brett05 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Feb 18, 2015 -> 09:50 AM) Which choices? It's hard to come to a place, say "he makes bad choices," not give examples, and be taken seriously. I addressed this already but I will repeat. I don't have the specifics and I'm ok with folks thinking otherwise. It was pretty darn obvious watching the games last year. But this is a new year and we will see and if you all don't "spaz out too much" I'll be here to comment with more specifics ok? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddy Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 QUOTE (brett05 @ Feb 18, 2015 -> 11:19 AM) I addressed this already but I will repeat. I don't have the specifics and I'm ok with folks thinking otherwise. It was pretty darn obvious watching the games last year. But this is a new year and we will see and if you all don't "spaz out too much" I'll be here to comment with more specifics ok? I have no proof, and statistics show I'm wrong, but dagnabbit I'm gonna stick to my guns anyway! You're gonna have fun being the board's new whipping boy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 I was at the Boston game when he burned through 5-6 relief pitchers in 1 and 1/3rd innings. I remember being really mad, but looking back, if just one of them had actually gotten outs it was fine. He kept pulling pitcher after pitcher who came in with no stuff and were wild. Then one got an out and so he left them in, and they were shelled. I do think he deserves a year with a good bullpen before we indict him. His lineups, I understand his thought process and it's probably his experience as a player leading him there, but I still think he's not using players in their best spots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 QUOTE (brett05 @ Feb 18, 2015 -> 10:19 AM) I addressed this already but I will repeat. I don't have the specifics and I'm ok with folks thinking otherwise. It was pretty darn obvious watching the games last year. But this is a new year and we will see and if you all don't "spaz out too much" I'll be here to comment with more specifics ok? That's fine, and I'm definitely not saying he's perfect or there's no need to improve. I've been baffled quite a bit at times. What I will say is that, from what I've seen of Ventura as a manager, he's perfectly adequate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brett05 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 QUOTE (Reddy @ Feb 18, 2015 -> 10:22 AM) I have no proof, and statistics show I'm wrong, but dagnabbit I'm gonna stick to my guns anyway! You're gonna have fun being the board's new whipping boy. We shall see. Perhaps I'll be the village idiot for the board. Perhaps not. Bu tI haven't seen any stats that show me that I am wrong, can you repost if you have them? The graph that was shown didn't do that and I pointed out the flaw in it though I admit it was nice to see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brett05 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Feb 18, 2015 -> 10:36 AM) That's fine, and I'm definitely not saying he's perfect or there's no need to improve. I've been baffled quite a bit at times. What I will say is that, from what I've seen of Ventura as a manager, he's perfectly adequate. I really hope you are right. I'd be quite happy with adequate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Feb 18, 2015 -> 09:50 AM) Which choices? It's hard to come to a place, say "he makes bad choices," not give examples, and be taken seriously. Because, really, when given the choice between chickens*** and pigs*** to put into a late game situation, those decisions are going to end up looking baffling more often than not. Most of the time it was after a decision was made and something bad happened. It's called hindsight managing, its the newest craze. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brett05 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 QUOTE (RockRaines @ Feb 18, 2015 -> 10:58 AM) Most of the time it was after a decision was made and something bad happened. It's called hindsight managing, its the newest craze. Or one says it prior to the disaster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 QUOTE (brett05 @ Feb 18, 2015 -> 11:46 AM) We shall see. Perhaps I'll be the village idiot for the board. Perhaps not. But I haven't seen any stats that show me that I am wrong, can you repost if you have them? The graph that was shown didn't do that and I pointed out the flaw in it though I admit it was nice to see. Generally, it'll be helpful to cite some evidence along with a claim you make. Like Balta (I think) said before: it's really pointless to try to prove a negative, and all professionals in every field of analysis and projection agree. It's a basic tenet of the scientific method, in fact. Likewise, "it's pretty darn obvious from watching" isn't very persuasive. An example: a few years back, Dave Cameron wrote some article about how Edwin Jackson was underrated and John Danks was overrated. In the comments section, I said something like" The problem with Edwin Jackson is that he's boom or bust. From watching practically all of his starts this year, I feel like I can tell how his night will go in the first inning. If he has his command, he's elite, but if he doesn't he's a total disaster. John Danks appears to be more reliably useful even if he doesn't have his best stuff and even if Jackson will have more awesome starts." Unfortunately for me, Dave Cameron responded by pulling up a query of his game scores for every start that year and showed me that Edwin Jackson was way more consistent that John Danks. The evidence was indisputable -- even if you don't like game score as a proxy for total value, the consistency was still clearly there. I felt like a dumbass. I could have sworn I was right and that I knew it because I took the time to watch every day. So that's how far "it's obvious from watching the game" goes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddy Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 QUOTE (brett05 @ Feb 18, 2015 -> 11:46 AM) We shall see. Perhaps I'll be the village idiot for the board. Perhaps not. Bu tI haven't seen any stats that show me that I am wrong, can you repost if you have them? The graph that was shown didn't do that and I pointed out the flaw in it though I admit it was nice to see. I can't repost the entire article from BP because this board doesn't condone sharing of subscriber-only materials. But the graph is a visual representation OF THOSE STATISTICS. I showed you statistics. You just ignore them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddy Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 QUOTE (brett05 @ Feb 18, 2015 -> 11:59 AM) Or one says it prior to the disaster. if you throw enough s*** at the wall, eventually some will stick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brett05 Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 (edited) QUOTE (Reddy @ Feb 18, 2015 -> 02:58 PM) if you throw enough... at the wall, eventually some will stick. Like I said we shall see. That phrase seems hard to understand on this board but I have some hope. Edited February 19, 2015 by brett05 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 QUOTE (brett05 @ Feb 19, 2015 -> 06:18 AM) Like I said we shall see. That phrase seems hard to understand on this board but I have some hope. It seems hard for you to understand what you claimed to have seen, as the evidence has shown, simply isn't true. Yet you continue to ignore it. I wonder what your thought process would be if the evidence had actually shown you were correct and others took your point of view that the facts didn't matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddy Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 QUOTE (brett05 @ Feb 19, 2015 -> 07:18 AM) Like I said we shall see. That phrase seems hard to understand on this board but I have some hope. Can I at least get a sigh, please? I think I've earned it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 QUOTE (Reddy @ Feb 19, 2015 -> 09:14 AM) Can I at least get a sigh, please? I think I've earned it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddy Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Feb 19, 2015 -> 10:17 AM) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brett05 Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Feb 19, 2015 -> 08:19 AM) It seems hard for you to understand what you claimed to have seen, as the evidence has shown, simply isn't true. Yet you continue to ignore it. I wonder what your thought process would be if the evidence had actually shown you were correct and others took your point of view that the facts didn't matter. I wonder if the whole evidence was presented that could be looked at objectively by the one who has a different view point....nvm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 In a dream I had, the Sox were 62-72 at one point during the upcoming season. I would say that is grounds to terminate Robin Ventura right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Feb 20, 2015 -> 08:47 AM) In a dream I had, the Sox were 62-72 at one point during the upcoming season. I would say that is grounds to terminate Robin Ventura right now. Then they hired Ozzie Guillen, the Sox finished 90-72 and won the whole damn thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Feb 20, 2015 -> 09:02 AM) Then they hired Ozzie Guillen, the Sox finished 90-72 and won the whole damn thing. Ozzie starts Timo in the first sunday game, who goes 4-4 and then starts for the rest of the season. This dream is fantastic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Feb 20, 2015 -> 09:11 AM) Ozzie starts Timo in the first sunday game, who goes 4-4 and then starts for the rest of the season. This dream is fantastic Melky Cabrera doesn't see the field once in September or October. COME ON TIMO! COME ON TIMO! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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