Two poll questions as we enter the offseason

[Kyyle23]

So basically, if someone mentions Alex Gordon as an option for the White Sox and talks about the likelihood of his staying put, they should also have to go to that website as well?

 

It's not a fair question to wonder what he's worth to either the Royals or the White Sox from the perspective of a veteran stopgap in the rotation?

 

But that is not what you did. You randomly brought up the royals and what they are gonna do because you have a 10 second attention span that always circles back to THE ROYALS ARE THE BEST EVER AND EVERYONE MUST RECOGNIZE

 

We know they won the f***ing World Series Caulfield. We know we know we know we know. Stop acting like they are the only team that ever accomplished that feat

[caulfield12]

And we can just as easily look at the same records for the Cubs before Epstein joined the organization and that proves what exactly?

 

Epstein is twice the GM because the Cubs got to the NLCS twice as fast?

 

Looking at those numbers in isolation, you would think it wasn't Allard Baird operating the team for a long stretch under Glass with the smallest amount of resources of any team in baseball.

 

Is the GM of the Dodgers suddenly stupid now because they didn't get to the NLCS with a $300 million payroll and two of the fve best pitchers in baseball whereas in TB he was a genius?

 

All interesting questions, but none of them answer the current problem/s posed by the White Sox roster.

 

[caulfield12]

But that is not what you did. You randomly brought up the royals and what they are gonna do because you have a 10 second attention span that always circles back to THE ROYALS ARE THE BEST EVER AND EVERYONE MUST RECOGNIZE

 

We know they won the f***ing World Series Caulfield. We know we know we know we know. Stop acting like they are the only team that ever accomplished that feat

 

No, someone brought up Chris Young the outfielder and former Sox prospect vs. Chris Young the pitcher.

 

I did the exact same thing with the Twins in the past, or the Tigers. In order to defeat one's enemy, you must know him/her better than you know yourself and study their ways.

 

Maybe the White Sox deliberately remain oblivious to their competition (KW's quotes about the Tigers now being in a better position to compete with the White Sox serving as a sort of template), but I'd like to believe they are more forward thinking than that.

Edited November 6, 2015 by caulfield12

[Jose Abreu]

No, someone brought up Chris Young the outfielder and former Sox prospect vs. Chris Young the pitcher.

Yes, but then you started to analyze Chris Young the pitcher's value and Kris Medlen. It had already been established that we were talking about the OF Chris Young.

[caulfield12]

Because those are two more of the buy low pitching candidates available on the free agent market.

 

Every White Sox fan in the world today would gladly trade six abysmal seasons (2007, 2009, 2011, 2013-2015) for having the best record in the AL over the span of three CONSECUTIVE seasons.

 

As it is, we still won't be close to that latter accomplishment and it will be seven abysmal seasons out of the past ten without a playoff reappearance in sight based on every projection of how 2016 will play out.

Edited November 6, 2015 by caulfield12

[Kyyle23]

Because those are two more of the buy low pitching candidates available on the free agent market.

 

Oh, is that why you led with "if I were the Royals..."

 

Because you know, that totally makes sense that you were examining it as a cross comparison to the white sox when you went on to talk about what the Royals should do in a thread you created about THE WHITE SOX OFFSEASON in a WHITE SOX MESSAGEBOARD.

 

My bad in misunderstanding, here I was thinking you do it all the time

[LDF]

Because those are two more of the buy low pitching candidates available on the free agent market.

 

i can see the sox really needing a sp for the in case scenario.... now whether that be a elite or a pitcher of lesser talent.

 

2 yrs would be great.

 

next yr just in case if danks continue his good results as he put up toward the end of last yr or in case EJ stumbles out of the gate.

 

the other yr would be when Danks contract is up and one of the prospects the sox have is not ready.

[Dick Allen]

No, someone brought up Chris Young the outfielder and former Sox prospect vs. Chris Young the pitcher.

 

I did the exact same thing with the Twins in the past, or the Tigers. In order to defeat one's enemy, you must know him/her better than you know yourself and study their ways.

 

Maybe the White Sox deliberately remain oblivious to their competition (KW's quotes about the Tigers now being in a better position to compete with the White Sox serving as a sort of template), but I'd like to believe they are more forward thinking than that.

KW's quotes about the Tigers being in a better position to compete were made in December of 2007. 2008 AL Central Champions were the White Sox. Turns out he was correct, and even in hindsight, your ripping the White Sox trumps the truth in your mind.

 

 

[caulfield12]

Oh, is that why you led with "if I were the Royals..."

 

Because you know, that totally makes sense that you were examining it as a cross comparison to the white sox when you went on to talk about what the Royals should do in a thread you created about THE WHITE SOX OFFSEASON in a WHITE SOX MESSAGEBOARD.

 

My bad in misunderstanding, here I was thinking you do it all the time

 

And I've said the same exact thing here about the Twins, Indians, Tigers and Cubs as well.

 

"If I were the...."

[caulfield12]

KW's quotes about the Tigers being in a better position to compete were made in December of 2007. 2008 AL Central Champions were the White Sox. Turns out he was correct, and even in hindsight, your ripping the White Sox trumps the truth in your mind.

 

 

But he was also quite wrong, because the addition of Miguel Cabrera (and our inability to counter Maybin/Miller at that time) tipped the balance of power in the AL Central permanently this past decade.

 

We might have won the battle (more like survived) that particular year after Quentin went down, but all that accomplished in retrospect was pushing back the rebuild, subsequently adding Peavy, Rios and Dunn...how was he actually right because 2008 now and the Blackout Game far outweighs getting destroyed by the Rays and also 2011-12-13-14???

 

Okay...KW was right I guess.

Edited November 6, 2015 by caulfield12

[Dick Allen]

Because those are two more of the buy low pitching candidates available on the free agent market.

 

Every White Sox fan in the world today would gladly trade six abysmal seasons (2007, 2009, 2011, 2013-2015) for having the best record in the AL over the span of three CONSECUTIVE seasons.

 

As it is, we still won't be close to that latter accomplishment and it will be seven abysmal seasons out of the past ten without a playoff reappearance in sight based on every projection of how 2016 will play out.

Royals last 3 years 270 wins 1 trophy

 

The dumbass KW and the clueless White Sox from 2004-2006 272 wins and 1 trophy

 

The Royals actually have the worst record in the AL the last 25 years.

[caulfield12]

By that line of reasoning, KW should have a permanent seat as GM/president.

 

It also discounts the incredible helpfulness of playing in two consecutive World Series/es for a fanbase. Those win numbers quoted, not unsurprisingly, don't include the postseason and 11 extra wins that perhaps are just a bit more important than regular season games.

 

Consistent performance. Not part of the Sox history.

 

If we got to the World Series again in 2006, we wouldn't now have to read hundreds of posts blaming White Sox fans for their current situation.

 

We all should appreciate Ozzie, Cooper, Hahn and KW more for their contributions in 2004-2006. Got it.

 

And we should also ignore one of the biggest media markets in the US vs. one of the smallest and compare them as if they should be on equal footing somehow.

Edited November 6, 2015 by caulfield12

[Dick Allen]

By that line of reasoning, KW should have a permanent seat as GM/president.

 

It also discounts the incredible helpfulness of playing in two consecutive World Series/es for a fanbase. Those win numbers quoted, not unsurprisingly, don't include the postseason and 11 extra wins that perhaps are just a bit more important than regular season games.

 

Consistent performance. Not part of the Sox history.

 

If we got to the World Series again in 2006, we wouldn't now have to read hundreds of posts blaming White Sox fans for their current situation.

 

We all should appreciate Ozzie, Cooper, Hahn and KW more for their contributions in 2004-2006. Got it.

 

And we should also ignore one of the biggest media markets in the US vs. one of the smallest and compare them as if they should be on equal footing somehow.

 

Just put the Royals stuff in the proper place Royals boy. Right by the pictures you posted of their parade.

 

It is funny, you weren't telling us teams need to hire a guy from the Braves and the Royals were building a great organization at any time before 2014. 8 years after Moore took the job. Then you hopped on the bandwagon, and they can do no wrong. Why weren't you telling us the White Sox needed to be like the Royals in 2010, 4 years into Moore's tenure?

Edited November 6, 2015 by Dick Allen

[BlackSox13]

i can see the sox really needing a sp for the in case scenario.... now whether that be a elite or a pitcher of lesser talent.

 

2 yrs would be great.

 

next yr just in case if danks continue his good results as he put up toward the end of last yr or in case EJ stumbles out of the gate.

 

the other yr would be when Danks contract is up and one of the prospects the sox have is not ready.

Brandon Beachy could be interesting. Take a chance on a one year guaranteed contract with a second year option. I don't think he would cost much either.

[caulfield12]

Just put the Royals stuff in the proper place Royals boy. Right by the pictures you posted of their parade.

 

It is funny, you weren't telling us teams need to hire a guy from the Braves and the Royals were building a great organization at any time before 2014. 8 years after Moore took the job. Then you hopped on the bandwagon, and they can do no wrong. Why weren't you telling us the White Sox needed to be like the Royals in 2010, 4 years into Moore's tenure?

 

I did tell you Jeff Banister was going to do something good with the Rangers.

 

The real answer is nobody really knew at that time...everything was risked on the Greinke and then Myers/Odorizzi for Shields/Davis trade. Just like the Cubs/Astros now recently, they had the best farm system that time, but so did the White Sox in 2000 when they were cruising to a title and how well did thst work out?

 

Very few of those prospects other than Buehrle had anything to do with 2005, at any rate.

 

 

It took the White Sox until midseason this year to name Nick Hostetler...so while I was a bit late, the White Sox didn't do any better, either.

Edited November 6, 2015 by caulfield12

[LDF]

Brandon Beachy could be interesting. Take a chance on a one year guaranteed contract with a second year option. I don't think he would cost much either.

 

that would be the best option, but i doubt the pitcher would like that.

 

i just saw that lackey was given a QO..... dang.

[caulfield12]

that would be the best option, but i doubt the pitcher would like that.

 

i just saw that lackey was given a QO..... dang.

 

 

Lackey's 2015 is close to Shark's entire career in terms of war and related peripheral numbers.

[BlackSox13]

that would be the best option, but i doubt the pitcher would like that.

 

i just saw that lackey was given a QO..... dang.

Beachy is still working his way back from his second TJ and he didn't pitch all that great for the Dodgers so he can't expect too much in a contract. The Sox are known for keeping their pitchers healthy and a good pitching coach in Cooper so a team like the Sox could be rather enticing to Beachy.

[GGajewski18]

Beachy is still working his way back from his second TJ and he didn't pitch all that great for the Dodgers so he can't expect too much in a contract. The Sox are known for keeping their pitchers healthy and a good pitching coach in Cooper so a team like the Sox could be rather enticing to Beachy.

 

I wanted the Sox to sign Beachy last off season as an insurance policy to any starter that got hurt. I'd love to get him on a minor league deal.

 

From this poll, the only move I chose was Alexei's and the payroll, I chose 130-139 million. JR wants to win, go spend the money on some key free agents.

[caulfield12]

What's the most recent update with Chad Billingsley?

 

Speaking of rehabs, I remember last year Josh Johnson was mentioned a lot (along with Brett Anderson), but seems he's just suffered too many injuries to recover.

[shysocks]

What's the most recent update with Chad Billingsley?

I heard he literally has a fork just protruding from his back.

[Kyyle23]

I heard he literally has a fork just protruding from his back.

 

But are the royals going to offer him a contract?

[southsider2k5]

By that line of reasoning, KW should have a permanent seat as GM/president.

 

It also discounts the incredible helpfulness of playing in two consecutive World Series/es for a fanbase. Those win numbers quoted, not unsurprisingly, don't include the postseason and 11 extra wins that perhaps are just a bit more important than regular season games.

 

Consistent performance. Not part of the Sox history.

 

If we got to the World Series again in 2006, we wouldn't now have to read hundreds of posts blaming White Sox fans for their current situation.

 

We all should appreciate Ozzie, Cooper, Hahn and KW more for their contributions in 2004-2006. Got it.

 

And we should also ignore one of the biggest media markets in the US vs. one of the smallest and compare them as if they should be on equal footing somehow.

 

Except the Sox aren't exclusive in the Chicago market. Divided up at about 2 to 1, the Sox market is probably fairly close to a team like Kansas City which has the great plains to draw from.

[Dick Allen]

I did tell you Jeff Banister was going to do something good with the Rangers.

 

The real answer is nobody really knew at that time...everything was risked on the Greinke and then Myers/Odorizzi for Shields/Davis trade. Just like the Cubs/Astros now recently, they had the best farm system that time, but so did the White Sox in 2000 when they were cruising to a title and how well did thst work out?

 

Very few of those prospects other than Buehrle had anything to do with 2005, at any rate.

 

 

It took the White Sox until midseason this year to name Nick Hostetler...so while I was a bit late, the White Sox didn't do any better, either.

So 6 years into his tenure, with the Royals 134 games below .500 from 2007-2012, even though you weren't posting, you were probably thinking the Royals organization was as inept as you perceive the White Sox organization to be right now.

 

The good news is, KW, RH, and JR should be geniuses in a few years, considering his first 6 years at the helm, he didn't have 1 team win as many games as the 2015 White Sox.

Edited November 6, 2015 by Dick Allen

[caulfield12]

So 6 years into his tenure, with the Royals 134 games below .500 from 2007-2012, even though you weren't posting, you were probably thinking the Royals organization was as inept as you perceive the White Sox organization to be right now.

 

The good news is, KW, RH, and JR should be geniuses in a few years, considering his first 6 years at the helm, he didn't have 1 team win as many games as the 2015 White Sox.

 

Alas, we don't have a Top 5 or Top 10 farm system to draw from despite six (going on seven) abysmal seasons in the past nine.

 

I seem to remember everyone (including Hawk) predicting how good they would be, it just took Hosmer, Moustakas, Cain and Gordon a couple more years than predicted to finally put it all together.

 

How many games under .500 was Epstein at the 3-4 year mark with the Cubs? Was he also inept because of all the losing? The Cubs at least were in the playoffs (twice) within five years of the beginning of his tenure. It wasn't a completely hopeless situation that every fellow GM advised him against the challenge and the very high probability of failure/career suicide.

Edited November 6, 2015 by caulfield12