Gammons thinks Shark gets QO

[Saufley]

Per score

 

Does anyone listen to the score anymore. I don't!

 

[Balta1701]

That would be the Sox luck to get nothing for him.

There is precedent, both Stephen Drew and Kendrys Morales received QOs after decent seasons in 2013 and remained unsigned throughout all of spring training and the first couple months of the season, neither sent picks back to the teams that offered them the QO.

[Dick Allen]

Hypothetically, let's say the Sox have a payroll limit of $120 million. If they pick up Alexei and offer arbitration to people, then Samardzija puts them at or above their limit and they have to do the Alexei option right at the end of the season before they know anything about whether he'd accept. That could be a major motivation for them, depending on their forward-looking budget. If their limit is higher, then Samardzija could be "the only thing we do this offseason other than trades". That could also be a major motivation for them.

 

(Personally, if I were in his spot, I think yes I'd accept. If he turns it down, my guess remains that he stays unsigned through June 15).

So you would take 1 year $16 million instead of a guarantee probably more than triple for 3 or 4 years at the very least, to return to the scene of the crime?

 

Either that is your doom and gloom the Sox won't even get a draft pick, or it is really reckless. Why would he want to work with Coop, someone he thinks is at least partially the problem, to try to fix him?

 

He isn't coming back. I believe Kaplan who said no way he is coming back.

[Dick Allen]

There is precedent, both Stephen Drew and Kendrys Morales received QOs after decent seasons in 2013 and remained unsigned throughout all of spring training and the first couple months of the season, neither sent picks back to the teams that offered them the QO.

Considering their performance after taking this route, I don't think anyone really wants to go down that road again.

[Saufley]

That's 16M that could be spent on the offense for a team that desperately needs it. Also, I see a huge problem with paying a pitcher that kind of money for a 5+ ERA. Just my thoughts.

 

Who knows, maybe he would do better with both Ventura and Cooper not in the Sox dugout. Maybe not but who knows.

[Dick Allen]

Who knows, maybe he would do better with both Ventura and Cooper not in the Sox dugout. Maybe not but who knows.

I don't know if Robin is staying or leaving, but unless Coop gets a 9 month gout attack, there is no question he will be back. And there is a problem there. Even Heyman confirms.

Edited September 18, 2015 by Dick Allen

[Balta1701]

So you would take 1 year $16 million instead of a guarantee probably more than triple for 3 or 4 years at the very least, to return to the scene of the crime?

 

Either that is your doom and gloom the Sox won't even get a draft pick, or it is really reckless. Why would he want to work with Coop, someone he thinks is at least partially the problem, to try to fix him?

 

He isn't coming back. I believe Kaplan who said no way he is coming back.

I don't think there's any chance that he gets "3 or 4 years" at anything close to that value with the number of pitchers on the market who have no QO. That's why I think that there's going to be a strong suggestion to "Take it if offered".

[Chicago White Sox]

I don't think there's any chance that he gets "3 or 4 years" at anything close to that value with the number of pitchers on the market who have no QO. That's why I think that there's going to be a strong suggestion to "Take it if offered".

Balta, I get you wouldn't give him a 3 or 4 year deal, but there will be at least one GM willing to do so. This is Major League Baseball, stupid contacts are given out every year. We'll offer him the QO, he'll reject, and then sign a multi-year below his expectations with some team. Probably the Yankees cause Jim Hendry is there. Guys rarely go from potential seven figure contracts to being limited to one year offers because of single bad year that had nothing to with injuries.

[Vance Law]

The talk of him accepting the QO is absurd.

[kitekrazy]

Balta, I get you wouldn't give him a 3 or 4 year deal, but there will be at least one GM willing to do so. This is Major League Baseball, stupid contacts are given out every year. We'll offer him the QO, he'll reject, and then sign a multi-year below his expectations with some team. Probably the Yankees cause Jim Hendry is there. Guys rarely go from potential seven figure contracts to being limited to one year offers because of single bad year that had nothing to with injuries.

 

His stats are not that great.

 

[greg775]

Greg does get ripped for saying a lot of things that actually wind up being correct. He goes way out there sometimes, I think he would admit that, but he usually as close as anyone when measuring accuracy.

Thanks for noticing Dick Allen! Thank u.

[LDF]

 

for the most part, i enjoy greg's post. he add that little spice that is needed in life.

 

[greg775]

for the most part, i enjoy greg's post. he add that little spice that is needed in life.

 

Thanks LDF. Your posts are full of enthusiasm and honesty. I appreciate you and your kind words. Thank u.

[AlSoxfan]

"His underachieving season surely won’t help him in the free agent market. His return to the South Side? Don’t count on it according to Bruce Levine.

 

Chicago must determine whether to make a qualifying offer to him after the World Series ends. A qualifying offer means you offer your own free agent a $17.1-million one-year contract. If the player accepts, he gets a one-year contract. If he declines, the team gets a pick after the first round of the June amateur draft in June 2016.

 

The smart money has Samardzija getting a multi-year deal of significant money, despite having a down season. His return to the White Sox beyond 2015 seems highly unlikely."

 

I'm not sure where he got the $17.1 mil from

Edited September 19, 2015 by AlSoxfan

[Balta1701]

"His underachieving season surely won’t help him in the free agent market. His return to the South Side? Don’t count on it according to Bruce Levine.

 

Chicago must determine whether to make a qualifying offer to him after the World Series ends. A qualifying offer means you offer your own free agent a $17.1-million one-year contract. If the player accepts, he gets a one-year contract. If he declines, the team gets a pick after the first round of the June amateur draft in June 2016.

 

The smart money has Samardzija getting a multi-year deal of significant money, despite having a down season. His return to the White Sox beyond 2015 seems highly unlikely."

 

I'm not sure where he got the $17.1 mil from

Lots of people have different estimates. The Qualifying offer is the average of the top 125 salaries across all of baseball, however, many players have things like performance bonuses that will impact the final calculated number. Last year's QO was $15.3 million and it has been going up by about $1 million per year, but the exact amount it goes up depends on the contracts signed the previous offseason.

[LDF]

"His underachieving season surely won’t help him in the free agent market. His return to the South Side? Don’t count on it according to Bruce Levine.

 

Chicago must determine whether to make a qualifying offer to him after the World Series ends. A qualifying offer means you offer your own free agent a $17.1-million one-year contract. If the player accepts, he gets a one-year contract. If he declines, the team gets a pick after the first round of the June amateur draft in June 2016.

 

The smart money has Samardzija getting a multi-year deal of significant money, despite having a down season. His return to the White Sox beyond 2015 seems highly unlikely."

 

I'm not sure where he got the $17.1 mil from

 

all this will be based on posters opinions, many has made great discussion and point on their opinions.

 

as i said many days ago, this is a win-win situation for the sox. shark will really need to pitch the lights out, if he accept the QO to redeem himself.

the sox will reap these positive results, the sox can trade him and or keep him and he can be the bridge for fulmer.

 

now here is another opinion, this yr performance, with ref to the overall stats, this yr is not the real shark.

 

but now, many will disagree, but no one is going to chg my opinion and the sox FO will have their opinions as well.

[LDF]

Lots of people have different estimates. The Qualifying offer is the average of the top 125 salaries across all of baseball, however, many players have things like performance bonuses that will impact the final calculated number. Last year's QO was $15.3 million and it has been going up by about $1 million per year, but the exact amount it goes up depends on the contracts signed the previous offseason.

 

many thanks. great update on the info you provided.

[GreenSox]

This would be a terrible move from Samardzija's side. If he has a QO attached to him it will cost him a lot of money as a free agent compared to if he has no QO attached to him. Could even keep him from being signed at all until mid-June.

Yep. The best thing that could happen shark is to get the QO off of his back.I think he realized that in July. It certainly looked to me at that time he was pitching with 150% effort. And then he collapsed.

He probably also realized in July that he had no future with the White Sox because of his relationship with Cooper.

 

Certainly wouldn't surprise me if he reverts to his career form: a number three starter that people hero worshiped the discarded Cub into an ace.

They will give him the QO. Whether the Sox end up with a comp pick is to be determined.

Edited September 19, 2015 by GreenSox

[Lillian]

Do we agree with the following:

 

1) Coop will be the Sox pitching coach next season.

 

2) Samardjiza is not one of our best 5 starting pitchers

 

3) There are more important holes to fill with the money he would receive through a qualifying offer.

 

4) He had precisely the same incentive to pitch well this year, with a potential huge free agent contract on the horizon, and the results were terrible.

 

If those things are true, I personally am not in favor of taking the chance that he accepts the QO.

The money that he will cost, even for one year, is not justified and can better be spent elsewhere.

Moreover, having him start every 5TH game significantly diminishes the chances for the Sox to win on that day.

The Sox have some young pitchers who need to be given an opportunity. That list includes E. Johnson, Montas and later Fulmer.

 

And finally, the record of "sandwich round" draft picks is not good enough to merit the sacrifice.

Therefore, unless there is some assurance that he won't accept it, I hope that the front office doesn't make a QO.

[kitekrazy]

Greg does get ripped for saying a lot of things that actually wind up being correct. He goes way out there sometimes, I think he would admit that, but he usually as close as anyone when measuring accuracy.

 

He's very passionate about the Sox and for the insults aimed at him he is one of the most civil posters here.

 

[venom4789]

So i may not know a lot about pitching coaches but i was always under the impression that coop was one of the best in the games, am i correct, or incorrect. Also with shark and coop rift is it personalities clashing, or is coop telling shark to do things and shark wont. Also i guess could be the other way around maybe coop changed something and now shark is getting lit up so he blames him,

[Y2Jimmy0]

Do we agree with the following:

 

1) Coop will be the Sox pitching coach next season.

 

2) Samardjiza is not one of our best 5 starting pitchers

 

3) There are more important holes to fill with the money he would receive through a qualifying offer.

 

4) He had precisely the same incentive to pitch well this year, with a potential huge free agent contract on the horizon, and the results were terrible.

 

If those things are true, I personally am not in favor of taking the chance that he accepts the QO.

The money that he will cost, even for one year, is not justified and can better be spent elsewhere.

Moreover, having him start every 5TH game significantly diminishes the chances for the Sox to win on that day.

The Sox have some young pitchers who need to be given an opportunity. That list includes E. Johnson, Montas and later Fulmer.

 

And finally, the record of "sandwich round" draft picks is not good enough to merit the sacrifice.

Therefore, unless there is some assurance that he won't accept it, I hope that the front office doesn't make a QO.

 

It's a complete and utter failure by the organization if they don't get the comp pick. Not offering him a QO is crazy talk. They will offer him. He'll decline and sign elsewhere. Not sure why so many in this thread are struggling with this. The pick falls in the 25-35 range. Very valuable pick.

 

[Y2Jimmy0]

The talk of him accepting the QO is absurd.

 

 

Greta post. Completely agree.

[LDF]

So i may not know a lot about pitching coaches but i was always under the impression that coop was one of the best in the games, am i correct, or incorrect. Also with shark and coop rift is it personalities clashing, or is coop telling shark to do things and shark wont. Also i guess could be the other way around maybe coop changed something and now shark is getting lit up so he blames him,

 

ref to coop, it is a perception that he is the best, however if you type in the best mlb pitching coaches and coop will be in the top 3-4 depending on the article . here is fan graph breakdown.

 

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/you-and-you...tching-coaches/

 

ref coop and shark. unless someone in the "in's" have some inside knowledge, i believe there hasn't been anything rumored or talked about. maybe this off season.

[Balta1701]

It's a complete and utter failure by the organization if they don't get the comp pick. Not offering him a QO is crazy talk. They will offer him. He'll decline and sign elsewhere. Not sure why so many in this thread are struggling with this. The pick falls in the 25-35 range. Very valuable pick.

I continue to think that any description of a sandwich pick as a "very valuable pick" is overstating it. It's a nice little thing, but it's less in value than the combined 2 picks we gave up last year for our free agent signings. On average you might get ~2 fWAR from a sandwich round pick, so somewhere close to 1/2 of the picks in that range will never even make the big leagues.

 

It's nice. You don't give it away for nothing. But also don't oversell it.