Sox sign Gordon Beckham, designate Viciedo for Assignment

[Balta1701]

If they're close and the attendance takes a nice little hike which it already has, they'll spend more to get a piece or two to put them over the top.

Just treading water (Keeping Shark) = "Already spending a little more than 2015".

[Reddy]

And Tim Anderson as an incredibly raw rookie is ready to replace >3 WAR in 2016 why?

 

It's one way to do it, but its also a move for 2017. Tim Anderson is a guy we should expect to take several years to turn into a really good player if he reaches the bigs by 2016.

 

Alexei is just as likely to put up a 1.5 WAR as he is a 3 WAR. And he's only getting older.

[caulfield12]

The only one I'd count on to be a contributor by 2016 is Rodon, and at the same time I can easily see other holes opening as Alexei, LaRoche age. That leaves me with zero confidence, frankly. After 2016 at least you clear several contracts, but "wait for 2016 when we have 0 money to spend" is the plan, it is a poor one.

 

This team either will win this year or its going to circle 2017 for the next time it has money available.

 

 

Or we can start to be optimistic that some of our prospects like Anderson and Hawkins will make an impact.

 

Especially our young pitching prospects. Their development saves a LOT of money (see Sale/Quintana).

 

 

Let's not forget, Danks eventually will be off the books, too. The worst-case scenario is we're muddling around .500 at the All-Star break and get something nice back for Samardzija.

 

The reality is that nobody should be running away with the AL Central this year, and the Tigers and Royals have both taken a step back to the field, if not two steps.

Edited January 29, 2015 by caulfield12

[Balta1701]

Alexei is just as likely to put up a 1.5 WAR as he is a 3 WAR. And he's only getting older.

This is an argument for why the White Sox won't be competitive either of those years, not an argument for why they'll be in shape to compete in 2016 even if they miss in 2015.

[Reddy]

Or we can start to be optimistic that some of our prospects like Anderson and Hawkins will make an impact.

 

Especially our young pitching prospects. Their development saves a LOT of money (see Sale/Quintana).

 

 

Let's not forget, Danks eventually will be off the books, too. The worst-case scenario is we're muddling around .500 at the All-Star break and get something nice back for Samardzija.

 

The reality is that nobody should be running away with the AL Central this year, and the Tigers and Royals have taken a step back to the field, if not two steps.

 

I don't even expect the Royals to finish higher than 3rd to be honest. They got all sorts of lucky last year.

[Balta1701]

Or we can start to be optimistic that some of our prospects like Anderson and Hawkins will make an impact.

 

Especially our young pitching prospects. Their development saves a LOT of money (see Sale/Quintana).

 

 

Let's not forget, Danks eventually will be off the books, too. The worst-case scenario is we're muddling around .500 at the All-Star break and get something nice back for Samardzija.

 

The reality is that nobody should be running away with the AL Central this year, and the Tigers and Royals have both taken a step back to the field, if not two steps.

That's why I said 2017. If we don't win this year, 2016 looks like a "retooling" year because you get several contracts off the books at the end of the year and you start working extremely raw rookies into the lineup.

[ILMOU]

Rodon was walking 6 guys per 9 innings at AAA to end the season. Striking out 14, yes, but that sounds a lot like Daniel Cabrera.

 

I'm excited about Rodon, I really am, but to expect everyone we draft to be Chris Sale is... you know...

3rd pick in the draft, #1 in the eyes of many. Mature college arm. Yes, I'm expecting a lot.

[caulfield12]

I think they should too. They have money to burn and there's no commitment beyond this season and their current outfield starters are Grady Sizemore, Ben Revere, and Dominic Brown with Ryan Howard at DH. There are plenty of ABs for Viciedo on that team.

 

 

The Rays, too.

 

They have to replace Myers and Joyce in the power department.

[Reddy]

This is an argument for why the White Sox won't be competitive either of those years, not an argument for why they'll be in shape to compete in 2016 even if they miss in 2015.

Honestly, projecting 2016 - based on what Hahn did this year - seems close to impossible. Haha

[Reddy]

3rd pick in the draft, #1 in the eyes of many. Mature college arm. Yes, I'm expecting a lot.

but THIS year??

[Balta1701]

Honestly, projecting 2016 - based on what Hahn did this year - seems close to impossible. Haha

Hahn had money to play with this year. For him to have money to play with next year = a major playoff run this year or getting rid of Alexei or Samardzija or someone else like that, leaving a hole in their place.

[Rowand44]

Hahn had money to play with this year. For him to have money to play with next year = a major playoff run this year or getting rid of Alexei or Samardzija or someone else like that, leaving a hole in their place.

He still had a lot more money to play around with than people were projecting. If the Sox are in the playoff race most of the season but just fall short, they'll add to the payroll.

[caulfield12]

That's why I said 2017. If we don't win this year, 2016 looks like a "retooling" year because you get several contracts off the books at the end of the year and you start working extremely raw rookies into the lineup.

 

 

Well, every good team breaks in 2-3 rookies per year across the roster.

 

We're lucky to succeed with one (outside of pitching) every five years. At some point, the law of statistical averages has to break in our favor.

 

Yes, Anderson's going to have a ton of pressure on him as a starting SS in 2016. It might be that he has to play 2B in 2016 and then move over to SS in 2017. A lot of things can happen between now and then. Nobody's exactly sure what will happen with Johnson or Sanchez, so they're going to have to adjust in real-time.

 

 

As you always say, the 2006 White Sox could/should have won with Brian Anderson in CF for the whole season. There's no reason to believe they couldn't do the same with Tim Anderson playing 2B for one season to get his feet wet.

Edited January 29, 2015 by caulfield12

[southsider2k5]

He still had a lot more money to play around with than people were projecting. If the Sox are in the playoff race most of the season but just fall short, they'll add to the payroll.

 

Hopefully the fans keep doing their part. That is the one way we know the Sox will continue to add.

[Reddy]

Hahn had money to play with this year. For him to have money to play with next year = a major playoff run this year or getting rid of Alexei or Samardzija or someone else like that, leaving a hole in their place.

Believe me, I'm in the camp that Shark is overpriced and overrated, so moving him at the deadline to get a decent prospect or two wouldn't upset me, and if we don't resign him and use the money on someone else, great.

 

But if we DO resign him, with Hahn at the helm, we're not going to resign him at the expense of our competitiveness. That just doesn't seem like Hahn's MO.

 

Question though, you don't think we should dump Alexei for Anderson, but who will fill Shark's shoes? You truly feel like '15 is our only chance at competitiveness? What if we let both of them walk in '16 and go out and spend all that money, while Rodon and one of our other young pitchers move up and take Danks and Noesi's spots? That gives us a lot of flexibility, and a lot of room to build a solid team.

[Dick Allen]

I hope it works and all, but Danks hasn't shown many signs of being pre-surgery John Danks. I was optimistic he would come back to form last year, but lost most of that optimism as the season wore on. I feel like the John Danks we used to know is gone.

From Hahn in the seminars, the White Sox aren't expecting Danks to be what he used to be, but do think he can bring great value as an innings eater.

[ILMOU]

That's why I said 2017. If we don't win this year, 2016 looks like a "retooling" year because you get several contracts off the books at the end of the year and you start working extremely raw rookies into the lineup.

I think you got up on the wrong side of the bed.

 

Plenty of possibilities among the prospects for adding to the 2016 mix, though I agree Anderson is too raw to likely be among them. Still, there are several who may.

[witesoxfan]

The Rays, too.

 

They have to replace Myers and Joyce in the power department.

 

I don't see them as a fit unless it were on a minor league contract (and Viciedo is more valuable than that). They have Loney, Souza, Dejesus, Jennings, Kiermaier, and Guyer who can all take plate appearances.

[Balta1701]

Believe me, I'm in the camp that Shark is overpriced and overrated, so moving him at the deadline to get a decent prospect or two wouldn't upset me, and if we don't resign him and use the money on someone else, great.

 

But if we DO resign him, with Hahn at the helm, we're not going to resign him at the expense of our competitiveness. That just doesn't seem like Hahn's MO.

 

Question though, you don't think we should dump Alexei for Anderson, but who will fill Shark's shoes? You truly feel like '15 is our only chance at competitiveness? What if we let both of them walk in '16 and go out and spend all that money, while Rodon and one of our other young pitchers move up and take Danks and Noesi's spots? That gives us a lot of flexibility, and a lot of room to build a solid team.

Like you said, the best answer for who fills Samardzija's spot in 2016 would be Rodon if you want to be able to sign someone else. He ought to be getting a rotation spot anyway and Danks will remain hard to move. If Noesi falls flat this year that leaves us needing a starting pitcher for 2016, if Noesi steps up like Cooper seems to think, then Rodon is gonna have to fit somewhere.

 

That's the one guy I'm clearing a spot for in 2016 somehow. Alexei - trading him or not picking up his option is still a step towards "retooling" in '16. Rodon in the rotation in 2016 IMO is not.

[Dick Allen]

That's why I said 2017. If we don't win this year, 2016 looks like a "retooling" year because you get several contracts off the books at the end of the year and you start working extremely raw rookies into the lineup.

You could have said the same thing about 2015 a few months ago. Unless something goes horribly wrong and there are a lot of major injuries, the White Sox are done "retooling" for a while.

 

Hahn admitted they are not quite where they want to be yet, but expected to be closer in the near future.

Edited January 29, 2015 by Dick Allen

[Balta1701]

You could have said the same thing about 2015 a few months ago. Unless something goes horribly wrong and there are a lot of major injuries, the White Sox are done "retooling" for a while.

 

Hahn admitted they are not quite where they want to be yet, but expected to be closer in the near future.

In fact I did say that, with the caveat that I didn't expect the White Sox to blow their payroll up to $120 million.

 

Do you expect them to push $140+ million next offseason? Because that's what it takes to keep Samardzija and then add one other quality piece.

[Dick Allen]

The 78 win projection from PECOTA needs to be taken with a grain of salt. The others in the division aren't so great either:

 

Detroit 82 wins

Cleveland 81 wins

KC 72 wins

Minnesota 70 wins

 

They are right there.

[GGajewski18]

The 78 win projection from PECOTA needs to be taken with a grain of salt. The others in the division aren't so great either:

 

Detroit 82 wins

Cleveland 81 wins

KC 72 wins

Minnesota 70 wins

 

They are right there.

 

Brian Kenny on MLB Now just said that he doesn't agree with the White Sox PECOTA projection either. He thinks Sox will be better than that, didn't say how much better though.

[Reddy]

It's easy to disagree with PECOTA Sox projections - the sox beat them almost every year, sometimes by double digits. On average the sox beat the projection by 7 wins per season, putting us at 85, which is great, but just short of the playoffs unless everything hits our way on the luck front.

[southsider2k5]

The 78 win projection from PECOTA needs to be taken with a grain of salt. The others in the division aren't so great either:

 

Detroit 82 wins

Cleveland 81 wins

KC 72 wins

Minnesota 70 wins

 

They are right there.

 

The underlying idea of Detroit being 4 games better than the Sox rings as fair to me.