8/7 at KC Royals

[fathom]

Game was lost in the 8th. Saladino missed 2 hangers one he didn't swimg at, Abreu didn't swing at one and struck out on a pitch a foot outside.

 

Saladino was a mediocre hitter for most of his minor league career. I truly hope they don't think he's the long-term answer at 3B.

[Jose Abreu]

0-9 risp

[L. Ron Paultard]

Game was lost in the 8th. Saladino missed 2 hangers one he didn't swimg at, Abreu didn't swing at one and struck out on a pitch a foot outside.

 

Saladino is a rookie who is literally overwhelmed right now at the plate. People forget just how much there is to learn first time around, against every new pitcher, in each different game situation, every new ballpark for young hitters. Enormous amounts, the big city lights, tv broadcast, is nothing like ever faced before. So screw-ups are expected.

 

so yeah, T-Salad (see what I did there!) will be fine longer=term as his swing profile, temperament, and versatility are compatible with ML success. Temper expectations for now.

 

OTOH, what's the excuse of Sox veterans like Anorexei, LaRoche, Garcia, Eaton, Cabrera, Flowers who been stealing money for most of the year.

[L. Ron Paultard]

Saladino was a mediocre hitter for most of his minor league career. I truly hope they don't think he's the long-term answer at 3B.

 

Again, Fathom that's not how baseball or indeed most other sports work. Forget everything you know about minor leagues, collegiate stats, spring training numbers, etc. Very little translates to or correlates with, the bigs.

 

(In fact, the bust rate of even high 1st rounders in baseball is downright LEGENDARY.)

 

It's individual case eval. and hard-core scouting, every single time. It's tools - though not in the 5 conventional ways they are usually presented. Hand-eye coordination, spacial processing; early pitch recognition; impeccable innate sense of timing; and hand-quickness are by far the most important ones......while arm strength defensively for instance, is by far the least.

 

No guarantees of course, but merely playing on odds. Watch some of Saladino's plays at 3B, a position he hasn't played much of, mind you...then watch his turning on 96 MPH high heat from Michael Wacha or the 98 MPH one from Archer the other day, another absolute bomb - and you'll know why Saladino will succeed where Beckham and countless others failed.

 

Sure, dominating minors is much more preferable to being horrible in the minors ala Matt Davidson or Jarred Mitchells of this world, but some players simply choose to work on different things (rather than just feasting on BP quality crap in order to pad their ego stat-line.)

 

Others still, are simply late-bloomers. Which could very well be the case with Saladino.

 

Baseball history is littered with guys who hit 40-50 HR with like a FAPjillion of RBI on the farm .... who ended up an absolute embarrassment in the show. You'd be surprised.

 

 

..

Edited August 8, 2015 by L. Ron Paultard

[harkness99]

Game was lost in the 8th. Saladino missed 2 hangers one he didn't swimg at, Abreu didn't swing at one and struck out on a pitch a foot outside.

 

I swear this team leads the universe in not swinging at hanging breaking balls.

[greg775]

duh

You say 'duh' but our great front office couldn't project we had a horses*** team a week before the deadline? I mean, yes, I fell for it during the 7-1 road trip. But they are highly paid professional baseball people. They couldn't tell it was smoke and mirrors and time to trade everybody??? At least Shark and Lexi and LaRoche and Melky and Avi?"

 

Well, Jones looked fantastic. If he's healthy, an 8th-9th inning of him and Robertson is nasty.

Yes, but the question is when will it show up in the standings? Next year? Five years from now? We never contend anymore despite some talent.

 

KC fans I've seen on twitter this year hate that their 3rd best reliever is their closer.

Yes but to be fair, their fans are the worst I've ever seen. They are miserable morons. Seriously you have to see them to believe them. Actually Holland is still worthy of being closer. He's only blown 3 saves. Put anybody in the closer role and it's different. Davis might do OK. They need to ride Holland until his time is over.

 

Game was lost in the 8th. Saladino missed 2 hangers one he didn't swimg at, Abreu didn't swing at one and struck out on a pitch a foot outside.

Exactly. Thing is, you just knew they weren't going to score. Hochevar did exactly what he needed to do. Whiff an overmatched rookie? Done. Make sure Abreu went fishing on strike three? Done. Then use your scouting report and retire Melky on a drive toward the right field line perfectly positioned. Easy out and completle failure.

 

Saladino was a mediocre hitter for most of his minor league career. I truly hope they don't think he's the long-term answer at 3B.

Great great post, fathom! He's not more than a utility guy.

[Lip Man 1]

Offense has scored three runs or less in four of their last eight games.

 

Tonight marked the 15th time the Sox held an opponent to three runs or less...and lost.

 

Mark

[greg775]

Offense has scored three runs or less in four of their last eight games.

 

Tonight marked the 15th time the Sox held an opponent to three runs or less...and lost.

 

Mark

Team is in the tank ... again. I think they've lose 7 of last 8 in Kauffman and two more are a comin. I'm sure that thread about draft picks will be active again as the Sox record creeps the other way again.

[Lip Man 1]

Last four hitters in the starting line up tonight all hitting under .250. Basically that's almost half of your starting lineup in "automatic out" status.

 

Simply can't win that way very often anyway.

 

As Kenny would say, "it is what it is..." LOL.

 

Mark

 

 

[greg775]

Last four hitters in the starting line up tonight all hitting under .250. Basically that's almost half of your starting lineup in "automatic out" status.

 

Simply can't win that way very often anyway.

 

As Kenny would say, "it is what it is..." LOL.

 

Mark

As much as I love Flowers he's in another of his funks and when I saw that lineup and compared it to KC's I laughed, actually laughed. Like you said, the last four ... wow.

Edited August 8, 2015 by greg775

[Lip Man 1]

One more for the road.

 

Sox have played 107 games. They have scored three runs or less now in 57 of them. That's 53% of their games this year...that's not good.

 

Mark

[The Ginger Kid]

One more for the road.

 

Sox have played 107 games. They have scored three runs or less now in 57 of them. That's 53% of their games this year...that's not good.

 

Mark

But we had an offensive outburst for like 2 weeks! Not fair!

[WilliamTell]

O for 9 with RISP? So sad.

[LDF]

Saladino was a mediocre hitter for most of his minor league career. I truly hope they don't think he's the long-term answer at 3B.

 

worst yet, batting him #2 in the batting order.

Edited August 8, 2015 by LDF

[LDF]

Offense has scored three runs or less in four of their last eight games.

 

Tonight marked the 15th time the Sox held an opponent to three runs or less...and lost.

 

Mark

 

and i would be brutally frank here. danks did not pitch a bad game. the other team scored 3 runs on him. this tepid offense is killing me.

[greg775]

I'm not convinced her doesn't root for the Royals.

Yeah I root for the Royals. That's why I turned down free tickets for great seats Saturday and Sunday. I just don't need to see the Sox lose in front of full houses both nights. Normally it's enough to get to see the Sox play. Not this year. I KNOW they're losing all 3 and I don't wanna be there in the 100 degree heat Sunday or with the KC partiers on Saturday.

[SCCWS]

Saladino is a rookie who is literally overwhelmed right now at the plate. People forget just how much there is to learn first time around, against every new pitcher, in each different game situation, every new ballpark for young hitters. Enormous amounts, the big city lights, tv broadcast, is nothing like ever faced before. So screw-ups are expected.

 

so yeah, T-Salad (see what I did there!) will be fine longer=term as his swing profile, temperament, and versatility are compatible with ML success. Temper expectations for now.

 

OTOH, what's the excuse of Sox veterans like Anorexei, LaRoche, Garcia, Eaton, Cabrera, Flowers who been stealing money for most of the year.

 

I agree he is struggling but I am not sure your reasoning is correct. He was not overwhelmed when he arrived because he immediately hit close to .300 for his first 8-10 games. Then he started struggling and now he is really overwhelmed. That may be a sign he has a major weakness and word gets out quickly. He was a .280 hitter for 3 years in AAA w very little power. it looks like Sanchez has the same game w a better glove. I think one will be the reserve inielder next year and the other will disappear.

[LDF]

I agree he is struggling but I am not sure your reasoning is correct. He was not overwhelmed when he arrived because he immediately hit close to .300 for his first 8-10 games. Then he started struggling and now he is really overwhelmed. That may be a sign he has a major weakness and word gets out quickly. He was a .280 hitter for 3 years in AAA w very little power. it looks like Sanchez has the same game w a better glove. I think one will be the reserve inielder next year and the other will disappear.

 

i don't know, i think it is grooming, getting his rep's in, exposure to the major's. in other words, letting him get his lumps in this season.

 

reason, to see what the org has in him and / or maybe replacing or taking a important position next season.

[L. Ron Paultard]

I agree he is struggling but I am not sure your reasoning is correct. He was not overwhelmed when he arrived because he immediately hit close to .300 for his first 8-10 games. Then he started struggling and now he is really overwhelmed. That may be a sign he has a major weakness and word gets out quickly. He was a .280 hitter for 3 years in AAA w very little power. it looks like Sanchez has the same game w a better glove. I think one will be the reserve inielder next year and the other will disappear.

 

With all due respect, I don't think you or most people quite realize just how effin' HUGE it is a jump to the bigs in any sport, nevermind for a hitter in baseball who is always going to be vulnerable to the pitcher's whims due to the unique nature of the sport.

 

hell Just learning how to be a professional under intense unforgiving media spotlights; how to pace yourself over a veritable marathon of a baseball season; how to travel, how to act off the field is something in and of itself. Then the league adjusts; as advance-scouting these days is ridiculously, well, advanced. So on.

 

Yes, some guys hit it right out of the gate just based on sheer (unsustainable) effort and adrenaline rush. There is also small sample size-related statistical flukes to consider here. But for most, it's deer in the headlights time.

 

I dont see a ton of baseball normally, but yes Saladino actually looked like a pro already in everything he did right off the get g - so it's easy to get fooled by it.

 

Which was my point: T-Salad will inevitably struggle in situations like last night's in a pennant pressure. Sorry

 

 

edit: again, for the last time, Saladino's numbers in AAA are almost as useless as Spring Training ones. Besides, HR are the least of my concerns when it comes to the 2-hole hitter. Not that he doesn't have any natural pop in his swing, mind you - just ask Michael Wacha or Chris Archer, lulz

 

As for Carlos Sanchez, weirdly enough he may also stick around in the majors. Certainly much more likely than Matt Davidson, Tyler Flowers, Joe Borchard or Josh Fields types who usually make big-league pitchers absolutely salivate even before stepping into the batter's box

 

 

.

Edited August 8, 2015 by L. Ron Paultard

[L. Ron Paultard]

PS. Barring some injury-related setbacks ala Avi Garcia last year..... 1000 PA or so is usually when you can start writing a prospect off if there is either no improvement at all, or a significant regression.

 

 

[SCCWS]

With all due respect, I don't think you or most people quite realize just how effin' HUGE it is a jump to the bigs in any sport, nevermind for a hitter in baseball who is always going to be vulnerable to the pitcher's whims due to the unique nature of the sport.

 

hell Just learning how to be a professional under intense unforgiving media spotlights; how to pace yourself over a veritable marathon of a baseball season; how to travel, how to act off the field is something in and of itself. Then the league adjusts; as advance-scouting these days is ridiculously, well, advanced. So on.

 

Yes, some guys hit it right out of the gate just based on sheer (unsustainable) effort and adrenaline rush. There is also small sample size-related statistical flukes to consider here. But for most, it's deer in the headlights time.

 

I dont see a ton of baseball normally, but yes Saladino actually looked like a pro already in everything he did right off the get g - so it's easy to get fooled by it.

 

Which was my point: T-Salad will inevitably struggle in situations like last night's in a pennant pressure. Sorry

 

 

edit: again, for the last time, Saladino's numbers in AAA are almost as useless as Spring Training ones. Besides, HR are the least of my concerns when it comes to the 2-hole hitter. Not that he doesn't have any natural pop in his swing, mind you - just ask Michael Wacha or Chris Archer, lulz

 

As for Carlos Sanchez, weirdly enough he may also stick around in the majors. Certainly much more likely than Matt Davidson, Tyler Flowers, Joe Borchard or Josh Fields types who usually make big-league pitchers absolutely salivate even before stepping into the batter's box

 

 

They may mean nothing to you but they do to the FO. How often do you see a player struggling at AAA getting called up???? Good teams will be patient w young players and stick with them longer. But teams like the White Sox w multiple holes will unfortunately have less patience. Why did Saladino playing SS in AAA get called up to play 3rd over Davidson who was playing 3rd??? Because Davidson is not yet even average offensively in AAA. Saladino will get this year and next ST to make this team at 2nd or even SS. His bat will not be good enough to play 3rd unless they get stuck like they are now.

[L. Ron Paultard]

They may mean nothing to you but they do to the FO. How often do you see a player struggling at AAA getting called up???? Good teams will be patient w young players and stick with them longer. But teams like the White Sox w multiple holes will unfortunately have less patience. Why did Saladino playing SS in AAA get called up to play 3rd over Davidson who was playing 3rd??? Because Davidson is not yet even average offensively in AAA. Saladino will get this year and next ST to make this team at 2nd or even SS. His bat will not be good enough to play 3rd unless they get stuck like they are now.

 

 

Look you can ignore history and reality all you want; it won't change the fact that raw numbers - whether they be HS, NCAA, Spring Training or even high minors..... are notoriously unreliable-bordering-on-worthless when it comes to actual prediction-projections. Certainly the conventional non-Sabermetric ones such as Batting-average, HR, FP which is what most fans parrot.

 

Admittedly baseball does lend itself to rough quantification more than other sports, but that only tends to delude fans into having unrealistic expectations.

 

Extremes and exceptions only reinforce the general rule. Sure it's nice if an 18 year old is crushing AA. Conversely, if a 28 year old is struggling in low-A ball that's probably not a "good thing". Duh. But in most cases, just going by numbers simply doesn't cut it.

 

You ask, why did they promote the seemingly unspectacular Saladino over Davidson despite the fact that Rich Hahn has invested a lot of his talent eval credibility into the latter prospect? I think I've sorta answered that already.

 

But in case that wasn't clear: because Davidson's slow, loopy, uncoordinated swing would get R-A-P-E-D by major league pitching.

 

 

 

 

btw, pitchers aren't exactly immune to that, either. Dime a dozen Dylan Axelrod or Ehren Wasserman can at times do well in the minors, but in the majors they are a laughing stock.

 

[L. Ron Paultard]

To be fair, it also probably helped that Saladino was a highlight reel machine over at 3B thus far and can run bases well suggesting good instincts

 

plus, can play multiple def positions - while Davidson.. can't.

[Knackattack]

Saladino will be a decent utility guy but I don't think he is starting material, and I don't think the Sox FO does either.

[Balta1701]

Saladino will be a decent utility guy but I don't think he is starting material, and I don't think the Sox FO does either.

His bat's probably not a starting caliber bat even if he's an above average defender at 3b, but if he's an above average defender at SS his bat could make him an extremely valuable SS.