MLB.com White Sox Top 30 Prospects

[GGajewski18]

http://m.mlb.com/prospects/2015?list=cws

[caulfield12]

Hawkins AFTER Trey?

 

C'mon, that's ridiculous. And Danish so low? I guess you can argue Adolfo on POTENTIAL, but Micker's MILES away right now.

 

Still a big improvement from last year's list, which was beyond ridiculous from MLB.

Edited March 12, 2015 by caulfield12

[LDF]

this list is a testament to the hard work that the sox FO has done. it looks way better than last yr.

 

my personal confusions on this list.

 

Hawkins and Trey. too bad there is not a tie category b/c i think they should be tied.

Davidson at 11 and Fry at 16 ??? i don't think so, at least for me.

#12 thru 17 is kinda of confusing and i would love to hear them explain why??

 

on the personal side, i like #30 but that is me.

 

i love the respect Adams is getting. how bout freaking time.

 

this farm is taking shape now. the future looks great.

Edited March 13, 2015 by LDF

[Y2Jimmy0]

I actually think that is a really good list. Callis is very familiar with the White Sox system though. I am stunned that Thaddeus Lowry isn't black. Guess I should stop assuming haha

[Dick Allen]

Hawkins AFTER Trey?

 

C'mon, that's ridiculous. And Danish so low? I guess you can argue Adolfo on POTENTIAL, but Micker's MILES away right now.

 

Still a big improvement from last year's list, which was beyond ridiculous from MLB.

How many games have you seen these guys play?

[Y2Jimmy0]

How many games have you seen these guys play?

 

 

Exactly. I don't get too caught up in order of the top 10. The system absolutely is the best it's been in a very long time and that's exciting. The Sox have a ton of pitching and they have more than a few guys that could make meteoric rises into the top 10. Lots of guys with injury history with tons of potential as well.

[NorthSideSox72]

I think that's far too high for Adolfo, Sanburn and Lowry. Probably Onelki Garcia too but he's a total enigma at this point.

 

And Jhoandro Alfaro is a nearly total unknown to me at this point, so, no idea there.

 

[LDF]

some doesn't need to see them, they depend on scouting rpt. during draft time, the org may not look at all players that are expose to the draft, but they depend on scouting rpts.

 

as i been complaining about with some of these ratings, and rankings, is there a standard on how they, the prospects are judge??

 

it is all subjective.

 

if i am wrong in this next statement, i apologize, but like FS, don't they have something like a round table with the writers, which they then discussion and present their point of view on their list??

[Dick Allen]

I think that's far too high for Adolfo, Sanburn and Lowry. Probably Onelki Garcia too but he's a total enigma at this point.

 

And Jhoandro Alfaro is a nearly total unknown to me at this point, so, no idea there.

I was thinking if you could get a top 15 prospect in your system for a couple of months of Adam Dunn, either your system is just horrible or Hahn is a thief, and the system does seem to be improved. Of course we won't really know until they reach Chicago. It would be nice to see the Sox develop an offensive player that actually helps you win games.

[LDF]

I was thinking if you could get a top 15 prospect in your system for a couple of months of Adam Dunn, either your system is just horrible or Hahn is a thief, and the system does seem to be improved. Of course we won't really know until they reach Chicago. It would be nice to see the Sox develop an offensive player that actually helps you win games.

 

i agree, getting bodies in the system, lot of bodies and let them compete against each other, to take the best north.

 

i also agree, and i would like to add, many will not fully develop as hope. there will be a turnover.

 

so in a short time Hahn and the FO has indeed turn this system around, i will hate it when it will hit the proverbial brick wall, which will happen.

[Dunt]

I was thinking if you could get a top 15 prospect in your system for a couple of months of Adam Dunn, either your system is just horrible or Hahn is a thief, and the system does seem to be improved. Of course we won't really know until they reach Chicago. It would be nice to see the Sox develop an offensive player that actually helps you win games.

 

I think atleast one of Anderson, Johnson, and Hawkins becomes a major league contributor.

[Dick Allen]

Most of these guys will obviously never make it. I read where 70% of BPs top 100 don't really have more than the cup of coffee for a career.

[NorthSideSox72]

I was thinking if you could get a top 15 prospect in your system for a couple of months of Adam Dunn, either your system is just horrible or Hahn is a thief, and the system does seem to be improved. Of course we won't really know until they reach Chicago. It would be nice to see the Sox develop an offensive player that actually helps you win games.

Don't get me wrong, I like Sanburn and he's a guy you want in the system. He's got legit stuff. I just think he's below where they have him on this particular list is all. Some of the FS writers on our last rankings discussion had him as low as around 30.

 

[caulfield12]

How many games have you seen these guys play?

 

 

 

Hawkins and Danish quite a few via milbtv.

[Dick Allen]

Hawkins and Danish quite a few via milbtv.

How about Trey Michalczewski ? It's not like Hawkins has established himself as a can't miss. I think you are putting a lot of weight into this spring's results.

[NorthSideSox72]

How about Trey Michalczewski ? It's not like Hawkins has established himself as a can't miss. I think you are putting a lot of weight into this spring's results.

I can't speak for caufield, but I can tell you without a doubt I had Hawkins above Michalczewski before ST, and that hasn't changed. The reasonable ceiling is much higher. Hawkins still has huge tools in raw power and arm strength along with a little speed, whereas Trey has good but not spectacular tools that go across the board.

 

[Dick Allen]

I can't speak for caufield, but I can tell you without a doubt I had Hawkins above Michalczewski before ST, and that hasn't changed. The reasonable ceiling is much higher. Hawkins still has huge tools in raw power and arm strength along with a little speed, whereas Trey has good but not spectacular tools that go across the board.

But ultimately what gets you there is results. Some guys love high ceilings, but a lot of evaluators have big problems with Hawkins' game. I know we all were thrilled after his debut, and he did bounce back a bit last year, still, there is contact issues, and although he is still young, with all these tools, his numbers weren't dominant. I know the old still young for his level, but a lot of the really good players overcome that. I don't think we want him being the typical high A player.Those guys usually don't make it and if they do, don't usually provide a lot of impact. There is nothing out there IMO that makes ranking Hawkins lower, and really it is just a spot, ridiculous.

 

 

Viciedo was a few months younger than Hawkins was in 2014 when he made his debut in AA, and he held his own. Hawkins may have more tools, (I do think he is going to get really big) but can he put it together?

Edited March 13, 2015 by Dick Allen

[sin city sox fan]

How did Will Ferrell not make the list???

[Balta1701]

But ultimately what gets you there is results. Some guys love high ceilings, but a lot of evaluators have big problems with Hawkins' game. I know we all were thrilled after his debut, and he did bounce back a bit last year, still, there is contact issues, and although he is still young, with all these tools, his numbers weren't dominant. I know the old still young for his level, but a lot of the really good players overcome that. I don't think we want him being the typical high A player.Those guys usually don't make it and if they do, don't usually provide a lot of impact. There is nothing out there IMO that makes ranking Hawkins lower, and really it is just a spot, ridiculous.

 

 

Viciedo was a few months younger than Hawkins was in 2014 when he made his debut in AA, and he held his own. Hawkins may have more tools, (I do think he is going to get really big) but can he put it together?

But if all you're focused on is Results, Michalczewski put up a .781 OPS at Kanny last year and a .515 in a cup of coffee at Winston Salem. Those aren't results that scream "future MLB player" on their own either.

 

You might do other things like note that he's still only 19 and has plenty of room to grow and add power, improve performance, etc., but if you're focused on what you just said "waht gets you there is results" and not a player's ceiling, the guy being compared directly to Hawkins put up the same OPS as Hawkins at a lower level.

[Dick Allen]

But if all you're focused on is Results, Michalczewski put up a .781 OPS at Kanny last year and a .515 in a cup of coffee at Winston Salem. Those aren't results that scream "future MLB player" on their own either.

 

You might do other things like note that he's still only 19 and has plenty of room to grow and add power, improve performance, etc., but if you're focused on what you just said "waht gets you there is results" and not a player's ceiling, the guy being compared directly to Hawkins put up the same OPS as Hawkins at a lower level.

I haven't seen either play enough to make up my own mind, but results matter when you get to the major leagues is what I mean. If Trey has an approach that is more sustainable and better suited when the pitching improves, that's reason to put him higher. Frankly, I don't think Hawkins is going to make it because he cannot make enough contact. Either way, I am not bothered if someone is ranked 8th or 9th or vice versa. The end result is all that matters. Rankings are something you can show people in 20 years, and then tell them about the injury that cost you millions. If anyone was so accurate to rank a team's prospects correctly between 1-30, they would be making a lot more money than anyone who has their name on a list.

[Balta1701]

I haven't seen either play enough to make up my own mind, but results matter when you get to the major leagues is what I mean. If Trey has an approach that is more sustainable and better suited when the pitching improves, that's reason to put him higher. Frankly, I don't think Hawkins is going to make it because he cannot make enough contact. Either way, I am not bothered if someone is ranked 8th or 9th or vice versa. The end result is all that matters. Rankings are something you can show people in 20 years, and then tell them about the injury that cost you millions. If anyone was so accurate to rank a team's prospects correctly between 1-30, they would be making a lot more money than anyone who has their name on a list.

Courtney Hawkins as a 19 year old struck out 160 times.

Courtney Hawkins as a 20 year old struck out 143 times.

 

Trey Michalczewski as a 19 year old struck out 161 times.

 

Would you like to revise your support for putting him above Hawkins or not?

[Señor Ding-Dong]

But ultimately what gets you there is results. Some guys love high ceilings, but a lot of evaluators have big problems with Hawkins' game. I know we all were thrilled after his debut, and he did bounce back a bit last year, still, there is contact issues, and although he is still young, with all these tools, his numbers weren't dominant. I know the old still young for his level, but a lot of the really good players overcome that. I don't think we want him being the typical high A player.Those guys usually don't make it and if they do, don't usually provide a lot of impact. There is nothing out there IMO that makes ranking Hawkins lower, and really it is just a spot, ridiculous.

 

 

Viciedo was a few months younger than Hawkins was in 2014 when he made his debut in AA, and he held his own. Hawkins may have more tools, (I do think he is going to get really big) but can he put it together?

Hawkins hit 249/331/450 with 19 HRs and 84 RBI in 122 games at A+ in 2014.

 

Michalczewski hit 273/348/433 with 10 HRs and 70 RBI in 116 games at A in 2014.

 

Those results aren't enough for me to rank Michalczewski over Hawkins when considering Hawkins profound tools.

 

Hawkins' issues were well documented because as a former 1st-round pick he's a high profile prospect and his tools (namely his power) were/are obvious which leads to more attention and focus. FWIW, I think he's done a very good job of making and continuing to make the adjustments needed of him and that shows a strong work ethic and desire to improve. He's still got a lot of work to do, but his progress is good to see.

 

Michalczewski, while a solid prospect in his own right, isn't talked about as much so his deficinecies aren't as well known as Hawkins. I'm sure there's plenty of things he has to work on as he progresses through the system, just like Hawkins.

 

While you're right that "it's only a spot," it's pretty hard to see how a legitmate argument can be made for Michalczewski over Hawkins. It's not as bad as BP ranking Anderson over Rodon, but it's pretty questionable.

 

Hawkins has the tools and ceiling over Michalczewski and Michalczewski's 2014 season at a lower level isn't enough to justify a higher ranking than Hawkins.

[Dick Allen]

Courtney Hawkins as a 19 year old struck out 160 times.

Courtney Hawkins as a 20 year old struck out 143 times.

 

Trey Michalczewski as a 19 year old struck out 161 times.

 

Would you like to revise your support for putting him above Hawkins or not?

Again, I haven't seen enough, but apparently someone who has seen them more than you feels Trey is a better prospect. That doesn't mean either is going to make it.

 

Both players as 23 year olds in AAA

.325/.373/.860

.329/.364/.840

 

The top one had a career .263/.307/.724 major league line with 18 homers.

He also preceded his year as a 23 year old in Nashville splitting levels as a 21 year old with a .397/.488/1.094 line, limited ABs, and .336/.395/.839 he also returned to AA as a 24 year old when he actually played with the bottom guy and hit .327/.385/.870

 

The bottom guy is Magglio Ordonez.

 

As much as people think you don't have to watch players to evaluate them, just look at the boxscore, you really need to watch the player. Obviously, the Sox were not so high on Jeff Abbott.

Edited March 13, 2015 by Dick Allen

[Señor Ding-Dong]

I'd like to hear Nathaniel Stoltz's opinion on the matter, as he's likely seen both Hawkins and Michalczewski a ton.

[NorthSideSox72]

I'd like to hear Nathaniel Stoltz's opinion on the matter, as he's likely seen both Hawkins and Michalczewski a ton.

It's funny, Stoltz and I both wrote analysis pieces looking at Hawkins pretty deeply. We'd both seen him live and both had videos. We traded notes for our pieces, and borrowed each others' video.

 

Stoltz is in some ways higher than others on Hawkins, or at least that is the general impression I got. He disagrees with the idea that was out there last year that Hawkins can't hit a breaking ball. He actually can, quite well, and I agree. The problem with him was more mechanical (of which there were many issues, but he's been working those out), and pitch recognition. If he saw the BB coming, he could adjust and hit it a mile. And that pitch recognition thing, well, we'll have to see some at bats this season to see if his progress continues.