flavum Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 At the very least, a serious conversation has to happen tomorrow...if it hasn't happened already. If they're worse than 23-26 at the end of May, he gone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maggsmaggs Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 QUOTE (GreatScott82 @ May 3, 2015 -> 09:49 AM) Most of us are on the same page with RV. He is NOT an MLB manager. JR loves him as a person so they took a chance on him. The fact that we are 4 years in and he is still this bad says something. JR is too loyal. He will not fire RV in the middle of the season (which is a mistake IMO). Gardy is available, Ron Washington is available. Hell, Ozzie Guillen is available. All three are waaaayy better than Robin!!! And therein lies a major problem, IMO, with this organization. It seems that JR has a lot of input/influence on some of these decisions. While it is certainly his prerogative as the owner to have final say/influence/whatever on those decisions, it hurts the franchise and is contrary to having a GM who oversees the operations of the baseball franchise. Let JR do whatever he wants on the business side, because frankly that is his expertise. But he should have zero input on any baseball decisions, which is why he presumably hired a GM, to run and make the baseball decisions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ May 3, 2015 -> 02:52 PM) It's very simple then. We have the same HOF manager that got us to the playoffs in 1983 and I'll be perfectly content to let the season play out and not feel another year of healthy Sale and Abreu was wasted "doing the right thing" by our manager. If JR wants to run this franchise into the ground out of misguided loyalty, it's his legacy on the line. I personally tend to believe he's a smarter businessperson than that. how will he run this franchise into the ground?? he is making tons of money, when he is doing the same thing. this franchise should have won more ws. but.... oh well i will not go into a rant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 QUOTE (flavum @ May 3, 2015 -> 03:55 PM) At the very least, a serious conversation has to happen tomorrow...if it hasn't happened already. If they're worse than 23-26 at the end of May, he gone. with all due respects, do you really think so?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 QUOTE (LDF @ May 3, 2015 -> 10:08 AM) with all due respects, do you really think so?? Yes. I think Robin needs to be on notice. Whether that's happening, who the hell knows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 QUOTE (flavum @ May 3, 2015 -> 04:09 PM) Yes. I think Robin needs to be on notice. Whether that's happening, who the hell knows. i didn't mean about robin on notice... ahh screw it, i wrote it wrong. but yeah i think RV is on notice, even if management didn't have to say anything. i will put even money that he has too much pride and will not endure this for another season. but that doesn't help the team this yr. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panerista Posted May 4, 2015 Share Posted May 4, 2015 QUOTE (LDF @ May 3, 2015 -> 10:07 AM) how will he run this franchise into the ground?? he is making tons of money, when he is doing the same thing. this franchise should have won more ws. but.... oh well i will not go into a rant. It is absolutely happening right now. What you see on TV is a franchise being run into the ground. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted May 4, 2015 Share Posted May 4, 2015 QUOTE (AustinIllini @ May 4, 2015 -> 01:48 PM) It is absolutely happening right now. What you see on TV is a franchise being run into the ground. its been like that for yrs... what makes this go around different??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panerista Posted May 4, 2015 Share Posted May 4, 2015 QUOTE (LDF @ May 4, 2015 -> 09:15 AM) its been like that for yrs... what makes this go around different??? Nothing. They just keep digging deeper. Each year, the situation gets worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted May 4, 2015 Share Posted May 4, 2015 QUOTE (AustinIllini @ May 4, 2015 -> 03:53 PM) Nothing. They just keep digging deeper. Each year, the situation gets worse. not really. the last big blow up the fans had on the sox was over 12+yrs. i think. they don't dig it deeper, they just show a little camouflage paint job and complain about the fans not coming out to support them and why should they continue this. BS. all the time making money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted May 4, 2015 Share Posted May 4, 2015 i was reading an interesting article on the affirmative action in the mlb and how it is slowing down again. i now wish i copied the link. but the point is, as soon as the reporter started talking about successes in the mlb, KW name is the first. many things can be taken from that article, me, i took it as a fluff piece that showed the sox in a good light, whether it really did anything positive or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panerista Posted May 4, 2015 Share Posted May 4, 2015 QUOTE (LDF @ May 4, 2015 -> 09:59 AM) not really. the last big blow up the fans had on the sox was over 12+yrs. i think. they don't dig it deeper, they just show a little camouflage paint job and complain about the fans not coming out to support them and why should they continue this. BS. all the time making money. You clearly have no idea how bad it can get. Miami, Houston (prior to this revival season) are proof it can ALWAYS get worse. Always. At least Houston had a grander plan, much like the Cubs. This White Sox team is a disaster and it is getting worse EVERY season. Your franchise is either getting better or worse. There is no "Staying the same" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted May 4, 2015 Author Share Posted May 4, 2015 QUOTE (AustinIllini @ May 4, 2015 -> 11:33 AM) You clearly have no idea how bad it can get. Miami, Houston (prior to this revival season) are proof it can ALWAYS get worse. Always. At least Houston had a grander plan, much like the Cubs. This White Sox team is a disaster and it is getting worse EVERY season. Your franchise is either getting better or worse. There is no "Staying the same" Sox fans are screaming for blood after an 8-14 start with the biggest off season they have had in decades. You think they would go for a half a decade of suck? Not a chance. You might as well move this team to Oklahoma or something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted May 4, 2015 Share Posted May 4, 2015 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 4, 2015 -> 12:37 PM) Sox fans are screaming for blood after an 8-14 start with the biggest off season they have had in decades. You think they would go for a half a decade of suck? Not a chance. You might as well move this team to Oklahoma or something. 2011 - the Ozzie Guillen quits year 2013 - the $120 million disaster 2014 - ok, legitmately "seems like we're trying to rebuild" 2015 - shaping up to be a $115 million disaster. They're pretty disturbingly close to that already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted May 4, 2015 Author Share Posted May 4, 2015 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ May 4, 2015 -> 11:40 AM) 2011 - the Ozzie Guillen quits year 2013 - the $120 million disaster 2014 - ok, legitmately "seems like we're trying to rebuild" 2015 - shaping up to be a $115 million disaster. They're pretty disturbingly close to that already. And what has happened to attendance over that time? What do you think would happen if the outward plan was to suck, instead of giving any reason at all to come to the park? The rats have been jumping off of the ship already. This franchise would die if they decided to go Full Cub. Again the bottom line is Cub fans are loyal. Sox fans aren't. This is why Sox teams are rebuilt on the fly. If you want to ask why, that is your answer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted May 4, 2015 Share Posted May 4, 2015 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 4, 2015 -> 12:43 PM) And what has happened to attendance over that time? What do you think would happen if the outward plan was to suck, instead of giving any reason at all to come to the park? The rats have been jumping off of the ship already. This franchise would die if they decided to go Full Cub. Again the bottom line is Cub fans are loyal. Sox fans aren't. This is why Sox teams are rebuilt on the fly. If you want to ask why, that is your answer. The rats have spent 4 years jumping off the ship. There aren't any rats left. 2 years ago I would have agreed with you but we're now in year 3 of the disaster that we were somehow supposed to avoid at all costs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted May 4, 2015 Author Share Posted May 4, 2015 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ May 4, 2015 -> 11:51 AM) The rats have spent 4 years jumping off the ship. There aren't any rats left. 2 years ago I would have agreed with you but we're now in year 3 of the disaster that we were somehow supposed to avoid at all costs. Looking at pre-2005 history, there are plenty more left to jump. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted May 4, 2015 Author Share Posted May 4, 2015 QUOTE (raBBit @ May 4, 2015 -> 12:31 PM) Cubs attendance went down 5 years in a row before going up 10K last year. The Cubs fans aren't loyal, the drinkers and tourists are. I do agree that the Sox approach to rebuilding was made with their fans in consideration. What was the difference in attendance and ratings for the two teams, even last year? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ginger Kid Posted May 4, 2015 Share Posted May 4, 2015 Here's a thought: maybe this team realizes that Robin's job is in jeopardy and pulls their collective heads out of their asses and rallies around him. Just a wishful thought. You never know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted May 4, 2015 Author Share Posted May 4, 2015 QUOTE (The Ginger Kid @ May 4, 2015 -> 12:39 PM) Here's a thought: maybe this team realizes that Robin's job is in jeopardy and pulls their collective heads out of their asses and rallies around him. Just a wishful thought. You never know. if these guys like Robin as much as they say they do, they had better start to figure things out quickly. Eventually fan response at the gate will dictate a change is needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted May 4, 2015 Share Posted May 4, 2015 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 4, 2015 -> 12:40 PM) if these guys like Robin as much as they say they do, they had better start to figure things out quickly. Eventually fan response at the gate will dictate a change is needed. As I said earlier I really don't think liking a manager is a goal or something positive at all. In fact, I'd rather guys respected the manager but hated his guts than a guy they love but maybe don't respect. I think they respect and like Robin but it's obvoius the team has a collective physcosis right now. I posted the Fangraphs stats last night. We have exactly two players above replacement. Something is rotten in that clubhouse it's almost unfathomable that everyone is this bad. I'm not much of a chemistry guy but something isn't right imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted May 4, 2015 Share Posted May 4, 2015 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 4, 2015 -> 12:40 PM) if these guys like Robin as much as they say they do, they had better start to figure things out quickly. Eventually fan response at the gate will dictate a change is needed. In this , the 35th season Jerry Reinsdorf has owned the White Sox, please tell me when attendance determined a manager's fate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted May 4, 2015 Author Share Posted May 4, 2015 QUOTE (chitownsportsfan @ May 4, 2015 -> 12:43 PM) As I said earlier I really don't think liking a manager is a goal or something positive at all. In fact, I'd rather guys respected the manager but hated his guts than a guy they love but maybe don't respect. I think they respect and like Robin but it's obvoius the team has a collective physcosis right now. I posted the Fangraphs stats last night. We have exactly two players above replacement. Something is rotten in that clubhouse it's almost unfathomable that everyone is this bad. I'm not much of a chemistry guy but something isn't right imo. Because teams never quit on managers they hate either. See also Guillen, Ozzie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted May 4, 2015 Author Share Posted May 4, 2015 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 4, 2015 -> 12:45 PM) In this , the 35th season Jerry Reinsdorf has owned the White Sox, please tell me when attendance determined a manager's fate. Attendance is everything to this organization. Eventually it will either be a personnel move, or selling players, if attendance doesn't keep up with their projections. See also 2013. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted May 4, 2015 Share Posted May 4, 2015 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ May 4, 2015 -> 10:40 AM) 2011 - the Ozzie Guillen quits year 2013 - the $120 million disaster 2014 - ok, legitmately "seems like we're trying to rebuild" 2015 - shaping up to be a $115 million disaster. They're pretty disturbingly close to that already. and 2007/2009 were pretty terrible as well. If not for those momentary blips in 2008/10/12, you'd have a decade of suck, and we're certainly nearing a decade without even the playoffs as the only major market team in the division, which is pretty incredible when you think of some of the advantages we SHOULD have been are unable to exploit (part of this offset by the crazy spending of Illitch, but also the fact that they either developed or traded for superstar players and we haven't, other than Sale/Abreu). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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