/3 of the market" by deliberately not even trying to look in the Sox minor league system for any sort of Hispanic/Latin American players and then listing off multiple players on the Cubs.

Not all prospects are equal.

 

First of all, their prospects, blue chip players, have actual value. When Theo decides it's time to win, they'll move their lesser prospects to fill in their major league club's holes.

 

We only have second tier prospects in terms of positional talent.

[Balta1701]

What I find impressive is that they went all out on acquiring blue chip hitters, yet managed to find a #1 and #3 pitcher basically off the scrap heap. (Yes, I realize they are taking advantage of the NL, but my point still stands)

When you have a losing roster with a weak system, one of the things you do have is time. You don't have people who are blocked and you have lots of open at bats and starts. If you use that time to pick up talented people who haven't yet succeeded and give them a chance to play, not all of them will be successful, but some of them will be. It's a lesson I've been wishing the White Sox would figure out. You can't do it if you're under pressure to win now, but you can do it if you have a GM who has ownership's confidence and has stability for several years, time enough to ride out the struggles of the guys you bring in.

[Panerista]

When you have a losing roster with a weak system, one of the things you do have is time. You don't have people who are blocked and you have lots of open at bats and starts. If you use that time to pick up talented people who haven't yet succeeded and give them a chance to play, not all of them will be successful, but some of them will be. It's a lesson I've been wishing the White Sox would figure out. You can't do it if you're under pressure to win now, but you can do it if you have a GM who has ownership's confidence and has stability for several years, time enough to ride out the struggles of the guys you bring in.

And we're talking about the Cubs and we're always drawn to compare them to the White Sox. The issue is, of course, that the Cubs are one of the superfanbases in terms of size and following. We simply do not have that. Our more similar comparison would be Houston. Houston had a game where no one officially watched the game on television. They were so bad for a number of years, but now they have real talent. The question is, how good can they be and how good do they have to be to get fans back? If the Astros can survive this level of rebuild, the White Sox can, too.

 

When it all comes down to it, the reality is our owner is a very old man. I can't blame Jerry for wanting to win right now. At this point, any Front Office changes cost the team a year, but every year it feels like the White Sox are wasting away what makes an organization strong to pretend to compete.

[caulfield12]

And we're talking about the Cubs and we're always drawn to compare them to the White Sox. The issue is, of course, that the Cubs are one of the superfanbases in terms of size and following. We simply do not have that. Our more similar comparison would be Houston. Houston had a game where no one officially watched the game on television. They were so bad for a number of years, but now they have real talent. The question is, how good can they be and how good do they have to be to get fans back? If the Astros can survive this level of rebuild, the White Sox can, too.

 

When it all comes down to it, the reality is our owner is a very old man. I can't blame Jerry for wanting to win right now. At this point, any Front Office changes cost the team a year, but every year it feels like the White Sox are wasting away what makes an organization strong to pretend to compete.

 

See: Current situation in Detroit, and why Dombrowski bailed.

 

If the Mets, Royals, Twins, Astros and Cubs can do it....

[Panerista]

See: Current situation in Detroit, and why Dombrowski bailed.

 

If the Mets, Royals, Twins, Astros and Cubs can do it....

Love that three of the five are comparatively small market teams (I understand Houston is a big town, but not like you think).

 

The White Sox need to be this, but they can only accomplish that by 1) Not going for it every year and 2) drafting better.

[Jerksticks]

I'm just thankful that Bryant, Soler, Russel & Castro might all be huge busts.

[caulfield12]

I'm just thankful that Bryant, Soler, Russel & Castro might all be huge busts.

 

Don't forget Baez and Schwarber.

 

Heck, they're already writing off Almora quite a bit.

[Balta1701]

And we're talking about the Cubs and we're always drawn to compare them to the White Sox. The issue is, of course, that the Cubs are one of the superfanbases in terms of size and following. We simply do not have that. Our more similar comparison would be Houston. Houston had a game where no one officially watched the game on television. They were so bad for a number of years, but now they have real talent. The question is, how good can they be and how good do they have to be to get fans back? If the Astros can survive this level of rebuild, the White Sox can, too.

 

When it all comes down to it, the reality is our owner is a very old man. I can't blame Jerry for wanting to win right now. At this point, any Front Office changes cost the team a year, but every year it feels like the White Sox are wasting away what makes an organization strong to pretend to compete.

My biggest problem with this reply is...it's an argument for why the White Sox can't afford to rebuild, why the White Sox can't afford to do things like have 4 losing seasons out of 5 years.

 

The White Sox ARE about to have 4 losing seasons in 5 years.

 

It no longer scares me. We already, 100%, did the thing we were never, ever, ever supposed to do. The thing that people tell us nightmares about. The thing that will destroy our fanbase if we do it. We just did it, and the end result isn't a roster where you look to the future and think we're going to be a nightmare for other teams.

[caulfield12]

My biggest problem with this reply is...it's an argument for why the White Sox can't afford to rebuild, why the White Sox can't afford to do things like have 4 losing seasons out of 5 years.

 

The White Sox ARE about to have 4 losing seasons in 5 years.

 

It no longer scares me. We already, 100%, did the thing we were never, ever, ever supposed to do. The thing that people tell us nightmares about. The thing that will destroy our fanbase if we do it. We just did it, and the end result isn't a roster where you look to the future and think we're going to be a nightmare for other teams.

 

Does nightmare for the fans count?

 

I just read here where all of the Cubs' young players are possibilities to bust....is their being 11 games over .500 at this point solely due to luck, Maddon, Rizzo, Arrieta and Schwarber?

[Quin]

Love that three of the five are comparatively small market teams (I understand Houston is a big town, but not like you think).

 

The White Sox need to be this, but they can only accomplish that by 1) Not going for it every year and 2) drafting better.

 

Houston is the fourth largest city in the US...and the tenth largest media market.

[OmarComing25]

Bryant has been dreadful the last 40ish games, Soler has been only slightly better than Avi, and Russell's offense has been non-existent yet they keep winning because their pitching just continues to dominate. For those who like run differential their's is still pretty mediocre. They're tied for second after us in terms of outplaying their Pythagorean record. But there's no question they have the best pitching of any wildcard contender. If Bryant ever starts hitting again they'll be pretty dangerous.

[Panerista]

Houston is the fourth largest city in the US...and the tenth largest media market.

Texas cities don't love baseball like Illinois does.

 

Chicago Major Sports teams, by Popularity

1) Bears

2) Blackhawks

2a) Bulls

3) Cubs

 

Gap

 

4) White Sox

 

Houston Major Sports teams, by Popularity

1) Texans

2) Longhorns

3) Aggies

4) Cowboys (trust me, this is true)

5) Rockets

6) Astros

 

Texas doesn't value baseball like Chicago does. It's a completely different culture. The Astros are not a true major market team. Houston makes the Astros a mid market team.

Edited August 5, 2015 by AustinIllini

[knightni]

Texas cities don't love baseball like Illinois does.

 

Houston Major Sports teams, by Popularity

1) Texans

2) Longhorns

3) Aggies

4) Cowboys (trust me, this is true)

5) Rockets

6) Astros

 

Texas doesn't value baseball like Chicago does. It's a completely different culture. The Astros are not a true major market team. Houston makes the Astros a mid market team.

 

Where do the Oilers/Titans fit in? Are there still old fans there?

[caulfield12]

Texas cities don't love baseball like Illinois does.

 

Chicago Major Sports teams, by Popularity

1) Bears

2) Blackhawks

2a) Bulls

3) Cubs

 

Gap

 

4) White Sox

 

Houston Major Sports teams, by Popularity

1) Texans

2) Longhorns

3) Aggies

4) Cowboys (trust me, this is true)

5) Rockets

6) Astros

 

Texas doesn't value baseball like Chicago does. It's a completely different culture. The Astros are not a true major market team. Houston makes the Astros a mid market team.

 

Except the Rangers have done very well attendance-wise for the last decade.

 

One of the top 5-7 best run franchises in baseball.

 

And the Astros killed it for a decade there with Bagwell, Biggio, Berkman and finally Beltran.

 

[southsider2k5]

Texas cities don't love baseball like Illinois does.

 

Chicago Major Sports teams, by Popularity

1) Bears

2) Blackhawks

2a) Bulls

3) Cubs

 

Gap

 

4) White Sox

 

Houston Major Sports teams, by Popularity

1) Texans

2) Longhorns

3) Aggies

4) Cowboys (trust me, this is true)

5) Rockets

6) Astros

 

Texas doesn't value baseball like Chicago does. It's a completely different culture. The Astros are not a true major market team. Houston makes the Astros a mid market team.

 

As recently as 2009 the Astros brought in as much revenue as the White Sox did. With the mess that has been their TV deal, that has had a huge hit to their revenues. Clear that up, and they are pretty identical franchises. And that is after averaging right about 100 losses a season over a 5 year period.

[Dunt]

Texas cities don't love baseball like Illinois does.

 

Chicago Major Sports teams, by Popularity

1) Bears

2) Blackhawks

2a) Bulls

3) Cubs

 

Gap

 

4) White Sox

 

Houston Major Sports teams, by Popularity

1) Texans

2) Longhorns

3) Aggies

4) Cowboys (trust me, this is true)

5) Rockets

6) Astros

 

Texas doesn't value baseball like Chicago does. It's a completely different culture. The Astros are not a true major market team. Houston makes the Astros a mid market team.

 

What? Yes it does

[Jerksticks]

Does nightmare for the fans count?

 

I just read here where all of the Cubs' young players are possibilities to bust....is their being 11 games over .500 at this point solely due to luck, Maddon, Rizzo, Arrieta and Schwarber?

 

It's called Wrigley Field and NL Central baseball. Somehow guys like Dempster, Lilly, Arrieta & Hammel become unhittable strikeout pitchers even though they were mediocre at best prior to joining the cubs. You can't name a #3 starter in the NL Central, let alone most of the 2s. It's garbage baseball plain and simple.

[Jordan4life_2007]

Ima pray for all Cubs haters come 2017.

[Panerista]

What? Yes it does

No, it absolutely does not.

[Panerista]

As recently as 2009 the Astros brought in as much revenue as the White Sox did. With the mess that has been their TV deal, that has had a huge hit to their revenues. Clear that up, and they are pretty identical franchises. And that is after averaging right about 100 losses a season over a 5 year period.

As a team dominated by another team's fanbase in their own city, comparing Houston to the White Sox only bolsters my argument.

 

The Astros are THE model for the White Sox. They're similar. The Astros are NOT a typical "Major Market" team.

[RockRaines]

I love watching Schwarber and Rizzo hit.

[fathom]

I love watching Schwarber and Rizzo hit.

 

Seems like they face Locke every month. Cubs have been incredible at coming back since the ASB.

 

The Cubs have missed a ton of "aces" this year. No Cole this series, no MadBum next series and they only faced Cueto once this season.

Edited August 6, 2015 by fathom

[caulfield12]

Speaking of young hitters, Miguel Sano is mighty impressive...and he gets a ton of walks compared to most young Latin American players.

 

 

[GGajewski18]

Bryant is not a third basemen. Hurts his value when he has to go to left eventually. His OPS has dipped under 800 now. Granted he's a rookie, but a lot more expectations than what he has done.