David Robertson calls out Mike Scioscia

[Buehrle>Wood]

http://deadspin.com/mike-scioscia-called-b...eeze-1723863998

 

“I felt that Scioscia was very bush league,” Robertson said, “coming out there and standing in front of home plate after the play had already been reviewed. I felt like once it has been reviewed, it has been reviewed on film and he’s called out, there’s no reason for you to come back out and argue the call.

 

“I guess that’s just the way he is. It kind of changed the whole momentum in the ninth.”

 

Scioscia denied Robertson’s charge, saying “Absolutely that was not my intent.”

 

The inning provided something of a flashback to Game 2 of the 2005 ALCS, when A.J. Pierzynski made it to first on a dropped third strike, eventually giving the White Sox the win over Anaheim, and Chicago did not lose again that postseason.

[Buehrle>Wood]

Robertson is correct. But also it's the umps who had no clue what was going on in the 9th and let Scioscia control the game.

[lasttriptotulsa]

It's supposed to be an automatic ejection to come back out and argue after a replay. I was shocked he wasn't tossed immediately.

[southsider2k5]

He did the same thing earlier in the game/series when he lost an appeal as well.

[Iwritecode]

What was the reasoning on that play anyway? It was pretty clear Flowers missed the tag. But when the ump called the runner out, Flowers turned and gave him the ball.

 

I'm shocked it wasn't overturned.

[Kyyle23]

the home plate ump screwed up and thats why I think he allowed Scioscia to complain. He either confirmed to Flowers that it was an out by a caught third strike and didnt need a throw to first, or said he was out on the tag. You could tell Flowers was ready to throw when he popped up, and then didnt for a reason.

 

[Quin]

Yeah, Robertson is right. Bush league by Scioscia.

[bmags]

the home plate ump screwed up and thats why I think he allowed Scioscia to complain. He either confirmed to Flowers that it was an out by a caught third strike and didnt need a throw to first, or said he was out on the tag. You could tell Flowers was ready to throw when he popped up, and then didnt for a reason.

 

Right, mlb should probably clarify this situation.

[lasttriptotulsa]

the home plate ump screwed up and thats why I think he allowed Scioscia to complain. He either confirmed to Flowers that it was an out by a caught third strike and didnt need a throw to first, or said he was out on the tag. You could tell Flowers was ready to throw when he popped up, and then didnt for a reason.

 

That's why I hate replay in baseball. You end up playing imaginary baseball at times. It was clear Tyler didn't throw because the ump confirmed he was out. Anybody who watches baseball knows that the runner would be out 99% of the time on the play, but the other 1% the catcher ends up throwing it into right field and he makes it to third. But because the ump blew a call we don't know what would have happened. That puts the replay guys in tough spot too because they're damned if they do and damned if they don't. Either call they make is going to rightfully piss off one of the fanbases.

[iamshack]

the home plate ump screwed up and thats why I think he allowed Scioscia to complain. He either confirmed to Flowers that it was an out by a caught third strike and didnt need a throw to first, or said he was out on the tag. You could tell Flowers was ready to throw when he popped up, and then didnt for a reason.

Yeah, the Angels' broadcasters mentioned that if they were to award him 1st base, then Robin would have a valid complaint because Flowers relied upon the umpire calling him out.

 

I agree about letting Scioscia argue because they botched the situation.

 

However, Robertson needs to focus on getting outs and less on what the opposing manager is doing.

[Jose Abreu]

That's why I hate replay in baseball. You end up playing imaginary baseball at times. It was clear Tyler didn't throw because the ump confirmed he was out. Anybody who watches baseball knows that the runner would be out 99% of the time on the play, but the other 1% the catcher ends up throwing it into right field and he makes it to third. But because the ump blew a call we don't know what would have happened. That puts the replay guys in tough spot too because they're damned if they do and damned if they don't. Either call they make is going to rightfully piss off one of the fanbases.

very well put

[The Gooch]

However, Robertson needs to focus on getting outs and less on what the opposing manager is doing.

 

I think he was trying to do that and make some warm-up throws to prepare, but Scioscia was standing over the plate.

[Iwritecode]

That's why I hate replay in baseball. You end up playing imaginary baseball at times. It was clear Tyler didn't throw because the ump confirmed he was out. Anybody who watches baseball knows that the runner would be out 99% of the time on the play, but the other 1% the catcher ends up throwing it into right field and he makes it to third. But because the ump blew a call we don't know what would have happened. That puts the replay guys in tough spot too because they're damned if they do and damned if they don't. Either call they make is going to rightfully piss off one of the fanbases.

 

I think replay has helped in getting the calls right more often but there are definitely situations where it gets tricky.

 

I thought the general rule was to continue the play regardless of the call. Which is why it surprises me that it wasn't overturned. But if the ump calls the play dead, are they supposed to continue the play?

 

 

 

[lasttriptotulsa]

I think replay has helped in getting the calls right more often but there are definitely situations where it gets tricky.

 

I thought the general rule was to continue the play regardless of the call. Which is why it surprises me that it wasn't overturned. But if the ump calls the play dead, are they supposed to continue the play?

 

But where do you draw the line on that. If he a guy hits a line drive down the foul line and the ump calls it foul are the players supposed to continue until all possible scenarios have been played out? No, games are long enough as it is. So then what do you do with the runner? Do you give him a double? Do you base it off the runners speed how far he would go? Ground rule double and fan interference calls already suck, do we really want more of those type situations? If that's the way baseball wants to go (which it appears they are) then at some point a playoff game is going to be decided based off of what an umpire thinks would normally happen.

Edited August 13, 2015 by lasttriptotulsa

[shysocks]

But where do you draw the line on that. If he a guy hits a line drive down the foul line and the ump calls it foul are the players supposed to continue until all possible scenarios have been played out? No, games are long enough as it is. So then what do you do with the runner? Do you give him a double? Do you base it off the runners speed how far he would go? Ground rule double and fan interference calls already suck, do we really want more of those type situations? If that's the way baseball wants to go (which it appears they are) then at some point a playoff game is going to be decided based off of what an umpire thinks would normally happen.

I could be wrong, but I think there are non-reviewable plays, like a ball hit down the line that is called foul, for just that reason. If the ump says the play is dead, then it's dead.

 

Some shoulda's:

 

Last night's play is in the same boat as the above example and should never have even been reviewed.

 

Even if they knew they were in the wrong, the crew should have ejected Scioscia the second he stepped out of the dugout again. That was some horses*** and he knew exactly what he was doing, not to mention it's explicitly against the rules.

 

Even if he was goaded into it, Robertson should not have called it out to the media. Now teams know this sort of thing bothers him. No big deal, but something to watch.

[southsider2k5]

I could be wrong, but I think there are non-reviewable plays, like a ball hit down the line that is called foul, for just that reason. If the ump says the play is dead, then it's dead.

 

Some shoulda's:

 

Last night's play is in the same boat as the above example and should never have even been reviewed.

 

Even if they knew they were in the wrong, the crew should have ejected Scioscia the second he stepped out of the dugout again. That was some horses*** and he knew exactly what he was doing, not to mention it's explicitly against the rules.

 

Even if he was goaded into it, Robertson should not have called it out to the media. Now teams know this sort of thing bothers him. No big deal, but something to watch.

 

The other side is it also forces the thought into umps heads, so Mike is less likely to do it in the future. If he does, umpires are more likely to drill him for it.

[RockRaines]

It's supposed to be an automatic ejection to come back out and argue after a replay. I was shocked he wasn't tossed immediately.

Yep, he should have been run right when he came back out of the dugout to argue.

[RockRaines]

Yeah, the Angels' broadcasters mentioned that if they were to award him 1st base, then Robin would have a valid complaint because Flowers relied upon the umpire calling him out.

 

I agree about letting Scioscia argue because they botched the situation.

 

However, Robertson needs to focus on getting outs and less on what the opposing manager is doing.

He did get the outs, unfortunately his teammate let him down.

[kitekrazy]

You would think most catchers would throw the ball to first anyway. You would think after the 2005 post season some would learn from AJ did as a base runner.

[lasttriptotulsa]

You would think most catchers would throw the ball to first anyway. You would think after the 2005 post season some would learn from AJ did as a base runner.

 

So if you catch a line drive and the ump calls an out are you going to throw to first too? The AJ thing is not comparable as Flowers clearly knew it was a dropped third strike and after he attempted the tag the ump pointed to the runner to acknowledge the tag and signaled he was out. What reason is there to keep playing? A play like that should not be reviewable.

[Dick Allen]

I thought for sure they would overturn the call. I wonder if keeping him out had anything to do with the umpire taking the ball before Aybar was at 1B. Wouldn't it technically be dead and out of play? Flowers knew he didn't tag him. I hope in the future he throws to 1B anyway even if the batter is called out. Safe is better than sorry.

[lasttriptotulsa]

I thought for sure they would overturn the call. I wonder if keeping him out had anything to do with the umpire taking the ball before Aybar was at 1B. Wouldn't it technically be dead and out of play? Flowers knew he didn't tag him. I hope in the future he throws to 1B anyway even if the batter is called out. Safe is better than sorry.

 

Good point. I never noticed that. Any play that an ump rules dead is not reviewable and I would certainly think the umpire taking the ball would rule a play dead. What's Flowers supposed to do, grab a ball out of the umps little pouch?

[greg775]

I thought it was rude of Scioscia to not take the argument a few steps off the plate. I mean Robertson should have been warming up or playing soft toss with Tyler the whole duration of the argument IMO. It was selfish/prickish to stand right on the plate!

[Jake]

It was such a confusing play that it made sense to give him explanation, but it didn't take long before it became clear he was just killing time out there

[BigHurt3515]

I thought for sure they would overturn the call. I wonder if keeping him out had anything to do with the umpire taking the ball before Aybar was at 1B. Wouldn't it technically be dead and out of play? Flowers knew he didn't tag him. I hope in the future he throws to 1B anyway even if the batter is called out. Safe is better than sorry.

 

Once the ump said he was out the play was over so there is no way they can overturn that. Did the umps or MLB make a statement about this?