Job Thread

[Texsox]

9 hours ago, greg775 said:

You'd think the union would have employees' backs. Stuff happens n people are 10 minutes late. Can't u stay 10 minutes later than normal to make up for it? I think generation X and the millennials will fix this 8 a.m. to 5 p.m. obsession in business. You can' be just as productive working irregular hours.

Except when customers are expecting a service during specific hours or you are part of a team and the entire team needs to be productive at the same time.

But yes, my daughter has a position that is work from anywhere there is an internet connection. But still there are times when she needs to be in the office at a specific time.

[Middle Buffalo]

13 hours ago, greg775 said:

You'd think the union would have employees' backs. Stuff happens n people are 10 minutes late. Can't u stay 10 minutes later than normal to make up for it? I think generation X and the millennials will fix this 8 a.m. to 5 p.m. obsession in business. You can' be just as productive working irregular hours.

In an ideal world, show up 10 minutes late and work 10 minutes late to cover for it. No problem. 

Unfortunately, unions make it impossible to manage something like this. If management has a relaxed policy for being on time, some people will decide it's ok to show up 15 minutes late, or 20, or 35. What's the breaking point? If management decides to discipline the employee who is 35 minutes late, the employee and union will ask what was done to the people who were 20 minutes late. Why the disparity in treatment?

Fact is, a company has to have and has to enforce an attendance policy. If Jack's boss made it clear that he was supposed to be at work at 8 - not 2 minutes earlier or later, then that's the rule. It's Jack's obligation to be there at 8.

FYI - I was as in a Union for 24 years, so I'm not anti-union, but they can do just as much harm as good for office morale because they often end up protecting the worst employees.

[Bob Sacamano]

On 6/15/2019 at 9:50 PM, greg775 said:

You'd think the union would have employees' backs. Stuff happens n people are 10 minutes late. Can't u stay 10 minutes later than normal to make up for it? I think generation X and the millennials will fix this 8 a.m. to 5 p.m. obsession in business. You can' be just as productive working irregular hours.

Every job I have had so far in my professional career has been laid back like that. Show up at 8, work until 4:30. Feel like sleeping in an extra hour one day, stay until 5:30.

[Heads22]

If you don't worry about you, who will?

[Bob Sacamano]

On 6/14/2019 at 6:59 AM, soxfan2014 said:

So I applied for a property accounting job with this real estate investment company 2 days ago. One of my friends from my prior job works there and told me about all of the great perks and benefits. I received an email yesterday saying that they wanted to do a phone interview this morning. I didn't see it since I was in a meeting. I received another email just as I was responding to that email saying that the controller is out next week so they want me to do the interview today. That seems like that would be a good sign right? I have experience in property accounting from my previous job so they must have saw something that they like on my resume.

I feel kind of bad because my current company (which I started at last July) just finished transitioning this inter-company (the accountants and finance people of the board will know) process over to me over the past couple of months. But truth be told, the company is not great and they undervalue their employees greatly. My department has also lost 3 people over the last 3 months and a lot of departments are being transitioned oversea. Should I just stop worrying about what's best for the company and only consider what's best for me? I've always had this struggle when it comes to my jobs. 

To follow up with this, I have a second round of interviews with the company tomorrow. Very encouraging.

[greg775]

1 hour ago, Heads22 said:

If you don't worry about you, who will?

Definitely got to look out for yourself. Even good companies will go bad if they see they have a worker they can take advantage of.

[Iwritecode]

My first job and my current job are pretty lenient on schedules.  You can basically pick when you want to come in, work 8 hours (plus lunch) and then leave. We have a couple of guys that come in at  5 or 5:30 AM and another one that comes in about 8. 

We stay consistent with our schedules though. Unless something comes up, I'm in at the same time every day. If I have to come a little late or leave a little early, it's not a big deal.

Now my previous job was the exact opposite. We didn't have time clocks but we had to sign in on a sheet of paper. Everyone started at 8AM, everyone took lunch between 12 and 1 and everyone left at 5PM. If you came in 10 minutes late, you better stay 10 minutes after. If you came in 30 minutes late, you either made up the time at lunch or you didn't get paid for those 30 minutes.

I got yelled at once because I was staying late to make up some time and went to the bathroom. I was never so happy to finally get out of that place.

[ptatc]

45 minutes ago, Iwritecode said:

My first job and my current job are pretty lenient on schedules.  You can basically pick when you want to come in, work 8 hours (plus lunch) and then leave. We have a couple of guys that come in at  5 or 5:30 AM and another one that comes in about 8. 

We stay consistent with our schedules though. Unless something comes up, I'm in at the same time every day. If I have to come a little late or leave a little early, it's not a big deal.

Now my previous job was the exact opposite. We didn't have time clocks but we had to sign in on a sheet of paper. Everyone started at 8AM, everyone took lunch between 12 and 1 and everyone left at 5PM. If you came in 10 minutes late, you better stay 10 minutes after. If you came in 30 minutes late, you either made up the time at lunch or you didn't get paid for those 30 minutes.

I got yelled at once because I was staying late to make up some time and went to the bathroom. I was never so happy to finally get out of that place.

It usually depends on if some employee abused it in the past so the administration had to crack down. Sometimes the boss is just a hardass though.

[bigruss]

Jack I have no idea what you're going through from a personal standpoint with autism, but I will say as a manager I would find it infuriating if I had to break down every task for an employee and essentially micromanage their day.  I have like 20 people working for me right now, when I feel that I have to micromanage I know it's going to fall apart because I simply can't afford to do that with my other responsibilities.  Hopefully he/she gave you expectations and job training, but after that I personally would expect the employee to take it from there and hopefully feel empowered with that.

What would help in your situation to avoid that?  

[Iwritecode]

On 6/18/2019 at 4:38 PM, ptatc said:

It usually depends on if some employee abused it in the past so the administration had to crack down. Sometimes the boss is just a hardass though.

I think it was more the latter. They were all business, no fun there. If the boss walked by you had better be looking at the screen and typing. Not looking at your phone, not talking to your co-worker, not anything that wasn't "work-related",

One of my co-workers got told that he couldn't make a bag of popcorn in the lunchroom and bring it too his desk because the smell would be "too distracting". 

 

The bathroom thing was just something that a lot of people did because most of us had at least an hour commute ahead of us. So about 10 minutes before 5, we'd head to the bathroom, then come back and start packing up to leave. Well I was staying late to make up some time and did my usual routine 10 minutes before I was ready to head out. Obviously that was a mistake. Cause you know if you are in the bathroom, you aren't working...

[Bob Sacamano]

On 6/14/2019 at 6:59 AM, soxfan2014 said:

So I applied for a property accounting job with this real estate investment company 2 days ago. One of my friends from my prior job works there and told me about all of the great perks and benefits. I received an email yesterday saying that they wanted to do a phone interview this morning. I didn't see it since I was in a meeting. I received another email just as I was responding to that email saying that the controller is out next week so they want me to do the interview today. That seems like that would be a good sign right? I have experience in property accounting from my previous job so they must have saw something that they like on my resume.

I feel kind of bad because my current company (which I started at last July) just finished transitioning this inter-company (the accountants and finance people of the board will know) process over to me over the past couple of months. But truth be told, the company is not great and they undervalue their employees greatly. My department has also lost 3 people over the last 3 months and a lot of departments are being transitioned oversea. Should I just stop worrying about what's best for the company and only consider what's best for me? I've always had this struggle when it comes to my jobs. 

 

On 6/17/2019 at 4:37 PM, soxfan2014 said:

To follow up with this, I have a second round of interviews with the company tomorrow. Very encouraging.

So I went on the second round of interviews, they all really seemed to like me, and I should hear back early next week as one of the people who interviewed me is on vacation this week. Sounds very promising.

Edit: Just found the person who transitioned the inter-company process to me is going on medical leave sometime in July. Now I feel even worse about possibly leaving but oh well.

Edited June 20, 2019 by soxfan2014

[Texsox]

On 6/19/2019 at 9:47 AM, bigruss said:

Jack I have no idea what you're going through from a personal standpoint with autism, but I will say as a manager I would find it infuriating if I had to break down every task for an employee and essentially micromanage their day.  I have like 20 people working for me right now, when I feel that I have to micromanage I know it's going to fall apart because I simply can't afford to do that with my other responsibilities.  Hopefully he/she gave you expectations and job training, but after that I personally would expect the employee to take it from there and hopefully feel empowered with that.

What would help in your situation to avoid that?  

I agree. Juggling the work load and setting new priorities based on new items coming in I would consider a basic job skill. 

Unfortunately the jobs with the sort of rote routine that would work have been replaced by machines.

[bigruss]

1 hour ago, soxfan2014 said:

 

So I went on the second round of interviews, they all really seemed to like me, and I should hear back early next week as one of the people who interviewed me is on vacation this week. Sounds very promising.

Edit: Just found the person who transitioned the inter-company process to me is going on medical leave sometime in July. Now I feel even worse about possibly leaving but oh well.

Good luck man, hope you get an offer!

And don't worry about it man, if they are worried about coverage they could act on it now.

[Jack Parkman]

On 6/19/2019 at 8:47 AM, bigruss said:

Jack I have no idea what you're going through from a personal standpoint with autism, but I will say as a manager I would find it infuriating if I had to break down every task for an employee and essentially micromanage their day.  I have like 20 people working for me right now, when I feel that I have to micromanage I know it's going to fall apart because I simply can't afford to do that with my other responsibilities.  Hopefully he/she gave you expectations and job training, but after that I personally would expect the employee to take it from there and hopefully feel empowered with that.

What would help in your situation to avoid that?  

This is the huge issue that is keeping me from maintaining employment. I get stuck at certain points during the day. If you don't mind a short conversation a few times a day in order to sort things out, that is ok but my supervisors in past positions were too annoyed with even that. 

I don't need to be micromanaged, as much as I need to make sure that my supervisor and I are on the same page with what is and isn't a priority, and that is where everything breaks down for me. 

The only jobs I've ever had that I held for more than a couple weeks are my first bagging groceries and Jewel and working at a company that specialized in hiring autistic people. I ended up leaving that company because of multiple issues I was going through a car every 3 years because I was driving 100 miles round trip 4-5 days a week to work a 5 hour day. Things have changed since then, but that bridge has been burned and I can't go back. I would have stuck it out to see where it went, but I ended up getting involved in a romantic relationship with a co worker and after it went south, it created problems at work. Needless to say, neither me nor my ex are working there anymore. When we made the decision to date, we both thought we had nothing to lose, but in the end we both ended up losing our job. It was a poor decision. 

 

Edited June 20, 2019 by Jack Parkman

[southsideirish71]

On 6/15/2019 at 1:05 AM, greg775 said:

I'd love to hear some stories about the 8 a.m. start of the day and the 5 p.m. end of the day. Is this still a thing? Where bosses pull this crap Jack mentioned? Like if you get in at 8:06 and it's a major deal? Anybody have horror stories? I can't even imagine as a grown person getting lit up for arriving at 8:03 a.m. My question is: Do any of you have horror stories like Jack about getting chewed out over say 10 minutes here and there? I would think an employee would start working on the resume any time such a butt chewing happened. Seems silly to me. I would guess in Chicagoland where there's tons of traffic it has to be really tricky trying to make it thru traffic and accidents, etc. I'd think you'd always have to plan for an extra hour (ugh) just to make sure you get there in time when there's snow, traffic, accidents on the highway, etc.

We have millennial's at my job who decided on their own to work from home because they wanted to.   Their position is a work at the central office position downtown Chicago, not remote.  The owner of the company comes in, doesnt see them at work and sends out a note hey you have a desk job.  They come in the following week. They show up at 10am, then leave at 2pm.  Then ghost it again after a few months.  Then one of them rage quits because they didnt feel comfortable coming downtown to work.   I work anywhere from 50 to 70 hours a week typically.  I get to work from home at times but I also work in them middle of the night and on weekends and travel a lot.  I am very well compensated and understand that this is the balance between what I make and what I provide the company.   I had one a few years ago shadow me on an install.  The cutover began at 8pm.  At 4pm the guy gets restless and then tells me he is hungry and he has to go home to eat.  Never came back.  Then asked me how the cutover went the next day.   We had one show up to a customer unbathed and wearing shorts and a ripped up shirt.   Sometimes its not just businesses being dicks and requiring structure its also the employees doing their part not to rock the boat and fuck it up for everyone.  I had work at home cancelled at a company before because the person who was working from home ignored calls all day and then called from his cell phone and you can hear announcements from the local Home Depot in the background.  He was building a fence at his house and not working.   

 

 

[greg775]

1 hour ago, southsideirish71 said:

We have millennial's at my job who decided on their own to work from home because they wanted to.   Their position is a work at the central office position downtown Chicago, not remote.  The owner of the company comes in, doesnt see them at work and sends out a note hey you have a desk job.  They come in the following week. They show up at 10am, then leave at 2pm.  Then ghost it again after a few months.  Then one of them rage quits because they didnt feel comfortable coming downtown to work.   I work anywhere from 50 to 70 hours a week typically.  I get to work from home at times but I also work in them middle of the night and on weekends and travel a lot.  I am very well compensated and understand that this is the balance between what I make and what I provide the company.   I had one a few years ago shadow me on an install.  The cutover began at 8pm.  At 4pm the guy gets restless and then tells me he is hungry and he has to go home to eat.  Never came back.  Then asked me how the cutover went the next day.   We had one show up to a customer unbathed and wearing shorts and a ripped up shirt.   Sometimes its not just businesses being dicks and requiring structure its also the employees doing their part not to rock the boat and fuck it up for everyone.  I had work at home cancelled at a company before because the person who was working from home ignored calls all day and then called from his cell phone and you can hear announcements from the local Home Depot in the background.  He was building a fence at his house and not working.   

  

 

Those are certainly some good stories.

[greg775]

5 hours ago, Iwritecode said:

The bathroom thing was just something that a lot of people did because most of us had at least an hour commute ahead of us. So about 10 minutes before 5, we'd head to the bathroom, then come back and start packing up to leave. Well I was staying late to make up some time and did my usual routine 10 minutes before I was ready to head out. Obviously that was a mistake. Cause you know if you are in the bathroom, you aren't working...

Geez. Supervisors like this are the scum of the business world. The 8 to 5 world in an office is really bad. And even an hour for lunch isn't enough if you want to be a human being in downtown Chicago. You have to leave work, find a place to eat without a long wait. No way you can pull that off in an hour. Where does everybody dine?

[Iwritecode]

11 minutes ago, greg775 said:

Geez. Supervisors like this are the scum of the business world. The 8 to 5 world in an office is really bad. And even an hour for lunch isn't enough if you want to be a human being in downtown Chicago. You have to leave work, find a place to eat without a long wait. No way you can pull that off in an hour. Where does everybody dine?

Most of the time everyone brought their lunch and just ate in the lunchroom. There were a couple of restaurants close enough that we could run and get our food and get back within like 20 minutes or so.

On special occasions (usually around Christmas) we would have food catered in from like Buona Beef or something similair.

But like I said, I'm in a much, much better situation now.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

15 minutes ago, Iwritecode said:

Most of the time everyone brought their lunch and just ate in the lunchroom. There were a couple of restaurants close enough that we could run and get our food and get back within like 20 minutes or so.

On special occasions (usually around Christmas) we would have food catered in from like Buona Beef or something similair.

But like I said, I'm in a much, much better situation now.

 

Hoping I can get to this point. My job is becoming unbearable.

[Bob Sacamano]

I really wish offices would be more open to the 4-day work week. My friend lives in Colorado and works for Zillow where they have an office (wish they had one in Chicago) and they have the option to work an extra 2 hours a day and have a 3-day weekend every week.

Edited June 20, 2019 by soxfan2014

[bigruss]

7 hours ago, southsideirish71 said:

We have millennial's at my job who decided on their own to work from home because they wanted to.   Their position is a work at the central office position downtown Chicago, not remote.  The owner of the company comes in, doesnt see them at work and sends out a note hey you have a desk job.  They come in the following week. They show up at 10am, then leave at 2pm.  Then ghost it again after a few months.  Then one of them rage quits because they didnt feel comfortable coming downtown to work.   I work anywhere from 50 to 70 hours a week typically.  I get to work from home at times but I also work in them middle of the night and on weekends and travel a lot.  I am very well compensated and understand that this is the balance between what I make and what I provide the company.   I had one a few years ago shadow me on an install.  The cutover began at 8pm.  At 4pm the guy gets restless and then tells me he is hungry and he has to go home to eat.  Never came back.  Then asked me how the cutover went the next day.   We had one show up to a customer unbathed and wearing shorts and a ripped up shirt.   Sometimes its not just businesses being dicks and requiring structure its also the employees doing their part not to rock the boat and fuck it up for everyone.  I had work at home cancelled at a company before because the person who was working from home ignored calls all day and then called from his cell phone and you can hear announcements from the local Home Depot in the background.  He was building a fence at his house and not working.   

 

 

I don't think that's just a millennial thing, I've seen other generations abuse WFH policies as much if not more than my millennial peers.  I don't know how many times I've seen 40 year olds "work at home" only to really be kid sitting, and they should have taken PTO instead.  I've hired amazing millennials and I've hired bad millennials.  Some would go to the extreme of working crazy to learn so they can make an impact, others I will have a coaching conversation and 5 minutes later it's like it never happened. 

WFH should always be treated as a privilege and not a right, if you abuse it it will be taken away.  I actually ask my employees and contractors to coach each other more on these types of things, have that chat with them first to course correct so it doesn't ever get to a point that it's totally taken away.  

[bigruss]

6 hours ago, greg775 said:

Geez. Supervisors like this are the scum of the business world. The 8 to 5 world in an office is really bad. And even an hour for lunch isn't enough if you want to be a human being in downtown Chicago. You have to leave work, find a place to eat without a long wait. No way you can pull that off in an hour. Where does everybody dine?

If you're salaried: You get paid to get the job done.  Work less hours but still productive?  Not in trouble but don't expect much with your annual increase.  Work less hours and less productive?  Really expect less with annual increase.  Work more and deliver more?  Congratulations, you got a bigger paycheck.

If you're hourly:  Take a 2 hour lunch, I don't care as long as we have coverage during business hours.  But if you bill for that time, you and I are going to have a chat.

[ptatc]

7 hours ago, greg775 said:

Geez. Supervisors like this are the scum of the business world. The 8 to 5 world in an office is really bad. And even an hour for lunch isn't enough if you want to be a human being in downtown Chicago. You have to leave work, find a place to eat without a long wait. No way you can pull that off in an hour. Where does everybody dine?

Depends on the job. My wife who works for a worldwide insurance company does a great deal of work with London and Zurich. Because of the 6 hour time difference she has to stick to a schedule due to meetings with others. The flexible hours are fine if you aren't meeting with others constantly but it's not always the best option.

[greg775]

11 hours ago, Iwritecode said:

Most of the time everyone brought their lunch and just ate in the lunchroom. There were a couple of restaurants close enough that we could run and get our food and get back within like 20 minutes or so.

On special occasions (usually around Christmas) we would have food catered in from like Buona Beef or something similair.

But like I said, I'm in a much, much better situation now.

 

That sucks. People should be able to go out for lunch and they pretty much can't if the boss is a clock watcher. Again ... how can you pull it off in Chicago. Let's say at 11:58 you go to the restroom amid dirty looks from the boss since you are ripping him off two minutes. Then you leave and are on the downtown street. You see a Subway as today you want something quick. There are 10 people in line. You get your food at 12:25. You gulp it down and return to the office at 12:50. Yay! I made it.

Now you want to meet friends at a sit down place. You leave your desk at 11:58 for the bathroom stop. You hit the streets of Chicago at 12. You walk 5 blocks to meet friends at a sitdown place. You have a reservation. The waiter comes by at 12:20. No way in hell u are gonna make it back to work by 1. And if you don't have a reservation, totally forget it.

I don't know how you all do it.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

6 hours ago, greg775 said:

That sucks. People should be able to go out for lunch and they pretty much can't if the boss is a clock watcher. Again ... how can you pull it off in Chicago. Let's say at 11:58 you go to the restroom amid dirty looks from the boss since you are ripping him off two minutes. Then you leave and are on the downtown street. You see a Subway as today you want something quick. There are 10 people in line. You get your food at 12:25. You gulp it down and return to the office at 12:50. Yay! I made it.

Now you want to meet friends at a sit down place. You leave your desk at 11:58 for the bathroom stop. You hit the streets of Chicago at 12. You walk 5 blocks to meet friends at a sitdown place. You have a reservation. The waiter comes by at 12:20. No way in hell u are gonna make it back to work by 1. And if you don't have a reservation, totally forget it.

I don't know how you all do it.

 

If I go out and get food on my break and I'm meeting up with friends, it's usually something quick (like your Subway example) except we sit and talk for a while. Don't really have the time to go to a nicer place and be served unless my boss is out of the office and I know I can get away with it.