Bad umpiring

[COACH612]

I have only watched the Cubs-Carddnals series. I have seen so many bad calls for strikes clearly out of the zone. Anyone see the other games to comment?

[Dick Allen]

Some have said TBS's zone is off a bit, but I don't think so. I agree, there were some bad calls. Unless where they have the ball in those zones are off, there were pitches in the zone called balls and way out of the zone called strikes. There were pitches called balls in an AB correctly because they were high, and then a strike called on a pitch that was even higher. They used to assign umpires playoff series based on merit. I do not think that is the case anymore, and while umpiring a MLB game is a lot different than other levels, if you miss by an inch you are a fool for everyone to see, they need to have their most consistent umpiring playoff games. In fact, I would go one further, I think the guys that grade the best behind the plate, IMO especially with replay the most important, should umpire every game behind the plate. No rotation in the playoffs. The WS should have the best balls and strikes umpire calling each game.

[Bob Sacamano]

I have only watched the Cubs-Carddnals series. I have seen so many bad calls for strikes clearly out of the zone. Anyone see the other games to comment?

 

Watching other games, the zone has been bad all over.

[Kyyle23]

i just dont think people can trust the K Zone like they want to. You are looking at an imaginary box set up by the tv station at an angle, it is not an infallible judgement of the strikezone.

 

That doesnt mean the umpires havent had their moments, but I think people freak out more because of what the K zone shows them

[lasttriptotulsa]

I think there has been some questionable umpiring but not as bad as the TBS box makes it look. It seems like every pitch that is maybe an inch or two off the plate looks like it's 6-8 inches off according to their box. It's almost as if it showing where the catcher catches it as opposed to where it actually crosses the plate.

[Dick Allen]

i just dont think people can trust the K Zone like they want to. You are looking at an imaginary box set up by the tv station at an angle, it is not an infallible judgement of the strikezone.

 

That doesnt mean the umpires havent had their moments, but I think people freak out more because of what the K zone shows them

IMO, the k-zone is far more accurate than most umpires, if not every one of them, and as been stated in the past, no one will complain if they call pitches outside or inside or high or low an inch or 2 strikes, as long as they will always call them strikes. I am not blaming the Cubs winning on the umpires at all, but there are pitches in the same AB that were called high, and then a pitch that was even higher called a ball, same with the corners. You can't have that.

 

Some guys are better at calling balls and strikes. There is no reason MLB shouldn't have their best balls and strikes umpires behind the plate during all playoff games.

[shysocks]

Some have said TBS's zone is off a bit, but I don't think so. I agree, there were some bad calls. Unless where they have the ball in those zones are off, there were pitches in the zone called balls and way out of the zone called strikes. There were pitches called balls in an AB correctly because they were high, and then a strike called on a pitch that was even higher. They used to assign umpires playoff series based on merit. I do not think that is the case anymore, and while umpiring a MLB game is a lot different than other levels, if you miss by an inch you are a fool for everyone to see, they need to have their most consistent umpiring playoff games. In fact, I would go one further, I think the guys that grade the best behind the plate, IMO especially with replay the most important, should umpire every game behind the plate. No rotation in the playoffs. The WS should have the best balls and strikes umpire calling each game.

http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/playoff...ls-and-strikes/

 

...there’s nothing statistically unusual about this postseason’s umpiring performance. In the playoffs as of Oct. 10, the umps have an accuracy rate of 91.4 percent. Depending on how you feel about robot umps, that kind of accuracy may seem unacceptable, but it’s right in line with the season-long MLB average of 91.6 percent.

Because MLB bases its postseason crew assignments on merit, we might expect the playoff umpires to have a better accuracy rate than the overall regular-season average. But as my Grantland colleague Ben Lindbergh noted last year, since 2009 there’s been essentially no difference in strike-zone accuracy between regular-season and postseason games.4 So although it would be nice if the strike zone were being called more precisely in the playoffs, the umpires’ execution so far is almost exactly what we’d expect based on their performance during the regular season.

[Dick Allen]

http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/playoff...ls-and-strikes/

I'd love to know the stats of the Cubs/Cards guy from last night. He was awful. I didn't see most of the Cubs ABs, but I would imagine he was just as bad for them. And it's not just accuracy, it's consistency. If you are giving everyone 2 inches off the plate, that's fine, just don't be "accurate" and then call the pitch 1 inch off the plate a strike sometimes.

 

I mentioned the Cruz AB. He correctly according to their zone called a pitch high, and then later called a pitch that was even higher, a strike.

[shysocks]

I'd love to know the stats of the Cubs/Cards guy from last night. He was awful. I didn't see most of the Cubs ABs, but I would imagine he was just as bad for them. And it's not just accuracy, it's consistency. If you are giving everyone 2 inches off the plate, that's fine, just don't be "accurate" and then call the pitch 1 inch off the plate a strike sometimes.

 

I mentioned the Cruz AB. He correctly according to their zone called a pitch high, and then later called a pitch that was even higher, a strike.

All true.

 

I think in general, strike zone plots on broadcasts are being applied incorrectly. There's more to it than these plots would make evident. Whether there should be more to it is another topic.

[COACH612]

I don't know whether TBS's zone is accurate or not. From what I saw, the calls were bad. Not really bad though. Just to mention when Lackey was pitching and the K-Zone showed 2 pitches in the exact same spot and one called a ball and one a strike, you know the ump stinks.

[Dick Allen]

I don't know whether TBS's zone is accurate or not. From what I saw, the calls were bad. Not really bad though. Just to mention when Lackey was pitching and the K-Zone showed 2 pitches in the exact same spot and one called a ball and one a strike, you know the ump stinks.

At least last night, I agree. Forget the box, just look at the dots, and a lot of his calls don't make sense.

[COACH612]

At least last night, I agree. Forget the box, just look at the dots, and a lot of his calls don't make sense.

 

 

Agreed

[GGajewski18]

Jeff Passan ‏@JeffPassan 18h18 hours ago

Cards fans complaining about the K zone: Don't. The TBS box is misleading. Mark Carlson has been very good today.

 

 

[Dick Allen]

Jeff Passan ‏@JeffPassan 18h18 hours ago

Cards fans complaining about the K zone: Don't. The TBS box is misleading. Mark Carlson has been very good today.

Passan is full of it. Disregard the box, and look at the dots. His calls were all over the place during the same ABs.

[AlSoxfan]

I've been watching various K zone or other places with similar strike zone boxes. I've seen pitches called a ball when they hit the exact center of the box/strike zone on many occasions. It makes me wonder how far off they are. I can see it if the ball was high/low or on the black but the exact center is confusing. I've also seen the same dot (as you say) being called 2 different calls. When this happens I wonder if it's got anything to do with pitch framing. Maybe one time he hit the glove an the next time the catcher had to move his glove. In any case I've been wondering about these boxes. I tend to believe the umps even though I know they're not perfect. I've been arguing with a few friends about these boxes. They (my friends) want to do away with the umps calling the balls an strikes while I'm a bit old school an think it's part of the game.

[OmarComing25]

The TBS strike zone was way off for all the games I thought but I still don't like the umps. A 10% mistake rate might be normal but I don't think it's acceptable, considering the huge difference between a 1-2 and 2-1 count then those mistakes could easily swing games. Can't wait for robot umps, as it will also eliminate pitch framing, which I'm not a fan of either. We shouldn't be judging players on how well they fool the umpires, that shouldn't be a part of the game.

[Bob Sacamano]

How do robot umps work exactly? How about without adding lots of time to the game?

[Buehrle>Wood]

How do robot umps work exactly? How about without adding lots of time to the game?

Ump behind plate gets balls and strikes on his smart phone and delivers it instantly

[Kalapse]

Passan is full of it. Disregard the box, and look at the dots. His calls were all over the place during the same ABs.

Except TBS's plotting was also quite bad. Pitch F/X shows the true story, aside from a few strikes called balls and an extended plate inside to LHH (very common) Mark Carlson was very good yesterday. Nothing there that jumps out at you.

 

 

The Grimm V Pham AB is the one that really stuck out as bad on the TBS strikezone, there were back to back pitches that showed in identical locations one called a ball the other called a strike. Here's the pitch F/X plot for that AB. It shows the called strike just catching the zone and the called ball missing the zone.

 

[Dick Allen]

Except TBS's plotting was also quite bad. Pitch F/X shows the true story, aside from a few strikes called balls and an extended plate inside to LHH (very common) Mark Carlson was very good yesterday. Nothing there that jumps out at you.

 

 

The Grimm V Pham AB is the one that really stuck out as bad on the TBS strikezone, there were back to back pitches that showed in identical locations one called a ball the other called a strike. Here's the pitch F/X plot for that AB. It shows the called strike just catching the zone and the called ball missing the zone.

 

If the plotting is wrong, than that is another story.