And That's a White Sox Winner !!

[elrockinMT]

Don't give up on someone like Avisail Garcia. You can't make decisions like that on one game, a weeks worth or sometimes even a year. This is a long term deal on player development. The same goes for Thompson. It's all exciting right now but 23 at bats is not a good judge. I think Robin is bringing him along very well. Saladino has slowed down some while it appears Sanchez is getting somewhat better with the bat and is real good with the glove. We have some decisions next year for sure and they are exciting. We may actually be seeing our own talent finally coming up and producing

[Knackattack]

I'd like to see Sanchez get time it short for the rest of the season. His bat really is light for second base. I would also consider Thompson in left and let Melky DH. Avi is younger, hits just as well as Melky, and needs the work. Melky is shaping up as dead money himself.

Melky is a much stronger hitter and a (slightly) better fielder than Avi. Avi is the 2nd worst defensive RF in baseball this season behind only Matt Kemp, he needs to GTFO of right.

[Knackattack]

OPS on the season: Melky .697, Avi .704.

OPS+ Melky 97, Avi 99.

wRC+, Melky 89, Avi 93.

 

Both are below average hitters on the whole season. Melky's been a small step below with the bat and an equally small step upwards on defense and baserunning.

Melky had a horrible start but has an .814 OPS since the ASB, and his pre ASB line (.261/.304/.339) looks close to Avi's season line.

Edited August 26, 2015 by Knackattack

[Balta1701]

Melky had a horrible start but has an .814 OPS since the ASB, and his pre ASB line (.261/.304/.339) looks close to Avi's season line.

Melky Cabrera's August numbers look quite similar to his early season numbers, a .619 OPS compared to his .620 OPS in April, for example. By saying "he has an .814 OPS since the AS Break" you're getting the fact that he had 1 great stretch and then avoiding including his early season stretch.

 

You can play the same game with Avisail Garcia over 8 week periods early in the season. Through June 10 Avi was hitting .297 with an .805 OPS and that's in 200+ PAs as well. It's the same game - you selectively pick time slices that minimize the slump, while ignoring the fact that both have spent ~60% of the season as terrifically bad hitters and 40% as solid hitters.

 

Avi had a good start, Melky had a bad start, they've both been overall very weak hitters throughout the season and totaling what they've done over the full season, Avi comes out a tiny sliver on top with the bat while Melky is an equally tiny sliver on top defensively and baserunning.

[cabiness42]

Sanchez is now into positive WAR territory. He's absolutely earned the starting role at 2B headed into spring. If the ORG can bring in someone on the cheap that is a 4 WAR player well hell in that case forget Sanchez, but when that doesn't happen, start him. He's earned it.

 

If he was more highly touted we'd be ecstatic about a slick fielding 23 year old 2B that seems to have a little pop in his bat as well. He's never gonna hit more than 270/320/400 but with his glove at 2B that's an above average starter in today's game.

 

I'd rather see the Sox find someone else to play 2B who can hit a little and move Sanchez to SS where his bat is closer to average.

[Balta1701]

I'd rather see the Sox find someone else to play 2B who can hit a little and move Sanchez to SS where his bat is closer to average.

Do you think Sanchez's glove plays as an above average glove at SS? Personally I don't think he has nearly the SS makeup that Tyler has but I am open to hearing why I'm wrong.

[cabiness42]

This kid needs to be playing every day. Move Garcia to DH and bench LaRoche for the rest of the season.

 

Just my opinion.

 

Mark

 

LaRoche is better vs RHP than Garcia.

 

 

[cabiness42]

Do you think Sanchez's glove plays as an above average glove at SS? Personally I don't think he has nearly the SS makeup that Tyler has but I am open to hearing why I'm wrong.

 

Well then move Saladino to SS and get somebody at 3B to hit. Either way, the lineup is just to weak having Saladino at 3B and Sanchez at 2B. Gotta get a real bat at one of those two spots.

[Balta1701]

Well then move Saladino to SS and get somebody at 3B to hit. Either way, the lineup is just to weak having Saladino at 3B and Sanchez at 2B. Gotta get a real bat at one of those two spots.

I'm totally in favor of the first part and I think it's the right move. I don't see any obvious bat candidate in this organization who can fill that 3b role in the next few seasons though.

[Jerksticks]

I'm totally in favor of the first part and I think it's the right move. I don't see any obvious bat candidate in this organization who can fill that 3b role in the next few seasons though.

I agree. We'd be sitting pretty right now if Davidson didn't pee his pants.

 

My gut tells me Saladino is a way better shortstop moving forward than Tim Anderson. Anderson & Micah should be traded for a really solid Catcher or 3B.

[Balta1701]

I agree. We'd be sitting pretty right now if Davidson didn't pee his pants.

 

My gut tells me Saladino is a way better shortstop moving forward than Tim Anderson. Anderson & Micah should be traded for a really solid Catcher or 3B.

Call me optimistic (really? me?) but I really like the idea of Anderson at SS especially given that he's cut down the errors this year. He 100% still has work to do - defense, too many strikeouts, he definitely needs a full season at AAA, maybe even more if he doesn't tear up AAA next year, but Anderson at SS could be one of the strongest SS in baseball in a couple years if his development continues as it has been this season. We should be under no illusions that he will do anything but struggle in 2017 as a big league starter so that anything we get beyond that is gravy, but I really like him there - I'm dreaming of peak Jose Reyes manning SS for us during a much worse offensive period.

 

So, how do we get to that point? If we're doing the silly "We must compete right now!!!!" thing we did this season then you probably bite the bullet and bring Alexei back. If you're instead actually trying to build a franchise, I think putting Saladino at SS for 2016 gives you more options. Maybe he's a failure with the bat and you don't mind replacing him with Timmy. Maybe he hits in-between and you decide he's becoming a utility guy when Anderson comes up in September 2016. Maybe you get lucky and you get a really great season out of Tyler and you have the problem of deciding which high value piece to trade. I like to hope for the latter, but the only way we find out if he can be a solid SS is to play him at SS.

[Chisoxfn]

This kid needs to be playing every day. Move Garcia to DH and bench LaRoche for the rest of the season.

 

Just my opinion.

 

Mark

Agreed - I don't think Tracye is a full time starter, but Sox need to see him get as many bats as possible. It is also key to see just how good he can be defensively. He has the tools to be a starter, but the production hasn't necessarily matched the tools. He is coming to fruition in the right era though (more of a premium on defense / non-hitter's era).

[southsider2k5]

Chicago White Sox ‏@whitesox 2h2 hours ago Chicago, IL

You said it.

 

klay thompson @KlayThompson

I hate to admit it but Trayce might be the best overall athlete in the fam lol

 

[Saufley]

I don't think you'll find a single person here that would disagree. Too bad the Sox will never do it. RV and the ORG will ride LaRoche to the end. If only the kid Thompson had half the leash against RHP that La Roche had against LHP through July.

 

Good to see most of the contributions coming from guys that are young and will be here next year. Ramirez is dead to me. I appreciate his time but this season has been a train wreck, even with his improved 2nd half defense his bat and overall production has been brutal.

 

Yes, it is good to see the contributions coming from the young players BUT, more and more every day it appears RV will still be the manager and that is the bad news!!

 

[Jerksticks]

Call me optimistic (really? me?) but I really like the idea of Anderson at SS especially given that he's cut down the errors this year. He 100% still has work to do - defense, too many strikeouts, he definitely needs a full season at AAA, maybe even more if he doesn't tear up AAA next year, but Anderson at SS could be one of the strongest SS in baseball in a couple years if his development continues as it has been this season. We should be under no illusions that he will do anything but struggle in 2017 as a big league starter so that anything we get beyond that is gravy, but I really like him there - I'm dreaming of peak Jose Reyes manning SS for us during a much worse offensive period.

 

So, how do we get to that point? If we're doing the silly "We must compete right now!!!!" thing we did this season then you probably bite the bullet and bring Alexei back. If you're instead actually trying to build a franchise, I think putting Saladino at SS for 2016 gives you more options. Maybe he's a failure with the bat and you don't mind replacing him with Timmy. Maybe he hits in-between and you decide he's becoming a utility guy when Anderson comes up in September 2016. Maybe you get lucky and you get a really great season out of Tyler and you have the problem of deciding which high value piece to trade. I like to hope for the latter, but the only way we find out if he can be a solid SS is to play him at SS.

I agree with most of this except for Alexei giving us the best chance to compete in 2016. SS is maybe the 1 position where the young guy has a very very reslistic shot at matching the current veteran production, both offensively and defensively, and maybe exceeding it. Saladino looks like a player to my eyes, but I think the $10M or whatever saved is even worth a slight downgrade if that so happens to be.

 

Man, Now I'm having dreams of an Arenado Saladino Sanches triple GG threat infield

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

LaRoche is better vs RHP than Garcia.

 

It's pretty equal depending on what you consider more important statistically. Based on speed alone I'd rather play Garcia and keep getting him AB's for his long term development. LaRoche if you think his recent weekly output may continue and the Sox might salvage some semblance of production from him for his remaining year.

 

Neither is ideal but Avi is infinitely more tradable for his youth and potential whereas LaRoche seems like a sunk cost . Him retiring after this year would be perfect but who turns down another year at $13M ?

[Balta1701]

It's pretty equal depending on what you consider more important statistically. Based on speed alone I'd rather play Garcia and keep getting him AB's for his long term development. LaRoche if you think his recent weekly output may continue and the Sox might salvage some semblance of production from him for his remaining year.

 

Neither is ideal but Avi is infinitely more tradable for his youth and potential whereas LaRoche seems like a sunk cost . Him retiring after this year would be perfect but who turns down another year at $13M ?

Again, I don't think anyone would trade for Avisail Garcia. We've been down this road before - in 2014 when we kept pretending teams would trade for Dayan Viciedo. It's almost the exact same situation except Garcia has both played less and produced less. Garcia hits his first arbitration year next year so he's going to jump in salary to about $2 million. That's ok, that's almost a writeoff, but 2017 he shoots up to the $4-5 million range and the White Sox cut Viciedo loose to avoid paying that. You could maybe find a rebuilding team who will take Garcia on because they'd risk that to see if they could get something useful out of him, but they're not giving you anything of value for him. If he were on another roster, the kind of stuff we'd talk about giving up for him is "Matt Davidson" or something like that - a guy we were down on and just getting rid of for a shot in the dark.

 

He's the kind of guy rebuilding teams should be acquiring - talented guys you don't have to give up anything to get because of their contract status...but he's also a guy no one would give up anything of real value for. Just like 2014 Viciedo when we kept pretending the Mariners were interested in him and then they never really were.

[Jose Abreu]

No Thompson in tonight's lineup. JFC, I don't care about the handedness of the opposing pitcher, Trayce is hitting like .530

[OmarComing25]

Even if Thompson sucks against righties, the fact that he can hit lefties means he can still provide a lot of value to this team, considering that pretty much everyone else besides Soto is awful against LHP. I already like Thompson as the 4th OF going forward, and he should definitely be in the starting lineup versus lefties. If he can hit LHP at a decent clip and provide good defense, that's a very, very valuable guy off the bench.

[GREEDY]

Even if Thompson sucks against righties

 

Prior to 2015, Thompson had fairly neutral splits throughout the minors.

[Jose Abreu]

Even if Thompson sucks against righties, the fact that he can hit lefties means he can still provide a lot of value to this team, considering that pretty much everyone else besides Soto is awful against LHP. I already like Thompson as the 4th OF going forward, and he should definitely be in the starting lineup versus lefties. If he can hit LHP at a decent clip and provide good defense, that's a very, very valuable guy off the bench.

He still needs to at least be given the chance to hit righties this year.

[GreenSox]

He still needs to at least be given the chance to hit righties this year.

Exactly.

 

And for as many at bats they give Laroche, Dunn and Melky against lefties - guys who have proven they can't hit them - they sure as heck can give Thompson some at bats against righties.

[fathom]

No Thompson in tonight's lineup. JFC, I don't care about the handedness of the opposing pitcher, Trayce is hitting like .530

 

Yep, makes no sense from a competing standpoint nor a development standpoint. Eaton and Melky look tired anyways.

[Bigsoxhurt35]

Wanted to watch some Trayce tonight, thanks Robin

[Señor Ding-Dong]

I'd rather see the Sox find someone else to play 2B who can hit a little and move Sanchez to SS where his bat is closer to average.

But then you're moving a guy with GG-caliber defense at 2B to SS where he would reportedly be average at best.

 

I'd like to get Sanchez a look at SS, especially with September coming up, but I don't think I'd want to move him off 2B long-term. I believe he has enough potential with the bat, to go along with his defense, to be an above-average or possibly even all-star 2B.

 

He's hitting .294 since July 1st. Just imagine what his numbers would be if he had hit just poorly, say to the tune of .200, instead of the awful .153 he hit during the months of May and June. We'd all be ecstatic at his prospects for the future. Point is, he has now been good for longer than he was bad and has certainly pushed the need for a 2B pretty far down the list, at least for the time being.

 

But pretty much what Balta said, I'd rather leave Sanchez at 2B, dump Alexei, acquire a 3B, move Saladino to SS as the stop-gap starter, then move Saladino to a utility bench role once Anderson is ready (assuming he'll stick at SS and meet expectations).