Attendance 2015

[southsider2k5]

Hey come on man, even in our 63 win season we didn't have any games with what was it, 1000 viewers like Houston had?

 

Houston and LAD aren't listed because of their problems with the networks. At best we were 2nd worst in baseball.

 

http://www.forbes.com/sites/maurybrown/201...ime-television/

 

Picking up the rear end of the ratings are the Chicago White Sox, who even with networks in reruns could only pick up the 9th best program ranking in prime time. When coupled with the Chicago Cubs, CSN Chicago is taking a major hit compared to other RSNs.

 

 

 

[Thad Bosley]

Then Sox fans should expect a similar level of commitment from ownership. That is what I am saying.

I guess I don't see it this way. I don't think this about commitment. I think it's about the ownership having a product to sell, and if we, the fans, i.e., the consumers, aren't buying it, whose fault is it? And what we are not buying is a team that hardly ever wins anything. I don't have to commit to Jerry Reinsdorf that I'll go sit in his stadium X number of times of year in the hopes that he'll somehow figure out a way to put a consistent winner on the field - which I remind you, he has miserably failed to do for the last 35 years. No, the onus is on him and his management team to put together a product that is worthy of greater support than the mediocre one that has typically been put forward.

[ptatc]

That makes sense if you assume that White Sox fans tend to be older and therefore less likely to want to go out and drink under any circumstances.

 

Instead of "that's where the money is," what I should have said was, "that's where the money is spent."

Hey now. Until you are in the middle of raising teenagers, you don't know what "needing a reason to drink" means.

[Dick Allen]

That makes sense if you assume that White Sox fans tend to be older and therefore less likely to want to go out and drink under any circumstances.

 

Instead of "that's where the money is," what I should have said was, "that's where the money is spent."

What is interesting is there is a heck of a lot of turnover with all those businesses around Wrigley Field. I read where most lose money on non game days.

[Y2Jimmy0]

I guess I don't see it this way. I don't think this about commitment. I think it's about the ownership having a product to sell, and if we, the fans, i.e., the consumers, aren't buying it, whose fault is it? And what we are not buying is a team that hardly ever wins anything. I don't have to commit to Jerry Reinsdorf that I'll go sit in his stadium X number of times of year in the hopes that he'll somehow figure out a way to put a consistent winner on the field - which I remind you, he has miserably failed to do for the last 35 years. No, the onus is on him and his management team to put together a product that is worthy of greater support than the mediocre one that has typically been put forward.

 

 

I guess this is true. I'll probably go out 10 more times this season because I like what they did this offseason. I also like that I have an 80% chance of seeing Sale/Shark/Rodon/Q start the game that I attend. They also play well at home, I like the ballpark experience, and the stadium is easy to get to. With that being said, I am in the minority.

[southsider2k5]

I guess I don't see it this way. I don't think this about commitment. I think it's about the ownership having a product to sell, and if we, the fans, i.e., the consumers, aren't buying it, whose fault is it? And what we are not buying is a team that hardly ever wins anything. I don't have to commit to Jerry Reinsdorf that I'll go sit in his stadium X number of times of year in the hopes that he'll somehow figure out a way to put a consistent winner on the field - which I remind you, he has miserably failed to do for the last 35 years. No, the onus is on him and his management team to put together a product that is worthy of greater support than the mediocre one that has typically been put forward.

 

So basically this ownership group needs to go into debt on the hope that they can maybe convince fans to show up after years of winning playoff series. Yeah, good luck with that. If you are waiting for a once in a franchise history kind of run to show up, you might as well find another team to complain about... err, root for.

 

The Tigers have been brought up a bunch in this thread. Go back and look at their history. From 1988 to 2010, they made the playoffs exactly once in a 23 season period. In 2010, the Tigers drew just over 30k a night to Comerica. 2010 was the year before their 4 straight playoff appearances, to see a team that won 81 games. That allowed the Tigers to invest in the minor league system and their major league system in a way that the White Sox, couldn't. For comparisons sake the White Sox were coming off of 3 playoff appearances in 10 years, including the 2005 WS, and drew about 27k a night. Going back to the bottom of Tigers history in 2002 and 2003 when they lost a combined 225 games in two years, they still saw almost 24k a night show up to see a 72 win team in 2004, or about 4k a night more than we had last year.

 

So yes, it is done in other places without winning multiple years in a row. It is another excuse.

[Balta1701]

So basically this ownership group needs to go into debt on the hope that they can maybe convince fans to show up after years of winning playoff series. Yeah, good luck with that. If you are waiting for a once in a franchise history kind of run to show up, you might as well find another team to complain about... err, root for.

 

The Tigers have been brought up a bunch in this thread. Go back and look at their history. From 1988 to 2010, they made the playoffs exactly once in a 23 season period. In 2010, the Tigers drew just over 30k a night to Comerica. 2010 was the year before their 4 straight playoff appearances, to see a team that won 81 games. That allowed the Tigers to invest in the minor league system and their major league system in a way that the White Sox, couldn't. For comparisons sake the White Sox were coming off of 3 playoff appearances in 10 years, including the 2005 WS, and drew about 27k a night. Going back to the bottom of Tigers history in 2002 and 2003 when they lost a combined 225 games in two years, they still saw almost 24k a night show up to see a 72 win team in 2004, or about 4k a night more than we had last year.

 

So yes, it is done in other places without winning multiple years in a row. It is another excuse.

And yet, the Tigers also bottomed out with 17,000 the year before the one you cite.

[Eminor3rd]

Hey now. Until you are in the middle of raising teenagers, you don't know what "needing a reason to drink" means.

 

Haha, fair enough, but I assume those drinks will normally be coming from a bottle in your basement, no?

[Y2Jimmy0]

So basically this ownership group needs to go into debt on the hope that they can maybe convince fans to show up after years of winning playoff series. Yeah, good luck with that. If you are waiting for a once in a franchise history kind of run to show up, you might as well find another team to complain about... err, root for.

 

The Tigers have been brought up a bunch in this thread. Go back and look at their history. From 1988 to 2010, they made the playoffs exactly once in a 23 season period. In 2010, the Tigers drew just over 30k a night to Comerica. 2010 was the year before their 4 straight playoff appearances, to see a team that won 81 games. That allowed the Tigers to invest in the minor league system and their major league system in a way that the White Sox, couldn't. For comparisons sake the White Sox were coming off of 3 playoff appearances in 10 years, including the 2005 WS, and drew about 27k a night. Going back to the bottom of Tigers history in 2002 and 2003 when they lost a combined 225 games in two years, they still saw almost 24k a night show up to see a 72 win team in 2004, or about 4k a night more than we had last year.

 

So yes, it is done in other places without winning multiple years in a row. It is another excuse.

 

 

SS but you left out the other reasons: the ballpark sucks, the upper deck is too high, it's too expensive, the team isn't good, people don't want to drive in from the suburbs, the neighborhood is dangerous, there's no place to go after games, parking is expensive, beer is expensive, food is expensive, it's better on tv, it's not fun, the stadium is empty, the fireworks are too loud, the music isn't good. I've heard all of those and there are definitely more.

[Y2Jimmy0]

I go to 15-20 games a year, therefore, I am better than everyone except DA.

 

 

You need to stop going this year though so that the team finally starts winning.......

[Eminor3rd]

What is interesting is there is a heck of a lot of turnover with all those businesses around Wrigley Field. I read where most lose money on non game days.

 

Makes sense. Again, "ballpark experience." It's a holistic thing, and it's part magic, but that's the difference.

[LDF]

I guess I don't see it this way. I don't think this about commitment. I think it's about the ownership having a product to sell, and if we, the fans, i.e., the consumers, aren't buying it, whose fault is it? And what we are not buying is a team that hardly ever wins anything. I don't have to commit to Jerry Reinsdorf that I'll go sit in his stadium X number of times of year in the hopes that he'll somehow figure out a way to put a consistent winner on the field - which I remind you, he has miserably failed to do for the last 35 years. No, the onus is on him and his management team to put together a product that is worthy of greater support than the mediocre one that has typically been put forward.

 

i have been going and been a loyal sox fan. the problem is, the team, the sox, i do not know if it is by design or what, they are the most charismatic of the 2 teams. how and why, maybe someone who is smarter than I can answer that. but you can not deny they have charisma.

 

second, when Writz died, the hawks went and hired the pr guy from the northside. i saw right there, this guy had his stuff together. then i looked on how the sox really failed in that dept i came to realize, the northsiders hired really top notch pros, not some 2 nd ranked person. i say this for the sox guy, b/c what has he done that was memorable??

 

so how to over come that..... put a winning product on the field. not a half hearted attempt. so they can sell tickets. the one caveat i read about this in about forbes article on valuation, in that another article, even they stated, they use what they can thru public listing of the money. they are not able to get to the really smart book keeping area that the owners use to hide money. i still say, they have money to invest in players.

 

 

[southsider2k5]

And yet, the Tigers also bottomed out with 17,000 the year before the one you cite.

 

So they managed to increase their attendance after a 119 loss season, by 7k a night, with a 72 win team. That is kind of the point. Sox fans are waiting for consecutive playoff teams. Tigers fans showed up for a team that won one less game that we did last year. That is why the Tigers have nicer things than we have, and were able to swing a deal for Miguel Cabrera, and resign him long term, twice. They get resources that our franchise doesn't.

[LDF]

Makes sense. Again, "ballpark experience." It's a holistic thing, and it's part magic, but that's the difference.

 

bars and nightclubs are taking a beating. times have changed.

[southsider2k5]

SS but you left out the other reasons: the ballpark sucks, the upper deck is too high, it's too expensive, the team isn't good, people don't want to drive in from the suburbs, the neighborhood is dangerous, there's no place to go after games, parking is expensive, beer is expensive, food is expensive, it's better on tv, it's not fun, the stadium is empty, the fireworks are too loud, the music isn't good. I've heard all of those and there are definitely more.

 

And if anyone ever wants to make the neighborhood argument, go to a game in Detroit, and get back to me.

[Y2Jimmy0]

i have been going and been a loyal sox fan. the problem is, the team, the sox, i do not know if it is by design or what, they are the most charismatic of the 2 teams. how and why, maybe someone who is smarter than I can answer that. but you can not deny they have charisma.

 

second, when Writz died, the hawks went and hired the pr guy from the northside. i saw right there, this guy had his stuff together. then i looked on how the sox really failed in that dept i came to realize, the northsiders hired really top notch pros, not some 2 nd ranked person. i say this for the sox guy, b/c what has he done that was memorable??

 

so how to over come that..... put a winning product on the field. not a half hearted attempt. so they can sell tickets. the one caveat i read about this in about forbes article on valuation, in that another article, even they stated, they use what they can thru public listing of the money. they are not able to get to the really smart book keeping area that the owners use to hide money. i still say, they have money to invest in players.

 

 

John McDonough is good at his job but being s***ty enough to draft Kane and Toews and then actually drafting them matters far more than anything McDonough has done.

[LDF]

So they managed to increase their attendance after a 119 loss season, by 7k a night, with a 72 win team. That is kind of the point. Sox fans are waiting for consecutive playoff teams. Tigers fans showed up for a team that won one less game that we did last year. That is why the Tigers have nicer things than we have, and were able to swing a deal for Miguel Cabrera, and resign him long term, twice. They get resources that our franchise doesn't.

 

again, who are the tigers competing against for the fan base, in baseball???

[LDF]

John McDonough is good at his job but being s***ty enough to draft Kane and Toews and then actually drafting them matters far more than anything McDonough has done.

 

haha and with those draft, began the yrs of winning and SC chanpionship. a direct hand to hand result with the idea of getting lucky with top notch FO personnel.

[Balta1701]

So they managed to increase their attendance after a 119 loss season, by 7k a night, with a 72 win team. That is kind of the point. Sox fans are waiting for consecutive playoff teams. Tigers fans showed up for a team that won one less game that we did last year. That is why the Tigers have nicer things than we have, and were able to swing a deal for Miguel Cabrera, and resign him long term, twice. They get resources that our franchise doesn't.

Um, the Tigers were also able to swing a deal for Miguel Cabrera because they had done a better job of stockpiling highly-regarded talent through going over slot in the draft and through being really bad several years in a row.

[Dick Allen]

All I know is I go to a ton of games and love it. There are a lot of legitimate excuses for not going to games. It does take time. It does cost money. People have to work. Their kids always have something going on. But anyone who uses it's better to watch on TV, I don't buy that at all. The team sucks, yeah an excuse, I'm not as interested in bad teams, and certainly if its been a long year, those August games are hard to attend, but even then, I have always been able to get a second wind for the September games, even though usually meaningless , it is the last chance to see them for 6 months. If you have the time and have the money, there is a better chance the White Sox beat the best team in the league the game you attend than any other sport. I bet the majority of people who love baseball got hooked when someone took them to a game, not by watching one on TV. And as I stated before, I am not anti-Hawk. I really enjoy him.

[southsider2k5]

Um, the Tigers were also able to swing a deal for Miguel Cabrera because they had done a better job of stockpiling highly-regarded talent through going over slot in the draft and through being really bad several years in a row.

 

Resources that this franchise doesn't have.

[Dick Allen]

Um, the Tigers were also able to swing a deal for Miguel Cabrera because they had done a better job of stockpiling highly-regarded talent through going over slot in the draft and through being really bad several years in a row.

The Sox could have had Cabrera had they accepted Dontrell Willis.

[Balta1701]

Resources that this franchise doesn't have.

 

 

The Sox could have had Cabrera had they accepted Dontrell Willis.

So you both now agree that a major part of the problem is with white sox management? ok.

[flavum]

So how do we fix this?

[Balta1701]

So how do we fix this?

I think the solution is obviously to continue winning 45% of our games and complain louder about having a disloyal fanbase.