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Hahn Confirms: Ventura back for 2016


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QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Oct 2, 2015 -> 05:41 PM)
After the last off-season, I think questioning JR's desire to make the White Sox better doesn't make a whole lot of sense. The moves may have mostly backfired, but you don't spend all that money on free agents just due to shareholders. He's too loyal and slow to make changes in the front office, but that's a different conversation.

Al Davis never lost his desire to make the Raiders winners, he just got bad at doing it. Reinsdorf spends based on what's coming in. It's not that he doesn't want to win, it's just not the first priority, and he's not as sharp as he use to be.

Also being slow to make changes is the problem. There's no other problem. That's my opinion.

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QUOTE (Tannerfan @ Oct 2, 2015 -> 07:03 PM)
Al Davis never lost his desire to make the Raiders winners, he just got bad at doing it. Reinsdorf spends based on what's coming in. It's not that he doesn't want to win, it's just not the first priority, and he's not as sharp as he use to be.

Also being slow to make changes is the problem. There's no other problem. That's my opinion.

If you are slow at making necessary changes to help better your team, maybe it's time you consider selling it. KW should have been fired after the 2011 debacle with Ozzie. Robin should have been fired after 2013 or after this 2015 disappointment. I'm starting to believe Hahn is apart of this problem too now. If he's the guy making this announcement, he obviously wants Robin to return. Either that, or he is indeed JR and KWs puppet. This organization is truly falling into deep irrelevance. As a diehard Sox fan, this makes me beyond sad.

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QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Oct 2, 2015 -> 06:17 PM)
Whoever you think is the best manager in baseball, if they managed the 2015 White Sox, do you think they are a playoff team?

 

Playoffs... probably not.

 

However I expected improvement with the upgraded roster and another year of young players to grow.

 

There was basically none.

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QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Oct 2, 2015 -> 07:31 PM)
Maddon is a good manager but the impact even a good manager can have on overall wins is pretty minimal. The Rays have won more games in 2015 than they did last year, and they made few changes in the off-season and were ravaged by injuries this year.

 

They were ravaged by injuries last year and traded David Price at the All-Star break. Maddon had a good stretch w Tampa w numerous young players since they never went out and signed big free agents.

 

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QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Oct 2, 2015 -> 07:15 PM)
For me, a new manager needs to be one who makes the correct decisions. Can get this team up and going. Hold these guys accountable. This team and organization is a clown show.

No consequences for the team president or GM who failed to put together a playoff team or rebuild a poor farm system since 2008. No consequences for a manager who failed to make the post season in his 4th straight season. A clown show is not to far off from an accurate statement. Apparently it's all Parents fault.

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QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 2, 2015 -> 07:18 PM)
Once he was let go by the White Sox, Tony LaRussa never went more than 3 straight seasons without a playoff appearance.

And when the talent level dropped in Oakland, it became apparent, Tony wasn't the reason they were winning. He also won a WS winning 83 games. That isn't going to happen much.

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QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Oct 2, 2015 -> 07:31 PM)
And when the talent level dropped in Oakland, it became apparent, Tony wasn't the reason they were winning. He also won a WS winning 83 games. That isn't going to happen much.

Since your not blaming Robin and think managers have little to do with the game, I'm assuming your blaming KW and or Hahn for this crapfest?

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QUOTE (GreatScott82 @ Oct 2, 2015 -> 08:42 PM)
Since your not blaming Robin and think managers have little to do with the game, I'm assuming your blaming KW and or Hahn for this crapfest?

If the GM replacement wanted to keep Robin I'd be ok with that.

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QUOTE (GreatScott82 @ Oct 2, 2015 -> 07:42 PM)
Since your not blaming Robin and think managers have little to do with the game, I'm assuming your blaming KW and or Hahn for this crapfest?

I asked another guy if he thought this White Sox team makes the playoffs if managed byway he considers to be the best manager in baseball. He said probably not. Almost 97% of teams don't have the best manager in baseball, so if the best one doesn't make them a playoff team, he rest probably don't either. Maybe you think this team is a playoff team with a manager you consider good The fact is so many posters post th Sox are so far from contending, have so many holes, blaming the manager for not making the playoffs is beyond silly. You cannot manage incompetence to victory in professional sports.

 

So yes, thus far KW and RH have failed. As much as Hahn is loved around here if you look at his transactions, his percentage of deals he would still do in hindsight are very few. He has had some great extensions which offsets that a bit. But right now, the jury is out on RH IMO. I am not a KW fan but I don't subscribe to the good moves-Hahn, bad moves-KW theme. If Hahn is the GM by title only, he needs to grow a pair and resign.

Edited by Dick Allen
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Making the playoffs isn't my issue with Ventura this year.

 

However as I posted earlier... their should have been some improvement.

 

There was zero.

 

And I do see that at least partially on Robin... especially after two straight horrible losing years.

 

I just don't see how you can bring him back.

 

There is no logic in it period.

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Because everyone wants to vent their frustrations...

 

What next, Vince Coleman will get an extension or praise for the job he's done this year?

 

We can keep throwing out examples like 2012, 2008, 2000, 1983, 1977...but nobody's buying it with the same front office and essentially the same managerial/coaching staff coming back intact. Does anyone believe that replacing Baines (whatever he did) will make one iota of difference?

 

What are the odds Sale, Abreu, Quintana, Robertson, Nate Jones, Rodon, Cabrera, Ramirez, etc., are close to 100% health for another year?

Edited by caulfield12
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QUOTE (Vance Law @ Oct 2, 2015 -> 05:09 PM)
Manager barely matters unless it is someone as insane and toxic as Ozzie. Ned Yost was the biggest dumb piece of s*** manager in baseball, until their young players finally started playing well. Now he's a genius. And if you want to argue "hey, I never said Ned Yost is a genius," then look at the Royals record and see how much the manager matters if you have a lineup full of valuable players.

 

The amount of anger and vitriol heaped on Robin is at about a 10 when it should be more like a 1.5.

 

So who said I was just referring to Robin? The problems with this franchise run much deeper, wider and higher than him. But to say he's not part of the problem is being in denial.

 

Mark

 

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QUOTE (harkness @ Oct 2, 2015 -> 06:11 PM)
Playoffs... probably not.

 

However I expected improvement with the upgraded roster and another year of young players to grow.

 

There was basically none.

 

 

What do you mean? They've improved buy one game since last year with this weekend to go!!!!!!!!!! LOL.

 

NOW THAT'S PROGRESS BABY!

 

Mark

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QUOTE (fathom @ Oct 2, 2015 -> 07:34 PM)
Next year should be do or die for Ventura and Hahn. They clearly want to go for it again, so there needs to be good transactions and Ventura needs them ready out of the gate.

 

If they get hammered by injuries they'll have another ready made excuse.

 

Mark

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Disgusted.

 

As I wrote elsewhere, managers should be assigned WAR. If they were, I'd give Ventura a -5 to -8 range. Just pulling that out of a hat. But I think there is no question managers make a difference. And it starts with whether the team plays good fundamental baseball. Do they field well, or as well as they could give their talent? Do they run the bases well? Do they move runners over? Bunt if called upon? If they dont, this is a managerial problem.

 

Anyone think the Giants win the World Series without Bochy? Any of the 3 they just won?

 

Managers also make in game decisions that win and lose games. Ventura is not good here either. They set lineups, decide who sits, etc.

 

Ultimately, how can Ventura hold any player accountable when he hasn't been held accountable himself??

 

Another wasted year coming up. Sox could be better, but there is no way they will overcome the anchor that Ventura is for the team.

 

I don't live in Chicago, but I'm not going to see them when they come to DC or Baltimore. And it's hard for me because I have a 12 year old son who loves baseball.

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Been thinking about this since it was announced and I still think they should let Robin go. That being said the majority of this mess is on RH/KW. In all honesty there's only one guy in the Sox lineup that puts fear into opposing pitchers, until that changes the results will stay the same regardless of how good the pitching is.

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I can't believe the Sox actually made this announcement and think that Sox fans are going to be behind this move. Ventura is not the only reason this franchise is in disarray, but he's long overstayed and proven to us that time and time again he has no clue what the hell he's doing. Can't wait to here the Sox cry about no one coming to the park next year after the teams starts sluggish out of the gate for yet again after spring training and lacking heavily in the basic fundamentals of a major league ball club. Making Parent a scapegoat is embarrassing. Keeping Ventura is a slap in the face to the fans.

Edited by CWSpalehoseCWS
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