2015-2016 NBA Thread

[Chisoxfn]

Gasol is one of the guys that stands out to me as being done with this season. There was a sequence last night where he shot a three from the top of the key, missed it short, and even though he didn't chase for the offensive rebound, he was still the last guy down the floor. When he finally got down the floor, the ball came to his guy, who took a 20 foot jumper from the wing, and Gasol didn't even bother to get his hands up on. I am done with the guy. Sure he can put up numbers, but he isn't helping this team at all right now.

Well, I'd argue if he was done for the season, given his knee, he wouldn't be playing. I think Pau is just one of those guys that is so incredibly skilled (and he truly is an all time great big) that he can get away with not putting in the longer practice habits and taking more of the "Spurs" approach. Unfortunately, the rest of the team wasn't in that position and when you don't have other strong leaders, people look up to Pau who came in and started questioning how things were done. Pau is a real pro, so I'm not here saying negatives, but he also was late in his career and he just goes about things different and I think others followed suit from it.

 

Bigger issue seems to be Jimmy Buckets. Of course that might just be what the Bulls front office wants us to believe as they are starting there campaign to get the fan base behind moving him. Me, I love Jimmy for what he does on the court and I think he needs people who hold him accountable and I think that was lost the day the Bulls stripped Thibs and than eventually put in Hoiberg. Hoiberg wasn't willing to be the sheriff and backed down early and lost the respect of countless people. I also can buy into Jimmy's head expanding, but I also argue he plays hard, etc.

 

He does need a wake up call though and I think he's a guy who absolutely can win a championship but he's got to buy-in, part of that is on the player, but part of that is also on the coach. It isn't like this was a team of misfits or cancers that Hoiberg was handed. It was a team with guys who all have relatively good reputations within the league and he failed miserably at getting them to buy-in and the front office failed miserably in identifying that (and if it was the players fault) making changes to the roster to ensure / put the coach in a position where he could succeed.

[southsider2k5]

To listen to it here, apparently the Bulls locker room was Iraq, and it was Thibs holding the Kurds, Shia, and Sunni's together

[Chisoxfn]

To listen to it here, apparently the Bulls locker room was Iraq, and it was Thibs holding the Kurds, Shia, and Sunni's together

Well I think Gar created that culture when he decided to tell the players last year that they didn't need to follow Thibs and it only got worse this year. It absolutely was bad. But it was there roster and they need to be held accountable for it (as do the players). But when you had a roster of guys who for years were known as great team players, etc, well, than it is hard to ignore some of the changes that happened.

 

I've said numerous times I am an avid Thibs supporter though.

[Chisoxfn]

I do want to thank Taj for giving a f***. He'll probably get dealt, but he's represented the Bulls with great pride during his entire tenure (as has Noah).

[Chisoxfn]

Some pretty damning quotes below from MDJ, who I respect a ton. I have said all season I felt that Hoiberg did not real the team in when needed and that this team lacked the focus and intensity that is necessary from a coach. Little things matter and I never felt that Hoiberg was able to drive in his message. He's admitted as much this past weekend when he said his message isn't being heard. He also talks about how focused they are in warmups, but we are seeing basic execution failures. Just embarassing. I have never seen a coach as bad as Hoiberg at the NBA level. I literally have zero confidence in his ability to be a head coach in the NBA.

 

Hoiberg: "Obviously, what I'm saying right now, my message isn't getting across," the Chicago Bulls coach said in his brief remarks Saturday. "We're going to sit in a room and hopefully get it figured out [sunday]."

 

Mike Dunleavy's Take:

 

"It's a lot," Dunleavy said of the issues ailing the Bulls. "It's not just one little thing here or there. It's not on the defensive end or the offensive [end], it's both. It's just a lot of stuff. To say it's like one thing we're not doing right and that would solve everything, that's just not the case. It's a bunch of stuff we're struggling with. Not only with effort, but execution and discipline and continuity. You can go through the whole thing. So from that standpoint I can't sit here and say it's one thing, or we're not playing hard enough. We need to do everything better."

 

Hadn't read Friedell's take until just now, but consistent with my take on Noah:

Out of all the issues facing the Bulls, the single biggest one at the moment might be that this group is devoid of a unifying leader.

 

Joakim Noah used to be that guy for the Bulls, but injuries have robbed him of that chance. He battled knee issues throughout last season and didn't play at a high level. He came to training camp in arguably the best shape of his career, but Hoiberg decided to take him out of the starting lineup and not play him down the stretch in games early in the season. When the final chapter of Hoiberg's first season as a professional head coach is written, his biggest mistake will likely be in how he handled the Noah situation. Hoiberg not only diminished Noah's confidence, he weakened Noah's voice among his teammates by slashing his minutes and his role.

[LDF]

I think the Bulls could trade Rose pretty easily. It depends on what they would get back. The cap is going up significantly. You wouldn't get a superstar return for him. But if they don't plan on maxing him, why not take what you can get?

 

that is the key for me and my opinion that no - one will trade for rose and his contract.

 

that being said, if the bulls were able to trade rose, then i can see a partial rebuild around bulter, miro and whomever the fo brings in. but still many things needs to go right. too much of a gamble. betting on the unknown

[Chisoxfn]

Oh and if you were going to bench Noah, it should have been for Taj. When Hoiberg made the Gar move and screwed them both over for Niko who had proven nothing, it set a serious message in the lockeroom, imo and it had very negative implications.

[LDF]

Well I think Gar created that culture when he decided to tell the players last year that they didn't need to follow Thibs and it only got worse this year. It absolutely was bad. But it was there roster and they need to be held accountable for it (as do the players). But when you had a roster of guys who for years were known as great team players, etc, well, than it is hard to ignore some of the changes that happened.

 

I've said numerous times I am an avid Thibs supporter though.

 

and that is my other point, a great coach, like thibs can hold the team together by shear will. i am not see or hearing that.... as of right now.

[LDF]

I do want to thank Taj for giving a f***. He'll probably get dealt, but he's represented the Bulls with great pride during his entire tenure (as has Noah).

 

i agree.

[southsider2k5]

Oh and if you were going to bench Noah, it should have been for Taj. When Hoiberg made the Gar move and screwed them both over for Niko who had proven nothing, it set a serious message in the lockeroom, imo and it had very negative implications.

 

Taj learned a lot from Noah over the years. You can see it in the way he plays.

[Dick Allen]

Rosenbloom had a nice one today. Said Gar and Hoiberg is Bulls for Emery and Trestman.

[LDF]

Rosenbloom had a nice one today. Said Gar and Hoiberg is Bulls for Emery and Trestman.

 

a great comp but i was looking at this like floyd and krause.

[Dick Allen]

a great comp but i was looking at this like floyd and krause.

People can say what they will about Jerry Krause, but he does have 6 rings. Obviously mostly because of a player that came with the job, but he hit on Scottie Pippen. He listened to Doug Collins and took Horace Grant. He picked up the complimentary pieces. He was the guy that gave Phil Jackson the opportunity.

 

 

On the other hand, he couldn't wait to blow it up and do it again, and that was one of the bigger disasters in league history.

[LDF]

People can say what they will about Jerry Krause, but he does have 6 rings. Obviously mostly because of a player that came with the job, but he hit on Scottie Pippen. He listened to Doug Collins and took Horace Grant. He picked up the complimentary pieces. He was the guy that gave Phil Jackson the opportunity.

 

 

On the other hand, he couldn't wait to blow it up and do it again, and that was one of the bigger disasters in league history.

 

most of what you say is true. but my point is in jk selecting floyd.

[Dick Allen]

most of what you say is true. but my point is in jk selecting floyd.

With the point, is almost exactly the same. Everyone knew what the deal was way before it was announced. I don't remember if Krause actually had the nerve to lie and say the Bulls would conduct an exhaustive search to find the right fit like Gar said. But other than that, identical, even from where they came.

[LDF]

With the point, is almost exactly the same. Everyone knew what the deal was way before it was announced. I don't remember if Krause actually had the nerve to lie and say the Bulls would conduct an exhaustive search to find the right fit like Gar said. But other than that, identical, even from where they came.

 

the stupidity of the whole thing is when the same org keep doing the same thing over and over. i would imagine that they were smart enuf to learn from it the first time.

 

the way it was handle is what is getting me, then, as it is now..... a chicken-s*** chain of mistakes. and gar is suppose to be smart????

 

a whole series of events that is comedic at best, which is a great image that chi has to live with.... in addition of that b/s of the 2 players from the sox.

[whitesoxfan99]

I'm trading for Anthony Davis (deal Buckets plus for him and hope New Orelans feels the heat to move him). Or whatever you need to. Bulls need to make a shakeup and I agree with you it would be best served with new blood and a new culture. Sad how fast and far the franchise has fallen.

 

Why the f*** would New Orleans do that? They have him locked up through the 2010-201 season.

[Bananarchy]

I am sure Thibs would have this team at least in the playoffs.

And yet no closer to a championship.

[pettie4sox]

And yet no closer to a championship.

 

True but this is all about aesthetics right now. The Bulls look like a clown show.

[Bigsoxhurt35]

I couldn't get into Bulls basketball this season. Wasn't happy with the Hoidberg hire. Butler is my favorite player and I can't wait til Rose leaves whenever that may be. Didn't think I'd miss Thibs as much as I do.

[Bigsoxhurt35]

True but this is all about aesthetics right now. The Bulls look like a clown show.

And it starts with the front office. It needs cleaned out but won't be. Yuck.

[Bigsoxhurt35]

And yet no closer to a championship.

This. Thibs couldn't figure out how to best Lebron in a series. Even as battered as the Cavs were last year. His inability to adapt in the playoffs was a big negative. With that said, I miss him lol. This is a s*** show right now.

[LDF]

 

interesting article esp from this paragraph on down.

While Hoiberg deserves plenty of blame, executive vice president John Paxson and general manager Gar Forman deserve more blame than anyone because they put this roster together and left it in place.

 

http://espn.go.com/blog/chicago/bulls/post...of-team-meeting

 

maybe some chgs will come, if only they, the owners group can see who is really to blame.

[Jenksismyhero]

He came to training camp in arguably the best shape of his career, but Hoiberg decided to take him out of the starting lineup and not play him down the stretch in games early in the season. When the final chapter of Hoiberg's first season as a professional head coach is written, his biggest mistake will likely be in how he handled the Noah situation.

 

f*** and no. Noah has been/was so incredibly dreadful on the offensive end. He couldn't shoot. He couldn't get put backs. He couldn't shoot FT's. You brought in a guy to change up the offense and score points. Playing Noah and Gasol together wasn't going to achieve that goal. I backed Hoiberg on that decision 100% and I still do. Noah could have been an anchor on the defensive unit that played down the stretch when the Bulls had a solid lead. That would have been perfect. Expecting him to play the 4 with Gasol and actually contribute anything meaningful was a pipe dream.

 

Of all the things to complain about with the front office and Hoiberg, this issue is not on the list.

[Kyyle23]

f*** and no. Noah has been/was so incredibly dreadful on the offensive end. He couldn't shoot. He couldn't get put backs. He couldn't shoot FT's. You brought in a guy to change up the offense and score points. Playing Noah and Gasol together wasn't going to achieve that goal. I backed Hoiberg on that decision 100% and I still do. Noah could have been an anchor on the defensive unit that played down the stretch when the Bulls had a solid lead. That would have been perfect. Expecting him to play the 4 with Gasol and actually contribute anything meaningful was a pipe dream.

 

Of all the things to complain about with the front office and Hoiberg, this issue is not on the list.

 

Doing it and how he handled it are two completely separate issues. He told everyone that Noah came to him and suggested that he come off the bench, all of the media went to Noah immediately and asked him about it and he had no idea what they were talking about. In his misguided attempt to "protect" Noah he inadvertently embarrassed him AND revealed to him that he was coming off the bench through the media.

 

The decision was correct, the follow through was college level bulls***