ChiSoxFanMike Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 Is there a way for one of the mods to unlock the offseason plan thread? I feel like all these proposals would be better in one place. I'm not quite sure why that thread was locked anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whisox05 Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Dec 1, 2015 -> 09:28 PM) Is there a way for one of the mods to unlock the offseason plan thread? I feel like all these proposals would be better in one place. I'm not quite sure why that thread was locked anyway. Because everyone was throwing everything into that thread and I guess people were complaining about have to read through it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSoxFanMike Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 QUOTE (WhiteSoxLifer @ Dec 1, 2015 -> 09:31 PM) Because everyone was throwing everything into that thread and I guess people were complaining about have to read through it I would prefer to read everything in one place but that could just be me. It's not a big deal, I was just wondering how it got closed originally. I enjoyed reading the posts there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gosox41 Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 QUOTE (bruni @ Dec 1, 2015 -> 04:26 PM) Well gang, the Price deal (to me) officially seals the deal: The White Sox CAN NOT trade Q or Sale. There is no possible way to recoup the value that each is in terms of years of control and financial commitment left for the WSox. If I were Sale and Q, I'd be firing my agents for not having the foresight to anticipate the market for pitching. Security when young is one thing, but they cost themselves truckloads of $$. Keep the pitching and keep attempting to build around it. On the flip side, the Sox can get a lot more for these guys in the right trade as the asking price for cost controlled pitching just went up. Everyone is tradeable, especially when you're a team with so many holes. Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Dec 1, 2015 -> 09:28 PM) Is there a way for one of the mods to unlock the offseason plan thread? I feel like all these proposals would be better in one place. I'm not quite sure why that thread was locked anyway. You should ask Chisoxfn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGajewski18 Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 QUOTE (Flash Tizzle @ Dec 1, 2015 -> 06:49 PM) Wait, let's examine this. Their value is sky high........so we're not going to trade them? I hope Hahn is willing to examine any possibility, every scenario, for improving this ballclub. If someone wants to overpay you hand either over immediately. And before the inevitable, " we'll never receive fair value," you base every trade proposal independent of others. What will we receive? How many of our holes are filled? This is why us hardcore fans are the best and worst for trade scenarios. We understand our ballclub more than anyone else, but we're so blinded by fan loyalty and our own biases that we can't remove ourselves and make an impartial evaluation of this team. Unless there's a substantial and unexpected offensive upgrade across the entire team, we won't compete. Now, how can we improve that? Platooning Avila and Flowers is only a small step. Granted, there's time to upgrade and I'm not critizing Hahn (yet) but he's not going to build a playoff team based on FA. Someone needs to go, and more than likely, it's going to be Quintana. QUOTE (LDF @ Dec 1, 2015 -> 07:23 PM) the best case is to move a sp for those pieces to fix the team. esp in getting the rtn of some young pitchers as well. They won't trade them because what team is going to pay the required and deservedly so asking price of both? Sox would not get equal value in trade for either of them because it would cost a ton to get them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2nd_city_saint787 Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 QUOTE (Flash Tizzle @ Dec 1, 2015 -> 08:49 PM) Wait, let's examine this. Their value is sky high........so we're not going to trade them? I hope Hahn is willing to examine any possibility, every scenario, for improving this ballclub. If someone wants to overpay you hand either over immediately. And before the inevitable, " we'll never receive fair value," you base every trade proposal independent of others. What will we receive? How many of our holes are filled? This is why us hardcore fans are the best and worst for trade scenarios. We understand our ballclub more than anyone else, but we're so blinded by fan loyalty and our own biases that we can't remove ourselves and make an impartial evaluation of this team. Unless there's a substantial and unexpected offensive upgrade across the entire team, we won't compete. Now, how can we improve that? Platooning Avila and Flowers is only a small step. Granted, there's time to upgrade and I'm not critizing Hahn (yet) but he's not going to build a playoff team based on FA. Someone needs to go, and more than likely, it's going to be Quintana. This. Only other way I see them turning things around is if they dip into the minors. There's not many guys down there you can trade who will get you what you need. Would you rather A. Trade Q. B. Blow up the minors C. Count on Free Agents? D. Waiting for the Sox to develop some hitters could take awhile so you might as well do A. Trade Q, get your small army of hitters, play for 2017 when you got Sale-Rodon-Fulmer-EJ and either someone like Montas/Adams/Danish/Guerrero/Beck or a veteran SP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Dec 1, 2015 -> 09:24 PM) Besides Q, who else would need to be sent to the Rockies for Arenado? Montas? Honestly, the Price deal may have just boosted Q's value high enough that it could be Q and someone like Beck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OmarComing25 Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Dec 1, 2015 -> 09:46 PM) They won't trade them because what team is going to pay the required and deservedly so asking price of both? Sox would not get equal value in trade for either of them because it would cost a ton to get them. Exactly. The teams that have the pieces to do it I don't see pulling the trigger on a trade for Sale or Q, especially now that the Red Sox would probably be out of those sweepstakes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Dec 1, 2015 -> 09:52 PM) Honestly, the Price deal may have just boosted Q's value high enough that it could be Q and someone like Beck. Why would it effect a deal with the Rockies? They weren't in on Price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 (edited) QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Dec 1, 2015 -> 09:57 PM) Why would it effect a deal with the Rockies? They weren't in on Price. Price's contract just upped the value of Q's contract so any team trading for Q has to up their ante. Edited December 2, 2015 by BlackSox13 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGajewski18 Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Dec 1, 2015 -> 09:57 PM) Why would it effect a deal with the Rockies? They weren't in on Price. They need pitching. Q's value goes up because he now is even cheaper than what aces are going for now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2Jimmy0 Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 I'll guess this happens: Greinke/LAD Cueto/SF Leake/STL Maeda/Arizona Samardzija/Cubs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Dec 1, 2015 -> 10:01 PM) They need pitching. Q's value goes up because he now is even cheaper than what aces are going for now. This. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boopa1219 Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 QUOTE (TheFutureIsNear @ Dec 1, 2015 -> 04:56 PM) Only 2 options I see this team being good in the next year or 2 and sustaining that success into the future 1. Trade 1 of Sale, Q, Rodon 2. JR opens the payroll up to 140+ million And I wouldn't count on option 2... What about making smart baseball decisions, drafting well and good scouting and player development? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2nd_city_saint787 Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 QUOTE (Joshua Strong @ Dec 1, 2015 -> 11:36 PM) What about making smart baseball decisions, drafting well and good scouting and player development? That could take awhile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigHurt3515 Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 QUOTE (Joshua Strong @ Dec 1, 2015 -> 10:36 PM) What about making smart baseball decisions, drafting well and good scouting and player development? You are asking for way too much of the White Sox front office Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Dec 1, 2015 -> 06:36 PM) Can also offer opt-out clauses after years 4, 5, and 6 as well. We'd get lucky and we wouldn't have to pay for his later years (not that he would even be that old on let's say an 8 year deal). You gotta remember though, if he opts out , that means he is more than earning his contract and can find a better deal. If he is injured or under achieving, no way he opts out. The opt out is an advantage for the player, not the team Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenSox Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 (edited) yes, someone like Arenado is how you get fair value on Quintana or Sale (they'd have to throw more in for Sale). Of course, I'm willing to trade Sale for fair value. Quintana looks like someone who can pitch forever, to me. You don't get fair value trading for the much beloved heron career years and declining veterans. And we need to leave our best minor league pitchers alone...trading them is not getting full value. or what about the prospect blocked by Arenado. Do due diligence on him and see if we can get him for EJ or the like. On a side note, Price is worth that contract. He's twice as good as Zimmerman. Edited December 2, 2015 by GreenSox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigsoxhurt35 Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 Oops! I see an Arenado mention... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pettie4sox Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 David Price just got paid... dayum! Did anyone anticipate this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OmarComing25 Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 QUOTE (GreenSox @ Dec 1, 2015 -> 11:26 PM) yes, someone like Arenado is how you get fair value on Quintana or Sale (they'd have to throw more in for Sale). Of course, I'm willing to trade Sale for fair value. Quintana looks like someone who can pitch forever, to me. You don't get fair value trading for the much beloved heron career years and declining veterans. And we need to leave our best minor league pitchers alone...trading them is not getting full value. or what about the prospect blocked by Arenado. Do due diligence on him and see if we can get him for EJ or the like. On a side note, Price is worth that contract. He's twice as good as Zimmerman. You harp on endlessly about "hero worship" yet think Price is worth that contract? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 QUOTE (scs787 @ Dec 2, 2015 -> 03:47 AM) This. Only other way I see them turning things around is if they dip into the minors. There's not many guys down there you can trade who will get you what you need. Would you rather A. Trade Q. B. Blow up the minors C. Count on Free Agents? D. Waiting for the Sox to develop some hitters could take awhile so you might as well do A. Trade Q, get your small army of hitters, play for 2017 when you got Sale-Rodon-Fulmer-EJ and either someone like Montas/Adams/Danish/Guerrero/Beck or a veteran SP. i would say trade Q for that army of players.... not only hitter, but players and hopeful a close to majors catcher. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 QUOTE (scs787 @ Dec 2, 2015 -> 04:38 AM) That could take awhile. agree and the sox do not have a while. i would even go to some of the teams that has comp picks and make a trade for that pick, to hurry the rebuilding of the minor team talent pool.... if only the sox would have over spent on 1 yr of int't draft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Dec 2, 2015 -> 06:06 AM) You harp on endlessly about "hero worship" yet think Price is worth that contract? no offense but i agree with the idea that price is worth his contract. he help shows the fan base including the season ticket holder and the fans with premium seating that they are out for business. we help in more local adv coming in, to the stadium adv, players adv, team logo selling adv, local tv commercial adv, more new corp adv money.... and help with the tv games for out of st fans. plus many more i can't even think. the rtn on the invested money will be a whirl wind. this is why i said and mention signing a Heyward, plus getting an additional sp on the cheap, and 1 very smart and savvy trade to replenish the system, will do wonders for the sox, maybe not like bos. the sox needs a big influx of positive media to do what they can't afford like getting of a Price contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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